I want to understand FPS vs resolution

[Lorini]

Ok so Forza Horizon 3 is coming out next month. I'm trying to decide if I'll get a better visual experience going with a 27 inch 4K monitor or playing on the Xbox One S (with my 43" 4K TV) which supports 4K as does Forza Horizon 3, noting that the FPS is locked at 30 for the Xbox.

Any help much appreciated!!! The 4K monitor I'm looking buying is this one.

[gameoverman]

I'm a bit confused here, both displays are 4k, and the console is locked at 30fps for this game? So then the only difference is screen size, not fps or resolution.

[Lorini]

I'm a bit confused here, both displays are 4k, and the console is locked at 30fps for this game? So then the only difference is screen size, not fps or resolution.

The PC is not locked at 30 fps though. So does that make it better? Or does the larger screen offset that? I don't really understand how fps actually works, I guess.

[coopasonic]

Does 30FPS bother you? That's the critical question. I don't notice when a game is capped at 30fps, but many people do.

I know the talk about this game made me look at how much it would cost me to upgrade to a 4k projector... holy hell, I guess I am ok with 1080p for a while.

I don't have any 4k displays so the xbox wins with the 106" (or somewhere in that neighborhood, I forget) screen.

[Lorini]

Thanks for that question Coop. I looked at this and realized there is no difference whatsoever that I can see so Xbox One S it is!

[coopasonic]

and thank you for the youtube link. I can definitely see the difference when they are show side by side, but it's not something I would be bothered by in isolation.

[gameoverman]

I'm a bit confused here, both displays are 4k, and the console is locked at 30fps for this game? So then the only difference is screen size, not fps or resolution.

The PC is not locked at 30 fps though. So does that make it better? Or does the larger screen offset that? I don't really understand how fps actually works, I guess.

Oh, I didn't realize a PC was involved, I thought the monitor was going to be used for the console, to free up the tv or something.

Personally, for a racing game i'd want framerate as top priority. This only applies if you can get close to 60fps though. For instance if your computer can do 45fps at 4k and the console gets 30fps at 4k, I'd go with the bigger screen. If it's more like 55fps vs 30fps, I'd go with the higher framerate.

[wonderpug]

Lorini, do you have an AMD or Nvidia graphics card?

[Lorini]

Lorini, do you have an AMD or Nvidia graphics card?

Nvidia 970
Here are my full specs (from Speccy) Note that I'm trying to decide whether to buy the 4K monitor for the PC or buy the Xbox. I won't do both.

Operating System
Windows 10 Home 64-bit
CPU
Intel Core i5 4570 @ 3.20GHz 44 °C
Haswell 22nm Technology
RAM
16.0GB Dual-Channel DDR3 @ 666MHz (9-9-9-24)
Motherboard
MSI B85M-G43 (MS-7823) (SOCKET 0) 35 °C
Graphics
Acer XB240H A— ¿ (1920x1080@60Hz)
ASUS VS247 (1920x1080@60Hz)
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 970 (EVGA) 49 °C
Storage
2328GB Western Digital WDC WD25EZRX-00MMMB0 (SATA) 38 °C
465GB Samsung SSD 840 EVO 500GB (SSD) 37 °C
59GB Lexar USB Flash Drive USB Device (USB)
Optical Drives
No optical disk drives detected
Audio
Realtek High Definition Audio

[wonderpug]

Lorini, do you have an AMD or Nvidia graphics card?

Nvidia 970

I ask because the monitor you linked to has this feature:


The Freesync feature in that monitor is just for AMD cards, whereas G-Sync is the Nvidia equivalent.

What it does is black magic that makes your games look amazingly smooth and tear-free in a way you never dreamed. (My overly simplified understanding is that it syncs your monitor's refresh rate directly to your card, so your monitor only draws a new frame if and when your card has a new one rendered and ready to go.)

I don't have a monitor with it myself, but I'm really really wishing for one. They're just now starting to get into a fathomable price range. From everything I've read, it's one of the biggest upgrades to gaming visuals we've seen in a long time.

If you're going to be buying a new monitor now or in the near future you almost certainly want to be sure to get one with this feature. Forza with G-sync sounds like it'd be fantastic.

[Lorini]

Cheapest gsync monitor with 4K at 27" is this one which is more than I wanted to spend. However I may do it anyway but not right away. Thanks for noting that, I'd rather buy what works with my card.

[Blackhawk]

Thanks for that question Coop. I looked at this and realized there is no difference whatsoever that I can see so Xbox One S it is!

I can see it, too, and can usually tell when a game is capped. The real difference between the two is that the 30FPS is just a bit jittery, especially when turning quickly. If you soften your focus and watch both sides together, you may be able to see that the right side skips a bit when they turn fast. It makes control less precise and feels a bit sluggish to me.

It is kind of like the old issues with refresh rate. Some people had no problem playing at 60Hz, but some people saw distinct flickering when anywhere below 72-80. It is just a difference in eyes.

[gameoverman]

You have a 970, which I'm led to believe is equivalent to a 1060 these days. For 1440p that sounds like enough. But to be honest I'd want to see benchmarks for that game at 4k before i assume a 970 can do better than 30fps at 4k on it. Gsync may help, but then again if you are getting 30-40fps on that kind of monitor it might be smoother than without Gsync, but it's still not 60fps.

[wonderpug]

Cheapest gsync monitor with 4K at 27" is this one which is more than I wanted to spend. However I may do it anyway but not right away. Thanks for noting that, I'd rather buy what works with my card.

I've been watching prices a lot in the past months, and nice G-sync monitors are going down to $450 pretty regularly. Still a bit higher than I'd like, but I'm getting more and more tempted.

[Lorini]

OK so what this article is telling me is that my 970 is not up to 4K for a racing game or maybe any game. That makes the decision easy as I'm not ready to spend on another GPU. At some point next year I'll get a whole new computer and look at this again.

Thanks everyone!!! You really helped clarify my decision.

[cheeba]

There is a big difference between 30 frames per second vs. 60. I would always go with 60 fps over other quality settings, just because it's so much smoother on the eyes.


BUT... it takes some serious muscle to do 4k gaming at 60 fps without turning quality settings way down.

[wonderpug]

It's all subjective, of course, but I bet you'd be more blown away by Forza on a 1440p monitor with 144Hz and G-sync than you would by it on a 4k tv at 30fps.

[gameoverman]

Wouldn't 144hz only make a difference if you could do 60-144fps most of the time? Or am I misunderstanding what Gsync does?

As I understand it, if a 970 tops out at 90fps max on a game, with 40fps as a low, then Gsync keeps it smooth by adapting to that swing in fps. However, if 90fps is the highest you get then a higher refresh rate than 90hz makes no difference. You'd need a card that could hit up to 144fps on that game to take advantage of that monitor.

[wonderpug]

Wouldn't 144hz only make a difference if you could do 60-144fps most of the time? Or am I misunderstanding what Gsync does?

As I understand it, if a 970 tops out at 90fps max on a game, with 40fps as a low, then Gsync keeps it smooth by adapting to that swing in fps. However, if 90fps is the highest you get then a higher refresh rate than 90hz makes no difference. You'd need a card that could hit up to 144fps on that game to take advantage of that monitor.

More fps will be better, but G-sync means your monitor's refresh rate is exactly the same as what your video card is able to output for the game. You're getting 90fps? Congrats, you have a 90Hz monitor. Slowing down to 50fps? Congrats, you have a 50Hz monitor. Maybe getting 90fps for the first half of a turn, but then the sun peaks through the trees and you slow down to 50fps? Your monitor will be 90Hz for the first half, 50Hz for the rest, and any and all other varieties that occurred in between.

The 144Hz also helps out at ~90fps because it means the monitor will be ready to render the next frame the moment it's ready. The monitor is Lucille Ball at the chocolate factory and the video card is spitting out the chocolates. G-sync makes it so Lucy's arm is reaching out perfectly in sync with each new chocolate, regardless of how much the speed of chocolate production varies up and down.

[Blackhawk]

That's a great example, and what I see in capped games all the time. More than once I've started a game, couldn't figure out why my performance was so awful, then realized it wasn't - it was capped at 30 FPS.