The Empire Strikes Back - Empire Victory

[LordMortis]

So here's where I'm at:

Group 1 For being the focal point of problems

Grund

Group 2 For non decision making

Bubbles
Scoop

Group 3 for otherwise MIA

Not sure. Too many people to keep track of.

Group 4 for an assortment of everything else

Almost Every one else.


Not until we grunge is dead:

Not Trig

Not until he disobeys orders (and not ever he makes a hidden vote on imperial):

Not Purge

[El Guapo]

Not GMT.

Someone who scans to find ROLE of Living Player.

If a SCANNEROFTHELIVING targets PlayerX with a Scan, and PlayerX is killed that same night.
What is SCANNEROFTHELIVING told?

The Role?
Nothing?

Did we get an answer to this question that I missed?

bb, if the empire picks a target to kill and Palpatine picks the same target to scan, and the target is successfully killed, do the imperials learn the role of the killed target or not?

[purge]

As I said (not in yodaspeak to keep Remus from complaining about stale) - I don't know who is imperial.

I will be the last two votes (N-2 + my overt & hidden vote)

It will prove I'm special.
If the lynched is Imperial, it will prove I'm good.

I'm not defending Trig, nor am I defending Grund.
Letting them live a day means that night behaviour, esp. if Mon Mothma was not Redrun and decides to use her power, the kill attempt on ANYONE proves that person good, PLUS if it happens to be grund, it then proves Trig and Grund AND his new scan.

We also then have another target from Grund to test, even if they don't go after him tonight.

:shrug:

Everyone is playing today. Look ahead. If 3/12 is a normal number for WW, then we could have 6 Imperials. You think you have two ... nice. It could well be true. Them being quiet is actually a bigger condemnation than anything you've said sofar. But like I said - time will help solve this riddle.

Regardless of who we kill, I think it would be wise to have Mothma protect everyone.

BB - just for confirmation, Imperials cannot skip a night kill, correct?

[El Guapo]

This

FWIW, I knew Grundbegriff was either Talon Karrde or Emperor Palpatine. If no one counterclaims him as Karrde, I think we can take him at his word.

If you guys didn't get the hint, I sure did, when Grund announced that the one player he trusted implicitly was me. Remember that I sat atop his list of Day 1 suspects.

That's when I knew he'd scanned me.

I am Empire, obviously.

I won't divulge my role, obviously, as there should be no need to.

Does that work for you, purge?
Would you prefer not to vote for either one of them?

You know, reading Trigs post again it actually looks more like a slip and not a brain fart. His statement is very prominent and clear.

I can see a scenario where Grund felt HAD to fake a role and hope Talon wasn't in the game. Grund was up against the wall. He named Trig as a scanned trusted and then Trig made his "slip". It doesn't sound as far fetched as I thought at first.

I can imagine the conversation that's going on in the Imp forum between an evil Grund and evil Trig.

I still don't think we test either one today but I would not trust a thing either of them said now.

It'd be nice to think we revealed two of their specials instead of one of our own. I'd feel better about our chances.

I mean, the big glaring case against lynching Grund (or trig) is that Grund is uncontested as seer. As far as I know it's impossible for the wolves to know definitively today (given the resolution of kill / scan, pending the question asked above) whether or not Talon Karrde is in the game.

BUT there are two reasons lingering out there why a real Talon Karrde would not have objected. First, TK may not be in the game. In that scenario, Grund may well have felt the need to claim a role, and figured the seer is win-win in that either it's uncontested or they get to kill our seer. Second, Mr. Karrde may have decided it's not worth getting himself killed just yet to contest Grund before he has another scan or two under his belt.

[Isgrimnur]

300 quatloos says that trig is an unpowered Rebel.

[triggercut]

Triggercut, when you saw that 'hint' from Grund - why did you think "He's either Talon or Palpatine" ? splain

They're the two scanners. It's one or the other. If Grund--who was hot after me on his suspect list on Day 1 says on Day 2 that he knows I'm innocent, I suspected he scanned me.

He claimed to be Talon Karrde. No one countered his claim.

[Scoop20906]

Triggercut, when you saw that 'hint' from Grund - why did you think "He's either Talon or Palpatine" ? splain

They're the two scanners. It's one or the other. If Grund--who was hot after me on his suspect list on Day 1 says on Day 2 that he knows I'm innocent, I suspected he scanned me.

He claimed to be Talon Karrde. No one countered his claim.

But, its not one or the other.

Just because Grund claimed to be Talon it would not mean he would be the Imp's version of Talon which is Palpatine. It doesn't follow since Imp Grund didn't need to scan a rebel trig to know he is a rebel trig.

In the same post you seem to implicate yourself twice. Once flatly saying you are Empire and then naming Grund as a specific Imp Role showing knowledge only someone on the Imp team would know.

You also manage to claim you are a special as well knowing no one would press you on it.

Hmmmm.

Ok, what's stopping us from testing Trig? If he is a Imp then it directly gives us Grund as an Imp also.

If Trig is in fact Rebel, which I am starting to really doubt, then it doesn't prove anything about Grund. Grund could bluffing Talon and we'd learn more about the tomorrow. It's not a win win situation but has the potential to kill two Imps and put us in the drivers seat.

 triggercut 
 


I'm starting feel real good about this vote.

[Scoop20906]

300 quatloos says that trig is an unpowered Rebel.

I'm willing to take that bet.

[triggercut]

300 quatloos says that trig is an unpowered Rebel.

I'm willing to take that bet.

What are you staking?

Sig bet?

[triggercut]

Triggercut, when you saw that 'hint' from Grund - why did you think "He's either Talon or Palpatine" ? splain

They're the two scanners. It's one or the other. If Grund--who was hot after me on his suspect list on Day 1 says on Day 2 that he knows I'm innocent, I suspected he scanned me.

He claimed to be Talon Karrde. No one countered his claim.

But, its not one or the other.

Just because Grund claimed to be Talon it would not mean he would be the Imp's version of Talon which is Palpatine. It doesn't follow since Imp Grund didn't need to scan a rebel trig to know he is a rebel trig.

In the same post you seem to implicate yourself twice. Once flatly saying you are Empire and then naming Grund as a specific Imp Role showing knowledge only someone on the Imp team would know.

You also manage to claim you are a special as well knowing no one would press you on it.

Hmmmm.

Ok, what's stopping us from testing Trig? If he is a Imp then it directly gives us Grund as an Imp also.

If Trig is in fact Rebel, which I am starting to really doubt, then it doesn't prove anything about Grund. Grund could bluffing Talon and we'd learn more about the tomorrow. It's not a win win situation but has the potential to kill two Imps and put us in the drivers seat.

 triggercut 
 


I'm starting feel real good about this vote.

You lose.

[El Guapo]

300 quatloos says that trig is an unpowered Rebel.

I'm willing to take that bet.

What are you staking?

Sig bet?

300 quatloos, like he said.

[bb2112]

bb, if the empire picks a target to kill and Palpatine picks the same target to scan, and the target is successfully killed, do the imperials learn the role of the killed target or not?

Night: Events happen in turn order
Qui Gon Jinn: Who will you uber protect?
Joruus C’Baoth: Did you lynch an Imperial? If so, you get a scan. You will be notified by PM.
General Grievous: Did you lynch a Jedi? If so, you get a scan. You will be notified by PM.
Jabba the Hutt: Did you help lynch Solo? If so, then you get a free scan. You will be notified by PM.
Garm Bel Iblis: Did you lynch an Imperial? If so, you get to ask yes/no question. You will be notified by PM.
Ventress: Will you scan for either Rebel or Imperial?
Grand Moff Tarkin: Who of the deceased will you scan to learn their true identity?
Han Solo: Will you initiate a block? If so on who?
Mon Mothma: Will you commit the Noble Sacrifice?
Imperials: Who will you kill?
Luke Skywalker: Who will you scan for Vader or Mara?
Emperor: Who will you scan to discern their identity?
Vader: Who will you scan for Luke?
Rukh: Who will you scan for Thrawn?
Obi Wan Kenobi: Who of the deceased will you scan to learn their true identity?
Talon Karrde: Who will you scan to discern their identity?
Grand Admiral Thrawn: Get’s Rebel or Citizen if there is a night death.


Anytime:
Rukh: If you have identified Thrawn, you may interrupt any kill on Thrawn and sacrifice yourself instead.
Cad Bane: Name the player you want to disable.
Admiral Ackbar: Did you meet your secret agenda? If so PM the Mod.

Since Palpatine scans a live player, but the turn order has the kill before his scan, then no, he cannot scan the night kill. However, C'Baoth and Grievous both scan prior to the night kill (if they have met their scan conditions) so they could scan before the target is killed. That being said, all night orders are turned in at the same time and the mod puts the events into the proper order.

[bb2112]

BB - just for confirmation, Imperials cannot skip a night kill, correct?

That is correct, Imperials cannot skip a night kill.

[triggercut]

300 quatloos says that trig is an unpowered Rebel.

I'm willing to take that bet.

What are you staking?

Sig bet?

300 quatloos, like he said.

I just checked. Paypal converts that to $239 USD.

[triggercut]

So yeah, anyway. I'm tired of fighting closeted Imperials, and if we want to please the Empire and hang another innocent so be it. I made a goof, I explained the goof, and told folks what it meant in the cases that were present.

I'm an unpowered Rebel. As such, I had been dropping teensy-tiny little breadcrumb hints that I was Qui Gon, mostly to see if I could get the Badguys to waste a scan on me instead of someone more important.

The thing I'm most disappointed in my goof up is that it gave Empire badguys cover to openly discuss the lynching of a player without the danger of betraying much beyond opportunism, and that's likely not to become apparent until later in the game. The badguys can look "helpful" in getting me to the requisite number of votes, and then when I come back as a goodguy they can shrug and say "Well, he shouldn't have said he was Empire."

I'm also disappointed in that had Grundbegriff and I both survived the daytime turn--and if Grund is indeed on the village team--then it would have given the Empire some tough choices to make at night. They'd have to decide whether Grund was protected or not, and if there was value in letting us both live and hoping that you all would hang one of us (me, most likely) because I'd survived the night.

Finally, I have thoughts on three folks have pushed to one extent or another to have me hung. Any of them could be Empire. I believe at least one of them is.

1. Unagi: his entire move on me feels like opportunism. Good Unagi is normally open to a spectrum of possibilities in his approach to finding badguys, and as such he sniffs them out on limited data better than anyone I've seen play these games--maybe with the exception of stessier. His pursuit of my hanging--and the method of this thoughts in that pursuit--do not reflect the way I have seen him play any time he's been with the goodguys. He's either Empire, or the size of this game has warped his normally sure-footed radar a great deal. There's more too. Our first two goodguy specials have self-outed. Neither has been counterclaimed. Unagi has pushed very hard to lynch both players. In so doing, I ask myself this: what are the odds of not only one badguy coming forward and blindly claiming a special role...and now what are the odds of two players doing so, and doing so consecutively on the same game day with the same data set of knowns? What's that you say? Unagi isn't pushing to have Grundbegriff lynched? Yes he is. If I am Empire, by transitive logic that would mean that Grundbegriff is Empire also. Voting to lynch me means that you believe that Grundbegriff is lying about his team affiliation in the game. And so once again: why is Unagi keen to hang Rebel specials so much?

2. Remus West: Remus is very good at sniffing out badguys when he plays a goodguy. He and I (in my opinion) share the same fault and weakness: we both get in too much of a binary frame of mind. We talk ourselves into possibilities at the exclusion of possibilities we don't see. Remus may very well be a goodguy. I sort of think he might be. His pursuit of me feels like his own single-mindedness, which I know from when I've gotten into that mindset, can sometimes be completely off.

3. Scoop. About 4-6 pages back (heck maybe more; it was during the current game "day") I thought I caught Scoop in an Empire giveaway. He mentioned that the N-1 thing for purge to either prove his Yoda-ness or Dooku-osity, but I was unaware that Dooku couldn't cast his secret vote on a teammate. Scoop was, which is why I mentioned that it was a nice play. Here's the post: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=81807&start=1280#p1856235
In fact, it was a good play. Which means that when he made his post above it doesn't say what he wants to think it says. Scoop, we're not talking about Grund revealing "I scanned triggercut", we're talking about how I strongly suspected that Grund was a scanner on indeterminate team because I was a player formerly identified by him as strongly suspicious, but now totally trustworthy. Why would that imply Imperial as well as Rebel? Because I'm unpowered, Scoop. Pre-reveal, him saying he trusted me could just as well have been a disguised Palpatine telling the group "Don't lynch this guy, let's try for bigger necks in the noose." It also might be, and still could have been--a way for Palpatine to prove himself to the group, could it not? Hang me and I come back Rebel (which, hey, you probably already know, right?) Suddenly Palpatine trying to spoof Talon Karrde has basis in fact, does it not? Do you not see that, pre-reveal, that's where my "either/or, but definitely I think I got scanned" came from? That before Grund claimed his role and team affiliation that my knowledge that I'd been scanned could be used to prove oneself as Talon, for good or evil intent?

That alone makes me suddenly reconsider Scoop. He's sharp enough on the rules and their application to be all over the test of N-1 to show purge's Yoda-ness, but he misses that. Is it just a matter of Scoop not seeing things through, or is it evil?

And so I'll end my soliloquy. I believe right now that Unagi is about 70% likely to be a badguy. I think Scoop is a 50/50 shot. I think Remus is likely to be good and just on the wrong track. Thanks for reading.

[Scoop20906]

scoop, we're not talking about Grund revealing "I scanned triggercut", we're talking about how I strongly suspected that Grund was a scanner on indeterminate team because I was a player formerly identified by him as strongly suspicious, but now totally trustworthy. Why would that imply Imperial as well as Rebel? Because I'm unpowered, Scoop. Pre-reveal, him saying he trusted me could just as well have been a disguised Palpatine telling the group "Don't lynch this guy, let's try for bigger necks in the noose." It also might be, and still could have been--a way for Palpatine to prove himself to the group, could it not? Hang me and I come back Rebel (which, hey, you probably already know, right?) Suddenly Palpatine trying to spoof Talon Karrde has basis in fact, does it not? Do you not see that, pre-reveal, that's where my "either/or, but definitely I think I got scanned" came from? That before Grund claimed his role and team affiliation that my knowledge that I'd been scanned could be used to prove oneself as Talon, for good or evil intent?

Ok, your trying to explain your rationale for this statement? Good. Lets recap.

FWIW, I knew Grundbegriff was either Talon Karrde or Emperor Palpatine. If no one counterclaims him as Karrde, I think we can take him at his word.

If you guys didn't get the hint, I sure did, when Grund announced that the one player he trusted implicitly was me. Remember that I sat atop his list of Day 1 suspects.

That's when I knew he'd scanned me.

I am Empire, obviously.

I won't divulge my role, obviously, as there should be no need to.

You specifically named Grund as either the role he already claimed or as Emperor Palpatine. There are 16 total Imperial roles. You say the reason you picked Palpatine is that your believed that Grund had already scanned your and referenced that your were a "trusted" before he revealed himself as Talon.

Again, why Palpatine specifically? Looking at the Imperial Roles there are 7 roles with scanning abilities. Most require certain conditions except for one.

Ventress: Each night Ventress can scan a player to get the player’s alignment. The answer from the mod will be Imperial or Rebel. Citizens will show up as Rebels, and Guards will show up as Imperials.

Could not Grund have also scanned you as Ventress and saw you as Rebel? Its the same thing right? Both are scanning for alignment and that includes Talon Karrde.

But an Imperial Grund could be any of those roles and KNOW you are a rebel, right? Unless you are actually what you said you are.

I am Empire, obviously.

This isn't opportunism, Trig. This is my opinion based on the information available to me through reading posts (your posts). And when I first read it I actually just gave you a pass. If it wasn't for Lord Mortis bringing it up again I wouldn't have given it a 2nd look.

We don't have to keep arguing about this, Trig. I think you slipped up and you are doing your best damage control. I've voted for you and we can see if a bandwagon builds. There are certainly a lot of players so it doesn't necessarily mean we need to test you today but you've shot to the top of my list.

You say I'm going to lose my bet? What else can we expect you to say? I'm thinking "winner winner chicken dinner"!

Note: I actually don't get the whole Ventress role. Is she neutral? Does she not know who is on her team? What would be the point of scanning for alignment?

BB, is Ventress a possible role in this game? If so, maybe the rulez need to be fleshed out a bit.

My apologies if this has already been discussed.

[Grundbegriff]

When's the deadline?

[Austin]

When's the deadline?

My birthday.

[Chaosraven]

Monday, I believe.

Ummm.

The other part is Grund could be Imperial, but not Palpatine.

Any Imperial is going to know players X Y and Z aren't on their team and by default Rebel.

[triggercut]

You specifically named Grund as either the role he already claimed or as Emperor Palpatine. There are 16 total Imperial roles. You say the reason you picked Palpatine is that your believed that Grund had already scanned your and referenced that your were a "trusted" before he revealed himself as Talon.

Again, why Palpatine specifically? Looking at the Imperial Roles there are 7 roles with scanning abilities. Most require certain conditions except for one.

I can't tell whether you're deliberately playing dense here on purpose, and if so for what means. But sure, I've got some time, and I love to knock holes in bad arguments. Have a seat. Here we go.

Some givens: I know that I am an unpowered Rebel citizen. I know who can scan for me in the game, both friendly and unfriendly.

I know that Grundbegriff has extreme suspicion of me on Day 1.

I know that on day 2 he says that the only player he is sure is totally trustworthy is me. That's quite a change, and why I suspected strongly I had been scanned by either Palpatine or Karrde. Now let's run down those 16 Imperial roles for you, shall we?

1. Emperor. Can scan any player and get their true identity. Emperor Palpatine can discover that I am a rebel redshirt.

2. Vader. Scans for Luke. If unsuccessful, told only unsuccessful. I am not Luke. Darth Vader cannot learn anything about me by scanning me.

3. Count Dooku. Doesn't scan.

4. Mara Jade. Doesn't scan, but waits to be scanned.

5. Moff Tarkin. Coroner, not a scanner.

6. Thrawn. Knows how many Rebels and Empire are in the game, and is told of conversions. Not really a scanner. As I am ineligible for conversion, Thrawn discerns nothing about me anyway.

7. Rukh. Scans for Thrawn. I am not Thrawn, therefore I know that Rukh cannot learn anything by scanning me.

8. Jabba. Gets a free scan if Solo dies by lynch or nighttime kill. I considered this possibility and decided it was rather remote--that the one player who mistrusts me the most on Day 1 is Jabba, and that they killed redrun who is Han Solo, thus giving that Empire player who mistrusts me the most a bonus scan. Could happen, but in the interest of tiredness and brevity I left it out. (I could try to be more pedantic next time, but...no, I won't, actually.)

9. Boba Fett. Protects, not scans.

10. Joruus. Gets to scan if his name is on the vote train of a successful lynch of a rebel named player. We have discounted the possibility of stess being a named player. If Joruus is in the game, it is extremely unlikely he earned a scan by stessier's hanging.

11. Cad. Disables powers. Not a scanner.

12. Ventress. Scans for alignment, not role, which is a really weird power for an Empire player to have and which I dismissed out of hand. Ventress scans alignment only, which is kind of a goofy power. Mara and Luke are the two who can switch teams, and since both start off on the Rebel side, presumably the Empire knows that they're not on their team (yet). In any event, if Grund=Ventress alignment wouldn't give him over to saying "100% trust", since for all he knows I could be a convertible rebel which would then give lie to any claims he'd make to being Talon down the road.

13. Grievous. Gets a scan if we lynch a named jedi. Extremely unlikely that stessier was a named Jedi, so Grievous did not get a scan.

14. Darth Maul. Explodes, doesn't scan.

15. Nute Gunray. Avoids death, doesn't scan.

16. Greedo. Shoots folks, doesn't scan.

So. Thinking that I'd been scanned, here are the possibilities I considered:

1. Grundbegriff is Talon Karrde, and scanned me and knows that I'm an unpowered rebel. Grund's a bright guy and probably picked up on my slight breadcrumb trail of being Qui Gon and decided to roll with it for the obvious beneficial reasons.

2. Grundbegriff is Palpatine and knows that I am an unpowered rebel. Being unpowered, I'm nothing more than a fallback plan for the badguys who would rather lynch or nighttime kill bigger fish than me.

3. I considered and dismissed as very unlikely that Grund was Jabba. Too many moving parts for me to consider without being pedantic and putting up a long post like this one.

4. I considered and dismissed as completely unlikely that Grund was one of the 2 Imperials who scan on the lynching of a powered player and/or jedi. That requires stessier to die with his role a secret on Day 1. Don't think he'd do that.

What else you got, Scoop?

[Chaosraven]

How about mine?

Any Imperial (regardless of Role) could pretend to be Scanner by saying "PlayerX" is a Rebel.


Naming the Rebel Role would require some ability, but PlayerY could say it after PlayerZ did the scan.

[triggercut]

How about mine?

Any Imperial (regardless of Role) could pretend to be Scanner by saying "PlayerX" is a Rebel.


Naming the Rebel Role would require some ability, but PlayerY could say it after PlayerZ did the scan.

I suppose that's obviously true, but I was relaying my own thought process which was, upon Grundbegriff's pre-reveal statement about me as "He's a scanner, but I'm not sure for which team yet."

[triggercut]

Also Chaos (and I don't know if this helps) but remember that I was actually trying to get scanned by the badguys if I could. That entered my mind as well.

Grundbegriff says that he is 100% sure of my trustworthiness.

I think: "He scanned me."

I think: "Should I say something right now? I don't know if he's a goodguy scanner or badguy scanner."

I think: "Someone else has to have noticed that. That should prevent a Grundbegriff train from forming. I'll watch and see what he does and see if I can tell what team he's on. Let's see how this plays out."

Grund accumulates votes like crazy. Grund has to come out.

I see that he's come out as our scanner. Crap. No one counters his claim.

I think: "Grundbegriff is probably telling the truth about who he is."

I think: "The odds of both Grundbegriff and purge being Empire and both blindly claiming a vacated role is astronomical."

I think: "I'm really tired, but I'll try to verify his claim of what I am as benignly as possible."

I think: "I just said I was on the wrong team. I wish I could tell all this Star Wars crap apart. Damn. That's gonna leave a mark."

I think: "Wow, Unagi sure does like hanging Rebel specials. First he wanted purge, then he wants Grundbegriff-by-proxy on me."

[Lagom Lite]

 Scoop 
 


What's the vote count anyway?

Listen, we're not killing purge or Grund (or trig) today. Some other day, maybe, but not today. Get over it please. Start talking alternatives.

[Austin]

Start talking alternatives.

 Unagi 
 

[Grundbegriff]

I like the way triggercut has been thinking. Let's go with  Unagi 
 

[bb2112]

Day 2 Vote

1. Isgrimnur ---------------> Purge, Grundbegriff
2. El Guapo ----------------> Grundbegriff, Grundbegriff
3. Qantaga ----------------> Lagom Lite, Purge, Lagom Lite
4. RMC ---------------------> Purge, Qantaga
5. Lassr --------------------> El Guapo, Purge, Grundbegriff, Lagom Lite
6. Mr. Bubbles -------------> Grundbegriff, Purge
7. Coopasonic -------------> Grundbegriff, Unagi, Grundbegriff
8. Chaosraven -------------> Purge, Purge, Grundbegriff, RMC
9. Remus West ------------> Grundbegriff, Purge, Grundbegriff, Triggercut, Grundbegriff
10. Scoop20906 ------------> Triggercut
11. Jow ---------------------> Grundbegriff
12. Grundbegriff ----------> Purge, Theohall, Unagi, Unagi
13. Theohall ---------------> Grundbegriff, RMC, Purge, Triggercut
14. Tru1cy -----------------> Purge
15. Purge ------------------> Unagi, Theohall
16. Lord Mortis -----------> Grundbegriff, Purge, Chaosraven
17. Austin -----------------> Purge, Grundbegriff, Purge, Grundbegriff, Purge,Mr. Bubbles, Grundbegriff, Unagi
18. Unagi ------------------> Purge, Grundbegriff, Purge, Grundbegriff, Triggercut, Chaosraven, Qantaga
19. Triggercut ------------> Purge, Scoop20906, Unagi
20. Newcastle -------------> Purge, Lord Mortis, Unagi
21. Warpig ----------------> Grundbegriff, Qantaga
22. Lagom Lite -----------> Grundbegriff, Purge, Purge, Grundbegriff, Scoop20906

4 Unagi <---------------------------- Newcastle, Triggercut, Austin, Grundbegriff
4 Grundbegriff <------------------- Jow, El Guapo, Coopasonic, Remus West
3 Qantaga <------------------------- Unagi, RMC, Warpig
2 Lagom Lite <--------------------- Qantaga, Lassr
2 Triggercut <---------------------- Theohall, Scoop20906
1 RMC <----------------------------- Chaosraven
1 Chaosraven <--------------------- Lord Mortis
1 Purge <---------------------------- Mr. Bubbles
1 Scoop20906 <-------------------- Lagom Lite

No Votes:
3 <------------- Tru1cy, Isgrimnur, Purge

Majority is 12

Dead
Day 1 <------------ Stessier - Syringed
Night 1 <---------- Redrun - Garroted

Deadline is May 21st 9PM Eastern

Day: All day actions happen first come first served
Count Dooku: Who will receive your secret vote for a lynch today?
Yoda: Who will receive your secret vote for a lynch today?
Darth Maul: Who will you take with you to the afterlife?
Boba Fett: Who will you protect from the lynch?
Admiral Ackbar: Will you public declare?
Rukh: Who will you assassinate?
Boba Fett: If your scan reveals a Rebel, will you kill the Rebel?
Greedo: Who will you shoot?
Leia Organa: Who will you stun?
Vader: Who will you choke to death?
R2D2: Who will receive your 3 secret votes for a lynch?
C3PO: Will you ask the Mod through PM what role started in the game?
Chewbacca: Who's arms will you tear off?
Han Solo: Will you initiate a block? If so on who?
Grand Admiral Thrawn: Get’s Rebel or Citizen if there is a successful lynch of a Rebel or Citizen.

Anytime:
Rukh: If you have identified Thrawn, you may interrupt any kill on Thrawn and sacrifice yourself instead.
Cad Bane: Name the player you want to disable.
Admiral Ackbar: Did you meet your secret agenda? If so PM the Mod.

[bb2112]

BB, is Ventress a possible role in this game? If so, maybe the rulez need to be fleshed out a bit.

All roles are possible. I look at it this way, Ventress's power may not be very useful for the Imperials, however, she does give them another hit point. Exactly like an unempowered wolf would.

[triggercut]

Yeah, it'd be great if that was an Imperial slip up, but man....I sure would like to protect our Rebel specials for a few turns before silly season leads to mass outings.

Me on like page 3 or 4 saying "Yoo hoo! Imperials! Notice me in my Qui-Gon outfit!"

[triggercut]

I know I'm trying to play a bit more guarded

From page 6 or so. Me with a wiffle ball bat spray-painted to look like a light saber.

[LordMortis]

 Scoop 
 


What's the vote count anyway?

Listen, we're not killing purge or Grund (or trig) today. Some other day, maybe, but not today. Get over it please. Start talking alternatives.

Hey, that's the attitude that saved Grund yesterday and potentially will keep him alive tomorrow if he and trig live through the night having no idea why they're still alive.

On the other hand, I'm still on the fence about whether grund should be lynched today. If I had midicholorans they'd be screaming he and trig are evil. Grund having to be Palpatine sits with me even more than "I am empire" But I am trying my damnedest to make sure if that Grund is good, that he will get killed tonight.

In absence of this

 Lagom 
 


But quite frankly if the will general will is Grund, I don't think I could resist or will resist piling on.

Unagi will be an interesting kill and ought to tell us a bit but it's not a vote I'm comfortable in making on day 2. So have at it but have at it without me.

[Lagom Lite]

 Scoop 
 


What's the vote count anyway?

Listen, we're not killing purge or Grund (or trig) today. Some other day, maybe, but not today. Get over it please. Start talking alternatives.

Hey, that's the attitude that saved Grund yesterday and potentially will keep him alive tomorrow if he and trig live through the night having no idea why they're still alive.

On the other hand, I'm still on the fence about whether grund should be lynched today. If I had midicholorans they'd be screaming he and trig are evil. Grund having to be Palpatine sits with me even more than "I am empire" But I am trying my damnedest to make sure if that Grund is good, that he will get killed tonight.

In absence of this

 Lagom 
 


But quite frankly if the will general will is Grund, I don't think I could resist or will resist piling on.

Unagi will be an interesting kill and ought to tell us a bit but it's not a vote I'm comfortable in making on day 2. So have at it but have at it without me.

If Grund is the Seer, evil will have to kill him or he will expose them one by one OR produce trusted players for us. Why do their job for them? If Grund lives for too long, we lynch him. It's not like there's no time, there are over twenty players in this game.

[triggercut]

 Scoop 
 


What's the vote count anyway?

Listen, we're not killing purge or Grund (or trig) today. Some other day, maybe, but not today. Get over it please. Start talking alternatives.

Hey, that's the attitude that saved Grund yesterday and potentially will keep him alive tomorrow if he and trig live through the night having no idea why they're still alive.

On the other hand, I'm still on the fence about whether grund should be lynched today. If I had midicholorans they'd be screaming he and trig are evil. Grund having to be Palpatine sits with me even more than "I am empire" But I am trying my damnedest to make sure if that Grund is good, that he will get killed tonight.

In absence of this

 Lagom 
 


But quite frankly if the will general will is Grund, I don't think I could resist or will resist piling on.

Unagi will be an interesting kill and ought to tell us a bit but it's not a vote I'm comfortable in making on day 2. So have at it but have at it without me.

If Grund is the Seer, evil will have to kill him or he will expose them one by one OR produce trusted players for us. Why do their job for them? If Grund lives for too long, we lynch him. It's not like there's no time, there are over twenty players in this game.

Bingo.

Why is Lord Mortis "doing his damnedest to make sure" Grundbegriff gets killed tonight?

If Grund's a goodguy scanner, they have to kill him, but hopefully he gets protected and gives us at least one more scan. If they let him live to increase his suspicious-seemingness, he's going to uncover a badguy, call him out, and when we hang that badguy it'll prove things out one way or another, as Blondie would sing.

[triggercut]

BTW, I should highlight that Unagi moved his vote off me. That doesn't change my suspicion of him much, as I am under the assumption that if a train started up he'd happily build the gallows to hang me on.

Perhaps not, but that's my perception at this time.

[triggercut]

And having said that last (early morning inventory..sheesh....moar coffee), I should add that it does change my calculus on Unagi a bit. Maybe not much, but definitely a bit, as it seems to be evidence of his polynomial thinking that I find him doing so well when he's playing a goodguy. I'll be home from work here (if the numbers add up) in a bit, then grab a nap, and see what's up hopefully with a bit clearer a mind.

[LordMortis]

If Grund is the Seer, evil will have to kill him or he will expose them one by one OR produce trusted players for us. Why do their job for them? If Grund lives for too long, we lynch him. It's not like there's no time, there are over twenty players in this game.

Because there's a lot more at play here than that but I'm not going to do all game speculation for everyone.

Why is Lord Mortis "doing his damnedest to make sure" Grundbegriff gets killed tonight?

If Grund's a goodguy scanner, they have to kill him, but hopefully he gets protected and gives us at least one more scan. If they let him live to increase his suspicious-seemingness, he's going to uncover a badguy, call him out, and when we hang that badguy it'll prove things out one way or another, as Blondie would sing.

Again, there are a lot of assumptions for how today, tonight, and tomorrow are going to play out, much like how you assume that Grund is Palpatine for us when he could be any evil player. If Grund dies tonight, then you we know you are good and he is no longer a loose cannon. You and LL just increase me wanting to vote for him today and ending the controversy early.

[Scoop20906]

 Scoop 
 


What's the vote count anyway?

Listen, we're not killing purge or Grund (or trig) today. Some other day, maybe, but not today. Get over it please. Start talking alternatives.

Hey, that's the attitude that saved Grund yesterday and potentially will keep him alive tomorrow if he and trig live through the night having no idea why they're still alive.

On the other hand, I'm still on the fence about whether grund should be lynched today. If I had midicholorans they'd be screaming he and trig are evil. Grund having to be Palpatine sits with me even more than "I am empire" But I am trying my damnedest to make sure if that Grund is good, that he will get killed tonight.

In absence of this

 Lagom 
 


But quite frankly if the will general will is Grund, I don't think I could resist or will resist piling on.

Unagi will be an interesting kill and ought to tell us a bit but it's not a vote I'm comfortable in making on day 2. So have at it but have at it without me.

If Grund is the Seer, evil will have to kill him or he will expose them one by one OR produce trusted players for us. Why do their job for them? If Grund lives for too long, we lynch him. It's not like there's no time, there are over twenty players in this game.

Bingo.

Why is Lord Mortis "doing his damnedest to make sure" Grundbegriff gets killed tonight?

If Grund's a goodguy scanner, they have to kill him, but hopefully he gets protected and gives us at least one more scan. If they let him live to increase his suspicious-seemingness, he's going to uncover a badguy, call him out, and when we hang that badguy it'll prove things out one way or another, as Blondie would sing.

Bingo!

Reveal your feelings are.

Every night Grund/Palpatine survives a night he gets another scan too.

That being said I still don't think we test an uncontested Talon. It's possible Talon is keeping quiet so he could scan Grund tonight too.

[triggercut]

 Scoop 
 


What's the vote count anyway?

Listen, we're not killing purge or Grund (or trig) today. Some other day, maybe, but not today. Get over it please. Start talking alternatives.

Hey, that's the attitude that saved Grund yesterday and potentially will keep him alive tomorrow if he and trig live through the night having no idea why they're still alive.

On the other hand, I'm still on the fence about whether grund should be lynched today. If I had midicholorans they'd be screaming he and trig are evil. Grund having to be Palpatine sits with me even more than "I am empire" But I am trying my damnedest to make sure if that Grund is good, that he will get killed tonight.

In absence of this

 Lagom 
 


But quite frankly if the will general will is Grund, I don't think I could resist or will resist piling on.

Unagi will be an interesting kill and ought to tell us a bit but it's not a vote I'm comfortable in making on day 2. So have at it but have at it without me.

If Grund is the Seer, evil will have to kill him or he will expose them one by one OR produce trusted players for us. Why do their job for them? If Grund lives for too long, we lynch him. It's not like there's no time, there are over twenty players in this game.

Bingo.

Why is Lord Mortis "doing his damnedest to make sure" Grundbegriff gets killed tonight?

If Grund's a goodguy scanner, they have to kill him, but hopefully he gets protected and gives us at least one more scan. If they let him live to increase his suspicious-seemingness, he's going to uncover a badguy, call him out, and when we hang that badguy it'll prove things out one way or another, as Blondie would sing.

Bingo!

Reveal your feelings are.

Every night Grund/Palpatine survives a night he gets another scan too.

That being said I still don't think we test an uncontested Talon. It's possible Talon is keeping quiet so he could scan Grund tonight too.

At some point if Grund is still alive and still giving unpowered villagers as the result of his scans I'd say that he probably needs to swing.

Again though, I'm speaking of what the Empire players are thinking. If Grund is Talon, they already know and they'll have to get him because THEY know--even if we do not--that Grundbegriff will start to pick them off.

[Lassr]

It's possible Talon is keeping quiet so he could scan Grund tonight too.

Word of advice if Talon is out there and it is not Grund. Do not scan Grund. Find us another Imperial player.

[Lagom Lite]

Every night Grund/Palpatine survives a night he gets another scan too.

Less of an issue. They already know who's good and who's bad.

Besides, there's no reason to think Grund is Palpatine even if he's evil. They have a secret forum, you know. Anyone who's Palpatine could just tell Grund.

It's possible Talon is keeping quiet so he could scan Grund tonight too.

Word of advice if Talon is out there and it is not Grund. Do not scan Grund. Find us another Imperial player.

+1,000

Jeez, what's wrong with you Scoop? Grund will be proven one way or the other. Either the bad guys will kill him, or they won't. There's your scan.