What a mess! Can it be fixed?

[Ariana_FFD]

bye

[noxiousdog]

The end.

[$iljanus]

Now who did we hand out nukes to this time?!?

[Ariana_FFD]

bye

[Isgrimnur]

Wow, hitting R&P in the first week, that's bold. Here's hoping that it's not a case of the star burning brightest burning out the fastest.

[Ariana_FFD]

bye

[Kraken]

Thanks for weighing in. I'm going to put you down as a loose canon.

I am not a Prepper, survivalist or fatalist... but...

...

For the 'Long Haul', I also store 6 items that are essential for a healthy, satisfying diet. Every month I buy 2 containers of Salt, 2 containers of Coffee, 4 containers of Sugar, 4 containers of Peanut Butter, 6 containers of Steel Cut Oats, 10 paks of freeze dried Chicken. In the spring/summer i store my dried herbs. I store all of these in vacuum sealed bags in smaller weights. I do this because many of them have a strong trade value. They are mainly light weight, and easy to carry. Plus if need be i have food to help out if there is any if'y situations that occur.

Umm....

[Ariana_FFD]

bye

[Rip]

Oh great another lib.

[Pyperkub]

Also public service should provide for your cost of living based on the COLA, http://www.ssa.gov/oact/COLA/latestCOLA.html and not include lifetime pensions. Cut that and we might just balance the budget! (* )

Ariana

You may want to rethink this, you may get public servants in (area of cheapest cost of living in USA), but not anywhere else (like places where they are needed - e.g. where the most people are NY/LA, etc.). Also, one is supposed to dedicate their life to public service, but not have a retirement plan? Nor anything to account for more specialized functions - e.g. SEC auditor vs DMV janitor? What about say, teaching as a profession? Is one supposed to get really good at that for a short period of time and then move on to something else?

As proposed, it seems to me like a system that will encourage graft and corruption...

As to pensions - when the government negotiated them, defined benefit was the standard retirement plan. Additionally, they are not that complicated - they are merely an annuity of which the costs are pretty much known. The problem is 1) Health care as a part of retirement packages is growing astronomically, and 2) the annuities weren't adequately funded.

Additionally, most are not that big, and the ones that are, tend to be non-union pensions (Administrators) or public safety/prison guards, who are great at getting more money and people by selling fear).

Welcome!

[Zarathud]

If we could only figure a way to get the Chinese to invest in bubble assets like the Japanese did in the 80s with commercial real estate....

[Ariana_FFD]

bye

[Ariana_FFD]

bye

[Rip]

Also public service should provide for your cost of living based on the COLA, http://www.ssa.gov/oact/COLA/latestCOLA.html and not include lifetime pensions. Cut that and we might just balance the budget! (* )

Ariana

You may want to rethink this, you may get public servants in (area of cheapest cost of living in USA), but not anywhere else (like places where they are needed - e.g. where the most people are NY/LA, etc.). Also, one is supposed to dedicate their life to public service, but not have a retirement plan? Nor anything to account for more specialized functions - e.g. SEC auditor vs DMV janitor? What about say, teaching as a profession? Is one supposed to get really good at that for a short period of time and then move on to something else?

As proposed, it seems to me like a system that will encourage graft and corruption...

As to pensions - when the government negotiated them, defined benefit was the standard retirement plan. Additionally, they are not that complicated - they are merely an annuity of which the costs are pretty much known. The problem is 1) Health care as a part of retirement packages is growing astronomically, and 2) the annuities weren't adequately funded.

Additionally, most are not that big, and the ones that are, tend to be non-union pensions (Administrators) or public safety/prison guards, who are great at getting more money and people by selling fear).

Welcome!

My apologies i got knocked off line!

You are referring to an extremely antiquated system of rules that needs severe reform on the government end, and also on the corporate end too. The average work year for a Congressman is 52.6% http://www.spillingbuckets.com/2010/10/ ... -work.html and for a Senator it is hard to find that statistic!

What I am speaking to is the "entitled" getting richer at the expense of the general person who works many years to earn their pensions, that sadly are just plain disappearing, while those i speak of get theirs no matter what.

If only people like Teachers or a Janitor, could get their pension guaranteed! More and more these pensions are falling victim to State or County budget cuts! Or dare i say look at the whole Wall St collapse and how many lost their pensions, IRA's and other retirement provisions.

While you right in that these pensions were negotiated long ago. Does that make it a fair negotiation now? Many "average" citizens were either asked or forced to lose their pensions, while the goats in government are guaranteed that theirs will always be safe. you really think that is fair? If the average man/woman is asked to sacrifice their cost of living increases, and often have their hours cut, while working very hard to help society and try to maintain the "American Dream" for themselves or their children. Those i government who are at best mostly hacks do not works nearly as long, and complain when asked to do so, get paid nearly 4 times the average middle class salary. Well i am sorry i have no sympathy or see no justification for a lifetime pension of appx 80% of their salary after 4 years in term.

"As proposed, it seems to me like a system that will encourage graft and corruption... "
You seriously say this! While it is not openly said, it still is pretty obvious who is on the better end of this stick.

Nice to meet you too!

Ariana

Political offices get abused a lot around here. There are elected/appointed officials I hear about regularly collect three or more retirements for hundreds of thousands.

We like to call it the good ol boy network.

[$iljanus]

edited out to get to the part that interests me

While you right in that these pensions were negotiated long ago. Does that make it a fair negotiation now? Many "average" citizens were either asked or forced to lose their pensions, while the goats in government are guaranteed that theirs will always be safe. you really think that is fair? If the average man/woman is asked to sacrifice their cost of living increases, and often have their hours cut, while working very hard to help society and try to maintain the "American Dream" for themselves or their children. Those i government who are at best mostly hacks do not works nearly as long, and complain when asked to do so, get paid nearly 4 times the average middle class salary. Well i am sorry i have no sympathy or see no justification for a lifetime pension of appx 80% of their salary after 4 years in term.

"As proposed, it seems to me like a system that will encourage graft and corruption... "
You seriously say this! While it is not openly said, it still is pretty obvious who is on the better end of this stick.

Nice to meet you too!

Ariana

Wiki link to Congressional pension system in the USA

Some interesting factoids from said article:

Congressional pension is a pension made available to members of the United States Congress. Members who participated in the congressional pension system are vested after five (5) years of service. A full pension is available to Members 62 years of age with 5 years of service; 50 years or older with 20 years of service; or 25 years of service at any age. A reduced pension is available depending upon which of several different age/service options is chosen. If Members leave Congress before reaching retirement age, they may leave their contributions behind and receive a deferred pension late

And here's the bit about actual amts involved in Fed Congressional pension calculations:

The pension amount is determined by a formula that takes into account the years served and the average pay for the top three years in terms of payment. In 2002, the average pension payment ranged from $41,000 to $55,000. For example, a member of Congress who worked for 22 years and had a top three-year average salary of $153,900 would be eligible for a pension payment of $84,645 per year.[3] (A sitting Congressman with 22 years service in 2011 entered Congress in 1989. As such they are under the FERS retirement program. While the high three concept is correct the totals are wrong. Such a Congressman receives their High 3 (153900) times 1.7%, Times years of service (up to 20) then 1% after that.. That is $153,900x.017x20 = $2,613.30 x 20 = $52,326 plus $3,078. for a total of $55,440 Plus a reduced SS pension.

Not quite 80% of income, which is probably why Congressmen/Senators go for those juicy lobbying firm jobs!

I assume that when you are refer to the "government hacks" it's in reference to folks in congress only or did you mean most folks in the Fed gov in general?

[Pyperkub]

Also public service should provide for your cost of living based on the COLA, http://www.ssa.gov/oact/COLA/latestCOLA.html and not include lifetime pensions. Cut that and we might just balance the budget! (* )

Ariana

You may want to rethink this, you may get public servants in (area of cheapest cost of living in USA), but not anywhere else (like places where they are needed - e.g. where the most people are NY/LA, etc.). Also, one is supposed to dedicate their life to public service, but not have a retirement plan? Nor anything to account for more specialized functions - e.g. SEC auditor vs DMV janitor? What about say, teaching as a profession? Is one supposed to get really good at that for a short period of time and then move on to something else?

As proposed, it seems to me like a system that will encourage graft and corruption...

As to pensions - when the government negotiated them, defined benefit was the standard retirement plan. Additionally, they are not that complicated - they are merely an annuity of which the costs are pretty much known. The problem is 1) Health care as a part of retirement packages is growing astronomically, and 2) the annuities weren't adequately funded.

Additionally, most are not that big, and the ones that are, tend to be non-union pensions (Administrators) or public safety/prison guards, who are great at getting more money and people by selling fear).

Welcome!

My apologies i got knocked off line!

You are referring to an extremely antiquated system of rules that needs severe reform on the government end, and also on the corporate end too. The average work year for a Congressman is 52.6% http://www.spillingbuckets.com/2010/10/ ... -work.html and for a Senator it is hard to find that statistic!

What I am speaking to is the "entitled" getting richer at the expense of the general person who works many years to earn their pensions, that sadly are just plain disappearing, while those i speak of get theirs no matter what.

If only people like Teachers or a Janitor, could get their pension guaranteed! More and more these pensions are falling victim to State or County budget cuts! Or dare i say look at the whole Wall St collapse and how many lost their pensions, IRA's and other retirement provisions.

While you right in that these pensions were negotiated long ago. Does that make it a fair negotiation now? Many "average" citizens were either asked or forced to lose their pensions, while the goats in government are guaranteed that theirs will always be safe. you really think that is fair? If the average man/woman is asked to sacrifice their cost of living increases, and often have their hours cut, while working very hard to help society and try to maintain the "American Dream" for themselves or their children. Those i government who are at best mostly hacks do not works nearly as long, and complain when asked to do so, get paid nearly 4 times the average middle class salary. Well i am sorry i have no sympathy or see no justification for a lifetime pension of appx 80% of their salary after 4 years in term.

"As proposed, it seems to me like a system that will encourage graft and corruption... "
You seriously say this! While it is not openly said, it still is pretty obvious who is on the better end of this stick.

Nice to meet you too!

Ariana

As a Public Employee (State - at a University), I see a big difference between elected representative pensions and Public Service pensions in general.

However, there need to be some benefits and pay to Elected Public Service, or you'll get what you pay for (and right now, we do... but we're not the ones really paying cough*superPAC*cough).

[Ariana_FFD]

bye

[$iljanus]

The pension stats I quoted were in response to the 80% of salary you mentioned. The lobbying was a sly reference to the big $$$ prize that many politicians claim after "serving" ;-) the people...

-Yeah this is sent through that Tapatalk thing.

[Ariana_FFD]

bye

[Kraken]

If we could only figure a way to get the Chinese to invest in bubble assets like the Japanese did in the 80s with commercial real estate....

...because the world would be so much better off without China's economic powerhouse.

[Ariana_FFD]

bye

[Pyperkub]

China will be very interesting in the next couple of decades. How does a communist country continue to reconcile exploiting their citizens for capitalist gain?

Epic 4g/Tapatalk

[SpaceLord]

No i am not a socialist, but some aspects are very good. Schools. Everyone goes. College everyone who wants to has a free education. If you cannot make it on a higher academic level free trade schools. Builds our future in a solid, healthy way. Who pays? New tax structure. How to tax? Flat tax of say 15% plus a small consumption tax of maybe the same amount. Across the board. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumption_tax plus http://www.investopedia.com/articles/ec ... z1oN4YJt7F

Ariana

I'm not ranting at you, but the "socialist" canard is bullshit. A government, by its very nature, is a socialist structure. You can't have roads, clean water, a national army, or thousands of other things without socialism. If you don't believe the government should provide any of these services, then you're not a "socialist." Otherwise, you're a dirty hypocrite.

[msduncan]

Ahhh... politics! Here is my bitch, if you are smart and want to help improve the US/world, you are not likely to get elected, and if you do you have to fight the majority rule of stupidity to only fail at passing intelligent, and often critical, legislation. It should be required that everyone try to serve in a public service capacity once in their lifetime at least. Also public service should provide for your cost of living based on the COLA, http://www.ssa.gov/oact/COLA/latestCOLA.html and not include lifetime pensions. Cut that and we might just balance the budget! (* )

I'm assuming you meant providing for cost of living to people while they are serving the public? Similar to the military?

Pull out of all foreign wars because it is their problem. No matter the reason, we cannot sway a cultures more's over to democracy as long as their religion is more powerful in their minds then consumption. When you way into a region where the mindset of cultural/religious wars have lasted over thousands of years literally. You cannot win! You may think you gain a foot hold, but it is only an illusion. Every cherry picked dictator we have set up has turned on us! Guess that just doesn't work. Stop handing out nukes to everyone!

I agree with pulling back to some degree, but this was never about seeding democracy. We must maintain a toehold and involvement in some places throughout the world to protect our national interests. Oil. Resources. Strategic partners such as Israel. We can't repeat the mistakes of the past and set up a scenario where we allow the world to flame into another WW2.

Start fixing our infrastructure before it has a total collapse beyond recovery. It will create jobs and give strength back to our country. Projected collapse is less then a decade away according to some. http://www.epi.org/blog/americas-infras ... dges-jobs/

I don't disagree with you here. Bridges in particular are in terrible shape nation wide.

Stop bailing out other nations and fix our own financial money pit. China owns most of our shipping, banking and properties. Best to get that debt paid of and not be indentured to a foreign power. http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_much_fore ... _give_away and see http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog ... erica-debt

Again I can't disagree. We should also consider returning to some sort of solid backing to our currency. Printing meaningless money is going to ultimately result in hyperinflation.

No i am not a socialist, but some aspects are very good. Schools. Everyone goes. College everyone who wants to has a free education. If you cannot make it on a higher academic level free trade schools. Builds our future in a solid, healthy way. Who pays? New tax structure. How to tax? Flat tax of say 15% plus a small consumption tax of maybe the same amount. Across the board. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumption_tax plus http://www.investopedia.com/articles/ec ... z1oN4YJt7F

I'm not sure about this one. We provide people with basic education and allow people the opportunity to advance themselves if they choose. Georgia has it right I think.... a lottery that funds the Hope Scholarship that allows kids with good grades to get a free ride in college.

New tax structure? However, the amount you mentioned is too high and also opens the door WIDE for politicians to start raising them to astronomical levels both by raising the sales tax and also the income tax. Would eventually be crushing and intolerable. I suggest the Fair Tax as an alternative to what you linked. http://www.fairtax.org

Global Warming... come on. Who says it does not exist? Either caused by carbon emissions or natural climate change it is a fact. How to fix it? Wake Up! Just start taking real steps. Public transit, solar, wind, cane ethanol! But stop debating and start seeing the reality. http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... ures-clock

I do not subscribe to the church of man-made global warming. Let's pretend for a second that everything you mentioned is true: China is NOT taking steps to change anything. The US could go 100% green and China will still drive us over the cliff. What would we have accomplished? Putting ourselves at a severe economic disadvantage to developing nations and China....thus accelerating their growth and dramatically increasing the amount of gasses they belch into the atmosphere.

Make little changes, create your own gardens to supplement your shopping. Buy from co-ops and farmers markets. Shop in a group, and divide the purchases, to help ease the cost of buying small amounts. Bulk groceries are cheaper. partner up with a neighbor! http://www.engineeringchallenges.org/cms/7126/7356.aspx

I guess in short the less is more standard is my mantra. I have a garden that produces Sweet potatoes, Red potatoes, Snow peas, all types of Herbs, and Cabbage. This is my staple garden.

Do you have a 'Bug Out' pantry?

For the 'Long Haul', I also store 6 items that are essential for a healthy, satisfying diet. Every month I buy 2 containers of Salt, 2 containers of Coffee, 4 containers of Sugar, 4 containers of Peanut Butter, 6 containers of Steel Cut Oats, 10 paks of freeze dried Chicken. In the spring/summer i store my dried herbs. I store all of these in vacuum sealed bags in smaller weights. I do this because many of them have a strong trade value. They are mainly light weight, and easy to carry. Plus if need be i have food to help out if there is any if'y situations that occur.

Ariana

[/quote]

Pro Tip: You need some means of protecting your stash. Honey keeps on shelves forever without going bad. Canning can preserve veggies, fruits, and even meats for years.

[mike]

Good God some of you guys are really stooooopid.

[Little Raven]

How does a communist country continue to reconcile exploiting their citizens for capitalist gain?

China is not communist. They left that behind decades ago. China is now fiercely capitalistic, although it's still a very authoritarian country - it's probably closer to the traditional definition of fascism than anything else.

[Rip]

:pop:

Good God some of you guys are really stooooopid.

Says the guy who drives a Miata!

[msduncan]

:pop:

Good God some of you guys are really stooooopid.

Says the guy who drives a Miata!

[Ariana_FFD]

bye