Goodbye gaming desktop, hello gaming laptop

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Sat Dec 27, 2014 5:06 pm

Roughly seven years ago, I made the final upgrade to the machine I am running now:

Intel Core2 Quad Q6600 @ 2.4GHz
4GB ram
8800GTS 512
500GB SATA HD

It has served me well, it's doubled as our media server (and will retire as that being it's sole purpose) and ran everything I through at it (at increasingly lower resolutions of course).

On Xmas morning, I bought Assetto Corsa on steam, installed it and then noticed that DirectX 10.1 is a thing apparently. I thing that my 8800GTS 512 cannot do. That was the last straw. A gaming laptop was always in the plans but that plan got moved up today.

Order just placed for the following:

http://www.ncix.com/detail/msi-gt72-dom ... 9-1503.htm

Intel Core i7-4710HQ(4 x 2.5 GHz, 3.5 GHz Turbo, 8HT)
24GB DDR3 RAM
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980M 8GB
256GB SSD RAID (128GB M.2 SATA x 2 in RAID 0) + 1TB HDD
BD-RE

I'm going to guess that performance increase will not be negligible. Here's to 7 years with this beast!

Now if it would just get here already!

Moat_Man · Post by **Moat_Man** » Sat Dec 27, 2014 5:13 pm

Please note that a laptop's lifespan is typically shorter than a desktop. It's roughly half by my experience. So I would only expect ~3-4 years from it.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Sat Dec 27, 2014 5:25 pm

I can understand the appeal of smaller and portable, but surrendering upgradability is a big step. I think I"ll always have a desktop machine for that reason. That said, the specs on that laptop are awesome. 3-4 years is a safe bet. Hell, I keep my low-end Inspirons for that long (although they aren't for gaming).

Daehawk · Post by **Daehawk** » Sat Dec 27, 2014 5:39 pm

Congrats. I would love one of those. But at the same time you could buy 2 fully decked gaming desktops for that

....must be nice though.

dbt1949 · Post by **dbt1949** » Sat Dec 27, 2014 6:13 pm

I've been using laptops as my primary gaming platform for 10-12 years now. I love the convenience. 3-4 years sounds about right for the life expectancy.
A year ago I spent about $1700 for mine. It still plays everything out there at max video settings.

gameoverman · Post by **gameoverman** » Sat Dec 27, 2014 6:33 pm

Kraken wrote:I can understand the appeal of smaller and portable, but surrendering upgradability is a big step. I think I"ll always have a desktop machine for that reason. That said, the specs on that laptop are awesome. 3-4 years is a safe bet. Hell, I keep my low-end Inspirons for that long (although they aren't for gaming).

This is true but in this case upgrades aren't going to happen. Look how long that 8800 was in use. I have at least two friends who, when they buy a computer, use their computer as is when they get it. No upgrades, ever. Nothing wrong with that. In those cases I always recommend buying the fastest thing you can afford now since that's the only way to maximize useful life. I've had good luck with computers lasting forever but I baby my stuff. I have an old Win95 laptop that still fires up, Win95!

Suitably Ironic Moniker · Sat Dec 27, 2014 9:16 pm

I just got a new gaming laptop, but for the past 5 years, I've been using a 17" MacBook Pro dual booting with Windows as my PC, and it has been great. If Apple still made a 17" version, I would have picked up another one. As it is, I'm keeping it for my music storage, along with school and work functions.

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 1:24 am

While I agree with the lack of flexibility in upgradability, I had to be honest with myself that I just don't upgrade the way I used to. I would upgrade my rig every year with one or two parts but it became too time consuming to make sure A with work with B but would C give me a little more and then what if I changed D along with it... It just became this interminable cycle of paralysis by analysis for me. I actually thought of upgrading the rig I have now but I just couldn't muster the strength.

I've wanted the portability for a while now as well as even when I have a computer room to game in, I'd much rather be in the same room as my wife while gaming so we can still interact. The laptop just made more and more sense. I know it's much more than the desktop equivalent but for this purchase, it was the right step.

As for it lasting X number of years, I'll just have to see. Performance wise, I know I am good for at least 5 to 7 years as I just plain don't play the latest games. I'm still playing GTR2 (released in 2006) and I am now getting in Assetto Corsa with my league and that'll be used for god knows how long. Going to get a good aggressive cooling pad for when I'm playing on the couch and treat it well. The rest is up to Gigagod.

I am anxious to get my grubby paws on it!

Moat_Man · Post by **Moat_Man** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 2:36 am

Moat_Man wrote:Please note that a laptop's lifespan is typically shorter than a desktop. It's roughly half by my experience. So I would only expect ~3-4 years from it.

To be clear, the components you have will run software very well for ~ 5-7 years. However laptops tend to physically fail before desktops for two main reasons. First, the heat envelope they operate in is typically higher (there is less airflow for cooling so they run hotter) and second, since they are portable they get knocked around. There is almost a zero chance someone will drop a desktop, but with a family, pets, whatever, laptops can take a beating even when you don't think they will.

The good news is that you still have a decent chance it will last >4 years, just not as great a chance as a desktop that's all.

I don't want to come off like a negative Nelly. I'm just a realist.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 2:38 am

I'm not one to keep evolving the same machine forever, nor am I a hardware geek, but I'm more low-budget. I buy a middling machine and then upgrade parts as necessary. I might upgrade the video card once and add RAM once before the standards change so much that my motherboard can't keep up anymore (IIRC having an AGP video slot doomed my last machine). I usually get 6-8 years out of that approach.

Every time I buy a new desktop machine, I wonder if it will be my last one. If I could afford to just drop $2,500 up front and not think about it again I might do it.

Cortilian · Post by **Cortilian** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 8:31 am

Welcome to the club. I've been using an ASUSG73 for, umm, 4 years now. Still running strong. It does have excellent cooling. Currently playing Elite and Shadow of Mordor on it. Plan on upgrading next year or the year after.

hentzau · Post by **hentzau** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 12:54 pm

My primary machine has been an HP DV7 for over 3 years now. It's a quad core i5 with a 2GB video card and 4GB of memory. I just picked up an SSD drive for it, and need to upgrade the memory to 8GB. I don't do much hardcore gaming on it, but I am really tempted by Elite Dangerous (and I'm right at the minimal specs for it now. It handles Skyrim beautifully. The biggest issue is that any time I really use the video processor, the fan in the machine gets LOUD.

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 2:25 pm

What's with all the general computing threads in EBG this weekend?

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 5:14 pm

First we come for your EBG, then R&P!

gameoverman · Post by **gameoverman** » Mon Dec 29, 2014 12:11 am

I think one reason laptops in general have a shorter life is due to being moved around a lot. Laptops used to be the small, portable computing device, not anymore. Desktop replacement means many of these don't get knocked around at all, they are just too large or heavy. So there's a good chance it'll last quite a while.

Post by **FishPants** » Mon Dec 29, 2014 12:49 am

Shazaam!

Jeff V · Post by **Jeff V** » Mon Dec 29, 2014 2:55 pm

gameoverman wrote:I think one reason laptops in general have a shorter life is due to being moved around a lot. Laptops used to be the small, portable computing device, not anymore. Desktop replacement means many of these don't get knocked around at all, they are just too large or heavy. So there's a good chance it'll last quite a while.

While laptop hard drives might have their life spans limited by mobility, laptops in general, assuming no physical abuse such as busted screens are usually limited for gaming purposes by their inability to upgrade. Where I work, though, we have thousands of 7-8 year old laptops in use -- sometimes we polish the turd by putting in an SSD and adding as much memory as it will hold. Corporate purchasing is not run by intelligent beings, however -- it is far easier to obtain expensive upgrades than it is, say, a refurb machine that is 3-4 years newer and already has the upgrades and costs the same or less than the parts we're sinking into the ancient machine.

When I bought my gaming laptop last year, I looked best overall value. Going max tech on everything is an expensive proposition with laptops and I didn't have the budget to spend $2-4000 on one. I went with i7 processor, 8 GB of RAM (upgrading to 16 is in its future), a 1 TB drive (since replaced by a 512 GB SSD), 17" touch screen (it was not expected to be a very mobile laptop), an Nvidia 760 video card, and various niceties such as a decent webcam and a backlit keyboard. The initial cost was $1100, the delayed upgrades will probably total between $300 and $400 when all is done. Since my gaming needs never require bleeding edge equipment, I fully expect to get at least 5 years out of this thing.

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Tue Dec 30, 2014 4:23 pm

Been reading the massive thread over at notebookreview for this laptop and I'm really getting excited. The new cooling is ridiculous on this thing with the new chassis. People are having trouble getting temps to go to any high temp. The air flow is that good on it. Heat really doesn't look like it's going to be a problem. And the 8 gig card is really futureproofing things.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 11:15 am

I have also decided to take the "gaming laptop" plunge, although based on my gaming history over the past two years, I elected to go with the "budget" version of the laptop you are getting. I went with the MSI GT70 Dominator-895 (there are like 800 other numbers after that, but that is probably enough to identify the base unit).

Specs:
CPU - Intel Core i7-4800MQ
RAM - 8GB DDR3L SDRAM (can expand later)
HD - 1TB 7200 RPM drive (can expand later)
VID - nVidia GeForce GTX870M with 3GB VRAM (contemplated going next level up, but didn't want to spend the money based on my history)
17.3 inch screen

The primary use case of this laptop will be internet usage and I wanted a laptop that I can use around the house to develop on (my desktop is up in my office, but due to kids and dogs on weekend I never sequester myself in my office - so wanted something that I can use anywhere in the house). I would also like to be able to play games on it, and be able to use it for the annual LAN party, without having to dismantle my desktop.

For the $1200 price tag ($1160 after discounts), it looked like it could satisfy my needs quite well. Or at least I hope so.

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 11:36 am

You'll be fine for a while and that's a good price for something that will allow you to game

Congratulations on the purchase! Sure you'll have to turn down the graphics on the latest AAA titles but only a little and I'm going to guess your okay with that. Great purchase.

I think it's the natural progression for the market as gamers get older, they can't or don't want to lock themselves up in a room to game.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 2:49 pm

tjg_marantz wrote:Sure you'll have to turn down the graphics on the latest AAA titles

I don't play games enough anymore to buy the latest AAA titles.

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 2:50 pm

There you go! You're golden!

Hamsterball_Z · Post by **Hamsterball_Z** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 4:16 pm

tjg_marantz wrote:Order just placed for the following:

http://www.ncix.com/detail/msi-gt72-dom ... 9-1503.htm

Intel Core i7-4710HQ(4 x 2.5 GHz, 3.5 GHz Turbo, 8HT)
24GB DDR3 RAM
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980M 8GB
256GB SSD RAID (128GB M.2 SATA x 2 in RAID 0) + 1TB HDD
BD-RE

I'm going to guess that performance increase will not be negligible. Here's to 7 years with this beast!

I just got a Asus G751 last month with pretty much the same specs. That 980M has a crazy amount of power. I haven't found a single thing I can't play at max settings so far.

(Newest game tested is probably FarCry 3.)

I went gaming laptop because I really don't have a place for a desktop right now. My kids have taken over the computer room. That said, it is nice to sit in the recliner with my feet up, computer in my lap and trackball on the armrest and just play anything I want.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Sat Jan 03, 2015 12:24 am

gameoverman wrote:I think one reason laptops in general have a shorter life is due to being moved around a lot.

I have nothing to base this on really, but if you put a gun to my head and asked me why laptops tended to have shorter lifespans, my answer would be simple: heat.

Heat is the enemy of electronics.

Also, the new laptop arrived today. It's enormous.

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Sat Jan 03, 2015 12:52 am

Pics?

Mine shipped today.

As for heat, I'm less and less worried as I keep reading about the gt72 chassis.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Sat Jan 03, 2015 8:44 pm

I don't have any pics...but trust me. It's huge.

And it doesn't matter what they've done inside these laptops. The heat environment is significantly worse than it would be in a desktop.

Edit to add: I should note that the performance is pretty good, I love the keyboard, and the screen is excellent. Thus far it has met or exceeded my expectations.

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Sat Jan 03, 2015 8:46 pm

I'll make sure to post temps during benchmarking to see how it does. It might open some eyes

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Sat Jan 03, 2015 9:01 pm

tjg_marantz wrote:I'll make sure to post temps during benchmarking to see how it does. It might open some eyes

Relative to other laptops? Sure. Relative to what you can do easily and cheaply on a desktop? I'd be shocked. At some point you just can't defeat physics. You put a bunch of heat generating devices in a cramped and enclosed space, and there are issues.

Also keep in mind that I was just speaking generally about why laptops traditionally have shorter lifespans. Not your fancy new beast that breaks the laws of thermodynamics.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:25 am

Just as an FYI, I did some quick tests last night, to determine the efficacy of MSI's "Cooler Boost 2" technology as well as the laptop cooler I got (Cooler Master NotePal 3 I think). If the laptop is just running in normal mode, the GPU was hitting high 50s/low 60s (in C) during gaming (happened to be playing Need for Speed). CPU got into low 70s occasionally.

After enabling the Cooler Boost 2 and laptop cooler, things seemed to be pretty stable at 45C. I was pleased with the 12-15C drop in temps. Although I've been spoiled by my desktop where nothing ever gets out of the 30s.

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Mon Jan 12, 2015 1:05 am

So the Mordor benchmark on Ultra averaged 74.26 fps. Yoinks.

Pyperkub · Post by **Pyperkub** » Mon Jan 12, 2015 2:32 am

tjg_marantz wrote:So the Mordor benchmark on Ultra averaged 74.26 fps. Yoinks.

Did you grab the high res texture pack?

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Mon Jan 12, 2015 7:13 am

No add ons or anything yet. This was just install and bench. I'll check it out.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Mon Jan 12, 2015 3:54 pm

I used the laptop over the weekend at a LAN party and was pleasantly surprised at the performance. Only one game got the GPU temp near 60C (Insurgency I think?). For the most part though, the GPU and CPU were kept around 50C which I feel is pretty awesome for a laptop after a few hours of solid gaming. The Cooler Boost 2 tech that MSI is using definitely drops temps by about 10-15C. I can't argue with that. I also had a laptop cooling pad underneath just in case, although I don't think that would be necessary outside of heavy gaming sessions.

I assume everything is simply a lot better for tjg.

Edit to add: Which is to say that I am very impressed by the MSI laptop, even on the lower end of their gaming laptop range. I can only imagine I would be super impressed on his end of the range.

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Mon Jan 12, 2015 4:01 pm

Mordor, ghost 2, far cry 4. So far no issues and I'm guessing it doesn't get much more intense in what I'm interested in. I'm actually going to backtrack games that I didn't play over the last few years because of my specs before.

But yes. I am pleased to see the least.

First world problem, my hands get cold when playing, keyboard and palm rests are too cold lol

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:09 pm

Arise!

It's been a little over 3 years since I bought the MSI laptop referenced above. Can't say that I wasn't thoroughly pleased with the laptop throughout it's life. I eventually put another 16GB of RAM into it to bring it up to 24GB, and replaced the system drive with a 500GB SSD, and after that, the laptop was outstanding (boots from scratch almost instantly). Performance has never really been an issue.

However. RunningBoy is now almost 17 years old, and has expressed interest in getting a PC. He does most of his gaming on his XBone, but thought that he could get a PC and play with/against me. He also wants to experiment with some programming stuff (he's taking some comp sci classes in high school and wanted the extra practice). After trying to figure out how to shoehorn a desktop into his room, we decided that might not be the best option. The intent was that I would take the time to build myself a new PC, and then give him my old one. But cryptominers have ruined that.

So we talked about a laptop as an option, just for some extra flexibility for him, and then he doesn't need a monitor and that crap. Which really meant a new laptop for me.

After much hemming and hawing, I was looking at three choices: an ASUS ROG 17" behemoth, an Alienware 17R4, and some thin AF gaming laptop (don't remember it, as it got eliminated fairly quickly because of the 14 inch screen). Ended up going with the Alienware. The deets:

CPU - Intel Core i7-7820HK
RAM - 32GB DDR4 SDRAM (2400 MHz)
STORAGE - 256GB SSD / 1TB 7200 RPM HDD
GRAPHICS - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1080 with 8GB GDDR5X
SCREEN - 17.3 inch QHD (2560x1440) 120Hz

The full GTX 1080 vs the 870M performance difference is almost too ridiculous to believe based on comparison benchmarks. I am at a point where I'd like to start gaming again though, and I'd like to have a high end (yet semi-portable) machine to do it with (using a laptop for LAN parties is so much more convenient). My desktop will finally retire to a life of serving media. All other usage will migrate to this new laptop.

Edit to add: One of the draws of going Alienware was at least the potential of using their graphics amplifier in a few years to squeeze out some more performance gains with a newer, desktop graphics card. Don't know if I'd do it, but the potential is there. The CPU/RAM combo is probably enough for me to not need an upgrade for 6+ years (aside from hardware failure). And if that let's me add a graphics card upgrade along the way, that would be nice.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:16 pm

RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:09 pm He also wants to experiment with some programming stuff (he's taking some comp sci classes in high school and wanted the extra practice)

Humble Book Bundle: Functional Programming - $15 for everything

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:39 pm

Appreciate the tip, I've collected several HB book packs in the past. I have a fairly massive collection of programming books (physical and electronic) that he can dig into, as well as a dozen or so Udemy classes that I've collected over the years. Right now he's working in Java, and I've got Java books from here to eternity.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:10 am

The initial verdict is "Whoa". Initial benchmarking has the new laptop several times faster than the MSI. Looks like the largest jump in performance I've had between systems since I started tracking that in 1998.

EvilHomer3k · Post by **EvilHomer3k** » Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:37 pm

Lan parties? Books? What is this 2001?

Congrats on the new system. You won't need that graphics accelerator for quite some time with the 1080.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:32 pm

EvilHomer3k wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2018 12:37 pm Lan parties? Books? What is this 2001?

We're old. And while we could play remotely, it's far more fun to all be in the same room with pork roll, a keg of beer, and 30L of hard liquor.

At least the books are e-books.

And on the 1080, I don't think that I expected it to be quite this much of a jump over what I had. I don't anticipate having to do anything for many, many years (also one of the reasons I intentionally didn't go with a 4K display, but rather the 120Hz 1440p display).