The Trump foreign policy thread

$iljanus · Post by **$iljanus** » Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:02 pm

Isgrimnur wrote:NY Times

A resolution to encourage breast-feeding was expected to be approved quickly and easily by the hundreds of government delegates who gathered this spring in Geneva for the United Nations-affiliated World Health Assembly.
...
Then the United States delegation, embracing the interests of infant formula manufacturers, upended the deliberations.

American officials sought to water down the resolution by removing language that called on governments to “protect, promote and support breast-feeding” and another passage that called on policymakers to restrict the promotion of food products that many experts say can have deleterious effects on young children.

When that failed, they turned to threats, according to diplomats and government officials who took part in the discussions. Ecuador, which had planned to introduce the measure, was the first to find itself in the cross hairs.

The Americans were blunt: If Ecuador refused to drop the resolution, Washington would unleash punishing trade measures and withdraw crucial military aid. The Ecuadorean government quickly acquiesced.
...
In the end, the Americans’ efforts were mostly unsuccessful. It was the Russians who ultimately stepped in to introduce the measure — and the Americans did not threaten them.
...
During the deliberations, some American delegates even suggested the United States might cut its contribution the W.H.O., several negotiators said. Washington is the single largest contributor to the health organization, providing $845 million, or roughly 15 percent of its budget, last year.

I was just reading this article and I'm embarrassed and ashamed of our government. Fucking bullies. And for what?

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:10 pm

Siljanus wrote:And for what?

Lobbyist money. We're living under an administration that cares for nothing but money and power, no matter how many people they have to step on to get it.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:32 pm

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:37 pm

YellowKing wrote: ↑Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:10 pm
Siljanus wrote:And for what?
Lobbyist money. We're living under an administration that cares for nothing but money and power, no matter how many people they have to step on to get it.

Until Russia tugs on our leash. Down, boy. Down.

In the end, the Americans’ efforts were mostly unsuccessful. It was the Russians who ultimately stepped in to introduce the measure — and the Americans did not threaten them.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:03 am

The amazing part to me is that the Administration was making threats that Congress would theoretically have to back. Except Trump has completely taken trade and military policy over wholly with his cockamamie national security nonsense. If protesting resolutions *for* breast feeding is in our national interest...for godsakes let the revolution begin now.

GungHo · Post by **GungHo** » Mon Jul 09, 2018 1:15 pm

$iljanus wrote: ↑Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:02 pm
I was just reading this article and I'm embarrassed and ashamed of our government. Fucking bullies. And for what?

I had the same thoughts. So difficult to understand how there are people so deplorable that they'd undermine the health of babies for a $. Totally demoralizing when it's *my* country.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Mon Jul 09, 2018 1:37 pm

link

Steve Innskeep wrote:The top part of the president’s tweet denies the story.

The bottom part admits the story is true, and tries to justify the US action.

To do so, he falsely claims the US opposed some kind of ban on formula.

NYT reports the US opposed restricting false advertising of formula.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Mon Jul 09, 2018 1:52 pm

He is such a piece of shit. When one of their evil, corrupt moves gets uncovered his move is always #FakeNews!! And it works. We are pretty boned.

GreenGoo · Post by **GreenGoo** » Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:16 pm

Fake news in the same breath that he admits it's true then rationalizes it.

That should outrage the average person.

Yes you are boned.

I'll say again that he is not a conservative. This is not partisan politics. He usurped the GOP for his own ends. Loyalty to him is loyalty to a krusty the klown version of a crime boss.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:11 pm

Every time he says something about Fake News I want to punch him in his orange Cheeto face. It's amazing the number of pro-Trump people I know who use that term regularly in conversation as if it's fact. People who, pre-Trump, never ONCE accused the news of being "fake." Liberally biased, sure, but not FAKE.

If you honestly believe the majority of mainstream media is "fake" then you're an idiot and a moron. Period.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:17 pm

YellowKing wrote: ↑Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:11 pm If you honestly believe the majority of mainstream media is "fake" then you're an idiot and a moron. Period.

It's the last line of defense against facts.

If you're Trump or a Trump supporter, the facts ceased to be your friend a long time ago.

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:48 am

Holman wrote: ↑Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:17 pmIf you're Trump or a Trump supporter, the facts ceased to be your friend a long time ago.

Faith doesn't require facts; facts often get in the way of faith. It's better for them if they just ignore parts of the world they don't agree with.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:16 pm

Maybe standardized testing in schools should focus a bit more on world history?

The generation that saw the rise of Hitler and Stalin and saw, for themselves, the destruction of the World Wars, the failure of the squalid communist revolutions in Russia and China, and the genocide and enslavement over which these miserable regimes presided, were obviously, deeply traumatized—so much so that they assumed what they had seen was unforgettable. They imagined these events, like the Crucifixion, would become a permanent part of human memory.

They were wrong. We’re now cheerfully pissing away the greatest achievement of American history, the work of generations, achieved at incalculable cost in life and treasure: a free, united, secure, and prosperous Western world. The 20th century has been forgotten. No one learned a thing from it.

RuperT · Post by **RuperT** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:46 pm

History’s for losers; winners study STEM! STEM STEM STEM!

Captain Caveman · Post by **Captain Caveman** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:40 pm

Sure sounds like he’s pushing a pretext to pull out of NATO, screw our allies, dismantle the current world order, and join Putin in an alliance of oligarchs and kleptocrats.

GreenGoo · Post by **GreenGoo** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:54 pm

For the millionth fucking time, that's not how NATO works. No one owes the US delinquent payments.

There are NO payments.

You've elected a carnival Barker.

All he does is blow his dog whistle all day, every day.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:08 pm

I've said this in other threads as part of other discussions, but when future generations are able to string all this together into a historical narrative, it's going to be fascinating to read. Living during the time that it's happening, in the country that is currently spiraling out of control? Not so much.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:21 pm

I'm trying to imagine what would happen if Trump were to try to decouple from NATO. How would it work? How would it go down?

I'm certain the move wouldn't look good to Mattis or the Pentagon, and I can't imagine they would just role over for it without pushback or slow-walking the changes until we had a new president.

I also can't see any but the hardest-core Trumpers thinking it's a good idea. They like the idea of sticking it to Europe over funding, but how many would genuinely approve the collapse of our military alliance? American veterans respect European soldiers who've not just stood but actually fought alongside us for decades.

I'm still hoping that this is just Trump trash-talking a business partner and trying to curry cheap favor with Putin. The idea that it goes beyond that is nauseating.

GreenGoo · Post by **GreenGoo** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:29 pm

Prior to WWII the us was isolationist. That's not ancient history. It's not hard to imagine a US huddled in on itself. What *is* hard to imagine is a prosperous US huddled in on itself.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:35 pm

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:08 pm I've said this in other threads as part of other discussions, but when future generations are able to string all this together into a historical narrative, it's going to be fascinating to read. Living during the time that it's happening, in the country that is currently spiraling out of control? Not so much.

Read? The 20 year nationalist/populist plan from here is to get us to Fahrenheit 451 since that's where those pesky facts come from. We will be great again! Not because of our higher education levels, literacy or scientific endeavors, nay! It will be a gut-based America! Where feelings are greater than facts, and confidence of opinion displaces learning and curiosity.

Books, learning and science are for liberal sheep, elites and godless snowflakes.

Captain Caveman · Post by **Captain Caveman** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:38 pm

Holman wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:21 pm I'm trying to imagine what would happen if Trump were to try to decouple from NATO. How would it work? How would it go down?

Given the current circumstances, this doesn't seem optimal.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:50 pm

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 1:16 pm Maybe standardized testing in schools should focus a bit more on world history?

The generation that saw the rise of Hitler and Stalin and saw, for themselves, the destruction of the World Wars, the failure of the squalid communist revolutions in Russia and China, and the genocide and enslavement over which these miserable regimes presided, were obviously, deeply traumatized—so much so that they assumed what they had seen was unforgettable. They imagined these events, like the Crucifixion, would become a permanent part of human memory.

They were wrong. We’re now cheerfully pissing away the greatest achievement of American history, the work of generations, achieved at incalculable cost in life and treasure: a free, united, secure, and prosperous Western world. The 20th century has been forgotten. No one learned a thing from it.

Remember, World War I was called "The War to End All Wars" before WWII came along.

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:10 pm

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:08 pm I've said this in other threads as part of other discussions, but when future generations are able to string all this together into a historical narrative, it's going to be fascinating to read. Living during the time that it's happening, in the country that is currently spiraling out of control? Not so much.

There you go again assuming that there will be future generations who can read.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:13 pm

Well, to be clear, I wasn't presuming it would be anyone living in what was America.

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:16 pm

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:13 pm Well, to be clear, I wasn't presuming it would be anyone living in what was America.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:36 pm

As Trump arrives in Brussels for NATO summit, the Senate just passed, 97-2, a motion to "reaffirm the ironclad US commitment under Article 5 to the collective defense of the alliance," as @SenJackReed put it earlier today

(The two are Rand Paul & Mike Lee.)

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:02 pm

Holman wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:36 pm(The two are Rand Paul & Mike Lee.)

WTF is their problem?

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:10 pm

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:02 pm
Holman wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:36 pm(The two are Rand Paul & Mike Lee.)
WTF is their problem?

Rand Paul is a consummate asshole, and Mike Lee is bitter about not getting a SCOTUS nod.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:14 pm

Skinypupy wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 9:10 pmRand Paul is a consummate asshole, and Mike Lee is bitter about not getting a SCOTUS nod.

It boggles the mind:

NATO invoked Article 5 for the first time in its history after the 9/11 terrorist attacks against the United States.

Just once I'd like a reporter to ask either one just what in the actual fuck is wrong with them.

Daveman · Post by **Daveman** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:11 am

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/donald-tru ... 018-07-11/

No puppet, you're the puppet!

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:32 am

video

Pay attention to Kelly's and Hutchinson's (US ambassador to NATO) faces.

Trump is absolutely Putin's stooge here.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:41 am

Right, Putin's stooge is mocking the EU for being unwilling to detach from the Russian oil/gas teet.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:01 am

Rip wrote: ↑Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:41 am Right, Putin's stooge is mocking the EU for being unwilling to detach from the Russian oil/gas teet.

You're not really that dense.

Trump is there to sow chaos, disrupt NATO, and throw a smokescreen over his own dealings with Putin. If he really thought Russia was a threat, wouldn't he at some point criticize Putin instead of constantly praising him while dumping on our allies?

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:10 am

link

Merkel slaps at Trump's assertion Germany is "captive" to Russia, reminding him that she grew up in a country that WAS under the sway of the Kremlin, East Germany. “I am very happy today that we are united in freedom as the Federal Republic of Germany." https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/eu ... 4d6d5c4c46 …

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:39 am

I think we’ve all learned by now that Trump’s insults are an indication of either what he himself is guilty of and/or insecure. It’s the whole elementary school mentality of if you say it first you can’t be accused of it back.

Captain Caveman · Post by **Captain Caveman** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:45 am

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:39 am I think we’ve all learned by now that Trump’s insults are an indication of either what he himself is guilty of and/or insecure. It’s the whole elementary school mentality of if you say it first you can’t be accused of it back.

It's to muddy the waters, to attack truth, to make partisans take sides. It's strategic, not just projection.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:20 am

Rip wrote: ↑Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:41 am Right, Putin's stooge is mocking the EU for being unwilling to detach from the Russian oil/gas teet.

Seriously dude, surely you're not that stupid and/or blind? Do you at least agree Putin's primary foreign policy goal for the past decade has been to disrupt and sow discord within NATO, and specifically the US, so Russia is more free to do what it wants (hint: more land grabbing, for starters)?

Fitzy · Post by **Fitzy** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:20 am

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:29 pm Prior to WWII the us was isolationist. That's not ancient history. It's not hard to imagine a US huddled in on itself. What *is* hard to imagine is a prosperous US huddled in on itself.

Huh? Right before WWII was the most prosperous time in US history...

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:33 am

Fitzy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:20 am
GreenGoo wrote: ↑Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:29 pm Prior to WWII the us was isolationist. That's not ancient history. It's not hard to imagine a US huddled in on itself. What *is* hard to imagine is a prosperous US huddled in on itself.
Huh? Right before WWII was the most prosperous time in US history...

The years of the Great Depression are considered prosperous?

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:43 am

Fitzy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:20 am Huh? Right before WWII was the most prosperous time in US history...

The most prosperous time in US history was after WW2 (the 50s I believe is considered the start golden age of the US economy before it went into the shitter in the 1970s).