Reemul wrote:Following this thread was interest but as an outsider felt I couldn't really comment. One thing though is being from the UK it's amazing how different it seems the Amercians are from us English people, from killing people to owning guns to the anger and outrage and so one.
While we may speak the same language it seems in many ways we just aren't the same. It makes me sad to see this whole issue happening and how we as humans are developing and becoming.
You do realize that one of the main reasons guns are so engrained in our culture is that we needed them to get your nation's boot off our throat, don't you? As for how "we as humans are developing and becoming" you should probably do some light reading into the history of man. We are beasts. Look at the bloody eagle the Norsemen used to make out of their enemies. The beheadings in the Middle East. Genocidal wars in Africa and the Baltics. There is a sadly almost unending list of the barbarity of man versus man.
For cryin' out loud, your street rioting incident is less than a year old. The UK is far, far, far from a peaceful utopia. Well...it might have been for the British when they were practicing colonialism for hundreds of years and dominating native populations like I would dominate the "world's most sexy" charts if such a thing existed.
But they don't, so I must waste my sexy on the unwashed masses here at OO.
Hey, don't quote me and then say "your street rioting". My link to those events is far from proven.
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.” - H.L. Mencken
I don't like the direction this thing's going... (the forum talk, not the potential race riot)
Good thing this didn't happen in Oakland, though I have a feeling if some crazies organized a March on Oakland there will be a ****ing riot too. Out-of-towners goes into Oakland to wreck the city every time some march happens there.
Reemul wrote:Following this thread was interest but as an outsider felt I couldn't really comment. One thing though is being from the UK it's amazing how different it seems the Amercians are from us English people, from killing people to owning guns to the anger and outrage and so one.
While we may speak the same language it seems in many ways we just aren't the same. It makes me sad to see this whole issue happening and how we as humans are developing and becoming.
You do realize that one of the main reasons guns are so engrained in our culture is that we needed them to get your nation's boot off our throat, don't you? As for how "we as humans are developing and becoming" you should probably do some light reading into the history of man. We are beasts. Look at the bloody eagle the Norsemen used to make out of their enemies. The beheadings in the Middle East. Genocidal wars in Africa and the Baltics. There is a sadly almost unending list of the barbarity of man versus man.
For cryin' out loud, your street rioting incident is less than a year old. The UK is far, far, far from a peaceful utopia. Well...it might have been for the British when they were practicing colonialism for hundreds of years and dominating native populations like I would dominate the "world's most sexy" charts if such a thing existed.
But they don't, so I must waste my sexy on the unwashed masses here at OO.
I have to say that this is the biggest pile of shit I have ever fucking read.
Sure we have the odd major incident and the riots were a big issue, caused by our armed police shooting dead a criminal (something that rarely happens) and the poor masses from the no job inner cities rioted, the main issue being it was badly handled by the police and should have been stopped pretty much immediately. But no offense someone gets murdered in our country it still makes the papers and major news, heck you yanks would need a 24 hour channel 7 days a week dedicated to murder and death to keep up. You can keep your right to bare arms and own your own guns and carry freely and your sky high murder, accidental killing rates etc and i'll take our right to not be killed by some idiot with a gun every day of the week.
...mostly being the operative word as you folks have brutally violent gangs of soccer fans that love beating each other with bats frequently, the aforementioned riots, and the Mr. Bean series.
So...yeah...sticking to my assertion you aren't in any position to denounce any other country.
We're obviously going to have more deaths by firearms due to our laws, but I bristle at the insinuation that we are a fucked up society in comparison to England. Violence is a part of human nature in every country and for one person to sit in front of his computer and declare his scorn for us in a not too subtle manner, while his own country has its share of problems, just annoyed me a bit.
P.S. If we WERE a violent group of thugs with an inherently broken society, Trayvon's death would've been a closed case 2 minutes after it happened.
Rant off
Last edited by hepcat on Mon Apr 02, 2012 1:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I read hepcat as joking the first time but still, let's be careful when making sweeping generalizations of countries.
The whole relativistic scale used to condemn or exonerate entire nations usually leads down a bad road. And to uncalled for comments about cuisine.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General "No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton MYT
hepcat wrote:We're obviously going to have more deaths by firearms due to our laws, but I bristle at the insinuation that we are a fucked up society in comparison to England. Violence is a part of human nature in every country and for one person to sit in front of his computer and declare his scorn for us in a not too subtle manner, while his own country has its share of problems, just annoyed me a bit.
P.S. If we WERE a violent group of thugs with an inherently broken society, Trayvon's death would've been a closed case 2 minutes after it happened.
Rant off
Unfortunately he's right in a lot of ways. The bottom of our society is much more fucked up place than just about any of the Western European countries, and guns make that much more violent in areas with a lot of people. We also have a lot more baggage from slavery and our melting pot culture. That culture (of mixing cultures) also brings a ton of positives too.
Black Lives definitely Matter Lorini!
Also: There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
Pyperkub wrote:
The bottom of our society is much more fucked up place than just about any of the Western European countries
So we're now saying that our criminal element is crappy in comparison to the general, mostly non-criminal element of most Western European countries? I can get behind that. I would also say that to be fair, our non-criminal element is better than the criminal elements of any other country in the context we're discussing.
Analysis of figures from the European Commission showed a 77 per cent increase in murders, robberies, assaults and sexual offences in the UK since Labour came to power.
The total number of violent offences recorded compared to population is higher than any other country in Europe, as well as America, Canada, Australia and South Africa.
...
The UK had a greater number of murders in 2007 than any other EU country – 927 – and at a relative rate higher than most western European neighbours, including France, Germany, Italy and Spain.
It also recorded the fifth highest robbery rate in the EU, and the highest absolute number of burglaries, with double the number of offences recorded in Germany and France.
Overall, 5.4 million crimes were recorded in the UK in 2007 - more than 10 a minute - second only to Sweden.
...
It means there are over 2,000 crimes recorded per 100,000 population in the UK, making it the most violent place in Europe.
Austria is second, with a rate of 1,677 per 100,000 people, followed by Sweden, Belgium, Finland and Holland. By comparison, America has an estimated rate of 466 violent crimes per 100,000 population.
Reemul wrote:
I have to say that this is the biggest pile of shit I have ever fucking read.
Sure we have the odd major incident and the riots were a big issue, caused by our armed police shooting dead a criminal (something that rarely happens) and the poor masses from the no job inner cities rioted, the main issue being it was badly handled by the police and should have been stopped pretty much immediately. But no offense someone gets murdered in our country it still makes the papers and major news, heck you yanks would need a 24 hour channel 7 days a week dedicated to murder and death to keep up. You can keep your right to bare arms and own your own guns and carry freely and your sky high murder, accidental killing rates etc and i'll take our right to not be killed by some idiot with a gun every day of the week.
Rant over.
MMMMMM FEAR......
You realize we are talking about a 3 in 100,000 as this huge increase right?
So if you're going down that road, why are the Germans and Austrians so much more civilized?
And of course we have more nominally, we have 6 times the people you do.
Black Lives Matter
"To wield Grond, the mighty hammer of the Federal Government, is to be intoxicated with power beyond what you and I can reckon (though I figure we can ball park it pretty good with computers and maths). Need to tunnel through a mountain? Grond. Kill a mighty ogre? Grond. Hangnail? Grond. Spider? Grond (actually, that's a legit use, moreso than the rest)." - Peacedog
LawBeefaroni wrote:And to uncalled for comments about cuisine.
The man just shat upon Mr. Bean and you're worried about figgy pudding and haggis, and ..and..peanut butter and er...grits?! WTF dude. Has the world gone mad?!
Okay, in my defense, I find Blackadder to be genius comedy.
edit: Listen, I didn't mean to turn this into a nationalistic thread. I took (slight) offense at something someone wrote and responded. Sorry for the derail.
hepcat wrote:Sweden's on that list? Wow, I did not expect that. I thought their Swedish Bikini Team Eugenics Program worked to placate their populace.
Have you been sleeping and haven't heard of a certain Girl With The Dragon Tatoo?!? Or watched/read the stories of Det. Kurt Wallender?!? Sweden is a hotbed of crime and villainy!
Black lives matter!
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hepcat wrote:Sweden's on that list? Wow, I did not expect that. I thought their Swedish Bikini Team Eugenics Program worked to placate their populace.
Have you been sleeping and haven't heard of a certain Girl With The Dragon Tatoo?!? Or watched/read the stories of Det. Kurt Wallender?!? Sweden is a hotbed of crime and villainy!
Ticket purchased! My life as Swee Dan, The Swedish Chef of Crime begins soon.
Hep cooking would be a crime against the culinary arts. Sort of like LordMortis' war on spelling and writing coherently.
“As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.” - H.L. Mencken
Small and surrounded by a moat. Not that many low population areas so police per square mile is probably a lot better.
Shit we are surrounded by Canada and Mexico allowing not only guns but alcohol, drugs, and maple syrup to come across the border as easily as people and we all know how easy that is. Comparing the two countries crime the issues each face with respect to weapons is apples to oranges.
Besides I always enjoyed Scotland more than England.
Kasey Chang wrote:Did I just read that Zimmerman's lawyers quit because Zimmerman have gone into hiding so far he's stopped talking to his lawyers?
The only problem is that Zimmerman's lawyers are now talking to reporters....about legal advice they gave him and possibly hurting his case! They should have followed the advice they purportedly gave to Zimmerman, shut the fuck up.
SO! When shopping for a lawyer, make sure "Media Whore" is not one of their qualifications and that text messaging is not your primary method of client contact.
Doesn't matter -- I doubt he's in the country any more and I'm guessing he's never going to return. Even without the feds charging him I'm guessing he feared for his life. I'd never want to walk around constantly wondering if someone was going to creep up on me and if that means hiding out in another country, so be it.
Rip wrote:
I also heard he was still in the country just not in Florida. That I can't blame him for. I would be up on Mt. Rainier vacationing or something.
Yeah, that's what I read too. I think he's just hiding from the public, not the law at this point.
Supposedly the prosecutor is going to reveal some new info this weekend or earlier. It will be interesting to see what else has come up.
Jag wrote:
SO! When shopping for a lawyer, make sure "Media Whore" is not one of their qualifications and that text messaging is not your primary method of client contact.
Only media whores would take his case.
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Rip wrote:
I also heard he was still in the country just not in Florida. That I can't blame him for. I would be up on Mt. Rainier vacationing or something.
Yeah, that's what I read too. I think he's just hiding from the public, not the law at this point.
I hope he doesn't trespass or look too suspicious., wouldn't want anyone to kill him now.
Oh I've been waiting a long time to use that smiley!
"Why do people say grow some balls? Balls are weak and sensitive. If you wanna be tough, grow a vagina. Those things can take a pounding!" - Betty White
hepcat wrote:Supposedly the prosecutor is going to reveal some new info this weekend or earlier. It will be interesting to see what else has come up.
Shouldn't that wait for the trial?
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
hepcat wrote:Supposedly the prosecutor is going to reveal some new info this weekend or earlier. It will be interesting to see what else has come up.
Shouldn't that wait for the trial?
Probably, but I guess it really depends on what that information is. Since he is being charged I'd guess they will present some bit of info we don't know about that was the catalyst for those charges being brought against him.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."--George Orwell
hepcat wrote:Supposedly the prosecutor is going to reveal some new info this weekend or earlier. It will be interesting to see what else has come up.
Shouldn't that wait for the trial?
Why should that wait for trial? Nothing else has.
Black Lives Matter
"To wield Grond, the mighty hammer of the Federal Government, is to be intoxicated with power beyond what you and I can reckon (though I figure we can ball park it pretty good with computers and maths). Need to tunnel through a mountain? Grond. Kill a mighty ogre? Grond. Hangnail? Grond. Spider? Grond (actually, that's a legit use, moreso than the rest)." - Peacedog