[trailer] John Carter

[GreenGoo]

I read A Princess of Mars when this thread originally popped up to see what this was about, and I've held off on posting my thoughts. Let's just say that I came to the conclusion that this book would be much more appealing if I read it when I was a kid. It didn't leave me wanting to go see the movie.

Heh, yeah. Ditto. Although I didn't hate it. Keeping in mind it was pulp even back then, and keeping a retro mentality, it was still iffy in places. There is better pulp from that time.

It won't keep me from seeing John Carter on dvd though.

[GreenGoo]

I heard today that Disney expects now to lose $200m on John Carter.

I remember when Terminator 2 topped $100 million and people nearly had a coronary over that. Of course that doesn't include marketing costs while the $200 mil loss for John Carter almost certainly does.

[Jag]

I read A Princess of Mars when this thread originally popped up to see what this was about, and I've held off on posting my thoughts. Let's just say that I came to the conclusion that this book would be much more appealing if I read it when I was a kid. It didn't leave me wanting to go see the movie.

Heh, yeah. Ditto. Although I didn't hate it. Keeping in mind it was pulp even back then, and keeping a retro mentality, it was still iffy in places. There is better pulp from that time.

It won't keep me from seeing John Carter on dvd though.

I'm on Book 3 now and still enjoying it somewhat, but I think i'm done after this. I went into the books excepting a pulpy Conan-like adventure, which it is. It did make me want to see the movie, although I could have waited for DVD too.

[hentzau]

I read A Princess of Mars when this thread originally popped up to see what this was about, and I've held off on posting my thoughts. Let's just say that I came to the conclusion that this book would be much more appealing if I read it when I was a kid. It didn't leave me wanting to go see the movie.

Heh, yeah. Ditto. Although I didn't hate it. Keeping in mind it was pulp even back then, and keeping a retro mentality, it was still iffy in places. There is better pulp from that time.

It won't keep me from seeing John Carter on dvd though.

I'm on Book 3 now and still enjoying it somewhat, but I think i'm done after this. I went into the books excepting a pulpy Conan-like adventure, which it is. It did make me want to see the movie, although I could have waited for DVD too.

They get even more uneven after book 3, so that's a good stopping point.

[Odin]

I read A Princess of Mars when this thread originally popped up to see what this was about, and I've held off on posting my thoughts. Let's just say that I came to the conclusion that this book would be much more appealing if I read it when I was a kid. It didn't leave me wanting to go see the movie.

Heh, yeah. Ditto. Although I didn't hate it. Keeping in mind it was pulp even back then, and keeping a retro mentality, it was still iffy in places. There is better pulp from that time.

It won't keep me from seeing John Carter on dvd though.

I'm on Book 3 now and still enjoying it somewhat, but I think i'm done after this. I went into the books excepting a pulpy Conan-like adventure, which it is. It did make me want to see the movie, although I could have waited for DVD too.

I bought a compilation of the first three novels, so that's all I read. I wouldn't be opposed to reading more, but they didn't leave me with an intense burning desire to go out and buy more of the series.

[GreenGoo]

Now that the Honor Harrington thread has pointed out that some of those books are available for free, I suspect it will be a long while before I get to Book 2 of John Carter's legacy. If ever.

You know what could have saved A Princess of Mars? Sex. I don't normally give 2 craps about sex in my fiction, but if they had thrown in some B grade sexifying it probably would have helped it a bit. At least some Parental Guidance type stuff.

[Jag]

I read A Princess of Mars when this thread originally popped up to see what this was about, and I've held off on posting my thoughts. Let's just say that I came to the conclusion that this book would be much more appealing if I read it when I was a kid. It didn't leave me wanting to go see the movie.

Heh, yeah. Ditto. Although I didn't hate it. Keeping in mind it was pulp even back then, and keeping a retro mentality, it was still iffy in places. There is better pulp from that time.

It won't keep me from seeing John Carter on dvd though.

I'm on Book 3 now and still enjoying it somewhat, but I think i'm done after this. I went into the books excepting a pulpy Conan-like adventure, which it is. It did make me want to see the movie, although I could have waited for DVD too.

I bought a compilation of the first three novels, so that's all I read. I wouldn't be opposed to reading more, but they didn't leave me with an intense burning desire to go out and buy more of the series.

Well, you really don't have to buy them since they are free...

http://gutenberg.net.au/sfproject.html

[ImLawBoy]

Now that the Honor Harrington thread has pointed out that some of those books are available for free, I suspect it will be a long while before I get to Book 2 of John Carter's legacy. If ever.

You know what could have saved A Princess of Mars? Sex. I don't normally give 2 craps about sex in my fiction, but if they had thrown in some B grade sexifying it probably would have helped it a bit. At least some Parental Guidance type stuff.

Then my younger self would have really loved them!

[Odin]

Well, you really don't have to buy them since they are free...

http://gutenberg.net.au/sfproject.html

The words are free. The paper and binding cost money.

[hepcat]

Well, you really don't have to buy them since they are free...

http://gutenberg.net.au/sfproject.html

The words are free. The paper and binding cost money.

You'll have to excuse Odin. He was cryogenically frozen in the year 1937. He's not up to speed on this whole "digital" thing.

[Jag]

You'd think a guy with a blog named "Virtual Vellum" would have figured it out by now!

[hentzau]

Yeah, but with John Carter, I actually prefer it in old, slightly weird smelling books that spent way too much time in my in-laws basement.

[Rip]

Yeah, but with John Carter, I actually prefer it in old, slightly weird smelling books that spent way too much time in my in-laws basement.

Right next to the Cheetos and hand lotion?

[Scuzz]

I heard today that Disney expects now to lose $200m on John Carter.

I remember when Terminator 2 topped $100 million and people nearly had a coronary over that. Of course that doesn't include marketing costs while the $200 mil loss for John Carter almost certainly does.

The radio report this morning said John Carter was $240m to make and had a $100m marketing budget. What a waste of $100m.

[theohall]

I heard today that Disney expects now to lose $200m on John Carter.

I remember when Terminator 2 topped $100 million and people nearly had a coronary over that. Of course that doesn't include marketing costs while the $200 mil loss for John Carter almost certainly does.

The radio report this morning said John Carter was $240m to make and had a $100m marketing budget. What a waste of $100m.

With so much CGI, why $240M to make?

[AWS260]

I heard today that Disney expects now to lose $200m on John Carter.

I remember when Terminator 2 topped $100 million and people nearly had a coronary over that. Of course that doesn't include marketing costs while the $200 mil loss for John Carter almost certainly does.

The radio report this morning said John Carter was $240m to make and had a $100m marketing budget. What a waste of $100m.

With so much CGI, why $240M to make?

Because CGI is expensive? I don't know anything about the industry, but it seems to me that CGI-heavy films generally have big ol' budgets.

[GreenGoo]

Because CGI is expensive? I don't know anything about the industry, but it seems to me that CGI-heavy films generally have big ol' budgets.

They used to, and bleeding edge CGI is still expensive, but overall it seems like CGI is the cheap way out these days. On location filming is much more expensive than a few nerds in front of a workstation these days.

[Peoux]

Incidentally, Project Gutenberg reports Princess of Mars as their #1 most downloaded book for March 20th with 1301 downloads!

The link is to a dynamic page showing the top 100 downloads of the last day, not specifically March 20th, but uhmm yeah.

[Zurai]

I'd take any income/cost numbers out of Hollywood with an oil tanker full of salt. According to Hollywood, only a handful of movies have ever made a profit. See: Hollywood Accounting. A choice quote: "Winston Groom's price for the screenplay rights to his novel Forrest Gump included a share of the profits; however, due to Hollywood accounting, the film's commercial success was converted into a net loss, and Groom received nothing."

[sgoldj]

I haven't seen the John Carter movie yet and will probably rent the disc. But I agree that the Barsoom, Pelucidar, Carson books worked best my first reading in the 8th grade. I also think that Tarzan stories had a different feel to them, more varied. I certainly loved the fact that Tarzan really grew up (the way I remember it) by some sort of tribe that was between ape and man ( mangani?). Gorillas were different, as were lower primates and monkeys.

I'd love a new story set on Barsoom or Pelucidar.

[Odin]

I'd take any income/cost numbers out of Hollywood with an oil tanker full of salt. According to Hollywood, only a handful of movies have ever made a profit. See: Hollywood Accounting. A choice quote: "Winston Groom's price for the screenplay rights to his novel Forrest Gump included a share of the profits; however, due to Hollywood accounting, the film's commercial success was converted into a net loss, and Groom received nothing."

J. Michael Straczynski (of Babylon 5) has talked about this quite a bit over the years. It's all a big sham.

[GreenGoo]

J. Michael Straczynski (of Babylon 5) has talked about this quite a bit over the years. It's all a big sham.

Which part? Accounting in Hollywood or Hollywood accounting?

How's that for confusing?

What I mean is, does he agree or disagree that Hollywood Accounting (in the, nothing has ever made any money, ever context) exists?

[Zurai]

He very much agrees that it exists. Babylon 5 has made over a billion in revenue, but Hollywood claims it's actually still in debt to them. From the link:

Hollywood accounting is not limited to movies. An example is the Warner Bros. television series Babylon 5 created by J. Michael Straczynski. Straczynski, who wrote 90% of the episodes in addition to producing the show, would receive a generous cut of profits if not for Hollywood accounting. The series, which was profitable in each of its five seasons from 1993–1998, has garnered more than US$1 billion for Warner Bros., most recently US$500 million in DVD sales alone. But in the last profit statement given to Straczynski, Warner Bros. claimed the property was $80 million in debt. "Basically", says Straczynski, "by the terms of my contract, if a set on a WB movie burns down in Botswana, they can charge it against B5's profits."

[GreenGoo]

Thanks for the clarification.

[Ariana_FFD]

I'm collecting 'essential' classic movies for my son who's 11. Unfortunately they all seem to be rated R, so the conversation goes like this:

"Can I watch this one?"
"No"
"This one?"
"No"
"This one??"
"No."

He's a big sci-fi/fantasy fan and he liked JC but said he found the whole Mars and Earth segments confusing.

Soylent Green. One of the best adaptions!

[Ariana_FFD]

Is your grudge against Film not faithfully following Book?

I found the film Visually Appealing, the CGI effects were not a jarring jolt to the senses, and it was a Blast.

If you are looking for great depth of any character, ok, you will likely be disappointed. But as SCIFI ACTION FLIX, I loved it. Which is what I went to see.

It's like going to see Captain America or Iron Man or Thor (which we did) and somehow expecting YEARS of character development (which you get in the comics) crammed into the fifteen minutes of exposition amongst the two hours of fists and bolts a-flyin'.

Each time we saw a Superhero movie (xmen to ff to hellboy), and Carbon Unit Designated "Wife" noticed I had Comix of any of them, she would ask how it compared.

And honestly, if you read something with Years of backstory, you had better be ready to accept an alternate or stop going to movies (hell, even shortterm, WATCHMEN, I am looking at you)

Visually appealing does not satisfy the mind! Which is what real SF readers are looking for.

[Ariana_FFD]

It is kinda weird to me that Avatar made bajillions of dollars, and this movie is not doing well at all. Avatar had a very simple, smack you on the head with its eco-message. I admit, there isn't much of a plot to John Carter other than "Where am I and how do I get home?" But I want to see John Carter again, and sequels to it. Whereas I do not feel the same about Avatar.

I actually liked the aliens in John Carter. I didn't really care one way or the other about the blue cat people. The folks at work refuse to see JC because it "looks dumb" and is a ripoff of Avatar. They don't seem to understand the words coming out of my mouth when I tell them that Avatar is the ripoff.

Oh well. Just one more piece of evidence that I am out of touch with the rest of the planet. And sometimes it makes me feel much better that I am.

Avatar rocked. Simple message... yes. But the beauty of the message sang through. The visuals were stunning. The N'avi were intriguing, and the concept of avatars is cutting edge future concepts for man, where you can change your appearance by slipping on a new avatar body! Very cool. At least though the message is repeated from many other classics, it is an important message that man must learn or perish because of his inabillity to see the truth of things.

[Zarathud]

I just read that John Carter star Taylor Kitsch is also in Battleship.

What idiot is this guy's agent? If John Carter didn't kill his career, the second catastrophic box office bomb in one year will. Battleship has fail written all over.

[hepcat]

I highly doubt his agent thought John Carter was going to bomb. As for battleship, it may suck but that doesn't automatically equal box office bomb. See Transformers for further examples.

[SlapBone]

What idiot is this guy's agent?

The idiot that got him in a movie with Liam Neeson

[Pyperkub]

I'm collecting 'essential' classic movies for my son who's 11. Unfortunately they all seem to be rated R, so the conversation goes like this:

"Can I watch this one?"
"No"
"This one?"
"No"
"This one??"
"No."

He's a big sci-fi/fantasy fan and he liked JC but said he found the whole Mars and Earth segments confusing.

Classic SF:
Invasion of the Body Snatchers 1st or 2nd
The Thing (from another world)
Forbidden Planet
Star Wars
Star Trek 2
Planet of the Apes


Epic 4g/Tapatalk

[Jaymon]

How old does a movie have to be before its considered classic?

[RuperT]

Haven't seen it yet, but I'm glad to hear some of you enjoyed it (I'm hoping for stygian canals and weird science, but barely). A decent movie that flopped is better than ERB might've fared.
It is funny to consider how much Lucas borrowed. I'd never thought about it.

[Jag]

Haven't seen it yet, but I'm glad to hear some of you enjoyed it (I'm hoping for stygian canals and weird science, but barely). A decent movie that flopped is better than ERB might've fared.
It is funny to consider how much Lucas borrowed. I'd never thought about it.

Did Lucas borrow from JC? I always thought his movies had roots in the "Hero" mythology dating back to greek times, which may also be where ERB also drew inspiration.

[GreenGoo]

How old does a movie have to be before its considered classic?

It just has to be good in some way.

"Instant Classic".

[theohall]

Haven't seen it yet, but I'm glad to hear some of you enjoyed it (I'm hoping for stygian canals and weird science, but barely). A decent movie that flopped is better than ERB might've fared.
It is funny to consider how much Lucas borrowed. I'd never thought about it.

Did Lucas borrow from JC? I always thought his movies had roots in the "Hero" mythology dating back to greek times, which may also be where ERB also drew inspiration.

He most definitely borrowed. Ships that hover and are basically flat platforms - from ERB. Princess Leia chained to Jabba the Hut in whatever outfit she is wearing is very similar to a cover of Princess of Mars where she is chained to a rock wearing the revealing outfit (top left in picture below). Yes. Lucas borrowed heavily from ERB.

[Default]

What this movie lacked was Doug McClure. And rubber hand puppet monsters.





You'd aaaalllllll talk out of the other side of your mouth then!

[hepcat]

Haven't seen it yet, but I'm glad to hear some of you enjoyed it (I'm hoping for stygian canals and weird science, but barely). A decent movie that flopped is better than ERB might've fared.
It is funny to consider how much Lucas borrowed. I'd never thought about it.

I don't think there's any definite time. hence the term "instant classic" when referring to some really great current films. Although if the producers/studio of the film in question are the ones calling it an instant classic, I'm not sure I would buy into it.

[Ariana_FFD]

Just popped in to see what has happened here. Still have not seen the movie. Lost interest after talking to several friends who did go. Said the acting was real bad. *sigh I had hopes, now I'll wait for RedBox. When you have great authors, it just doesn't guarantee great movie adaptions. Plus unfortunately sci-fi is just not a respected genre for most industry people. The thought of expanding on a theme and going for quality acting and sets is like a mind block, they think sci-fi, low end audience, low end efforts. So when people say that Avatar was predictable, at least they made the effort to have better scripting dialog and explaination of the issues. Predictable? Of course, but beautiful creatures and execution.

Missed ya!
Ariana

[Odin]

I might have taken the kids to see this during spring break next week, but it's not even in the theaters anymore. Hopefully it'll come to the cheap second-run theater and we can see it there sometime. They're showing Journey 2: Mysterious Island next week, so we'll probably hit that up. Not much else playing next week to take the kids to, really. Unless we want to see Hunger Games a second time.