[Kickstarter] Bard's Tale IV and Bard's Tale Trilogy Remastered by inXile

MonkeyFinger · Post by **MonkeyFinger** » Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:25 am

ColdSteel wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:19 am
Sepiche wrote: ↑Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:36 pm Even if you roll a new party, don't delete the bard that starts out in the adventurer's guild... add him to your party, transfer his fire horn to someone else, and then add your bard back to the party and give him the fire horn. It's an easter egg from the original game that you had access to a good instrument at the start
Thanks for this tip. I'd been running back to the inn after every fight to take a drink. I think I remember it has limited uses though, right? Also, I don't see any way to transfer equipment to a character other than them equipping it? It seems to be a shared inventory system. I last played this 40 years ago in the 80s so my memory of it is pretty fuzzy now.

Same here and my memory of it is totally fuzzy now.

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:33 am

So, wait, I won't need my graph paper to play this again now?

I'm late to the party, but excited to see it come around. Paid in full and waiting install.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:16 am

ColdSteel wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:19 am
Sepiche wrote: ↑Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:36 pm Even if you roll a new party, don't delete the bard that starts out in the adventurer's guild... add him to your party, transfer his fire horn to someone else, and then add your bard back to the party and give him the fire horn. It's an easter egg from the original game that you had access to a good instrument at the start
Thanks for this tip. I'd been running back to the inn after every fight to take a drink. I think I remember it has limited uses though, right? Also, I don't see any way to transfer equipment to a character other than them equipping it? It seems to be a shared inventory system. I last played this 40 years ago in the 80s so my memory of it is pretty fuzzy now.

Yeah, it has limited charges, although I can't recall how many. I think it was quite a few.

To transfer the fire horn, add the default bard to your party and unequip the fire horn. It will go into your party inventory and then you can remove the bard, add your own, and equip it on him.

Cortilian · Post by **Cortilian** » Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:35 am

Sepiche wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:16 am
ColdSteel wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:19 am
Sepiche wrote: ↑Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:36 pm Even if you roll a new party, don't delete the bard that starts out in the adventurer's guild... add him to your party, transfer his fire horn to someone else, and then add your bard back to the party and give him the fire horn. It's an easter egg from the original game that you had access to a good instrument at the start
Thanks for this tip. I'd been running back to the inn after every fight to take a drink. I think I remember it has limited uses though, right? Also, I don't see any way to transfer equipment to a character other than them equipping it? It seems to be a shared inventory system. I last played this 40 years ago in the 80s so my memory of it is pretty fuzzy now.
Yeah, it has limited charges, although I can't recall how many. I think it was quite a few.

To transfer the fire horn, add the default bard to your party and unequip the fire horn. It will go into your party inventory and then you can remove the bard, add your own, and equip it on him.

Regarding the Fire Horn. You can sell it at the shop for 700G. He will charge it to full and you can then buy it back for like 1200G.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:48 am

Sepiche wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:16 am To transfer the fire horn, add the default bard to your party and unequip the fire horn. It will go into your party inventory and then you can remove the bard, add your own, and equip it on him.

Yeah, that's what I did and it worked fine. But for some of the other stuff he had equipped, that didn't work. He also had a war axe and chain mail and even though they had been unequipped, no one else could see them or equip them. I tried equipping and unequipping them again on him a few times and then the other characters could see and equip them. Weird. I wasn't sure if it was a bug or if I was just missing something I was supposed to be doing.

Cortilian wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:35 am Regarding the Fire Horn. You can sell it at the shop for 700G. He will charge it to full and you can then buy it back for like 1200G.

Now that is a very handy tip. Thanks! It has 50 charges but I can see how those could go pretty fast with all the encounters. Hopefully it lasts until I can find a bardsword. If not, I'll try this.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:07 pm

Wow, just spent about 45 minutes with this, and I think I will be playing this one all the way through. WELL DONE! I've tried playing the freebie flash remakes of this before, but never really clicked. While BT1 introduced me to the series obviously, I adored the following two games even more due to the addition of some cool gameplay elements like range, etc. Can't wait for 2 and 3 to drop.

Baroquen · Post by **Baroquen** » Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:25 pm

Cortilian wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:35 am
Regarding the Fire Horn. You can sell it at the shop for 700G. He will charge it to full and you can then buy it back for like 1200G.

Oooo... thanks for this tip. Didn't know this one.

I can't help with the equipment question as I had no trouble getting the stuff off the pre-made party. I had created 2 new characters, added them to the party unequipped all of the pre-made characters stuff. Removed the A-team. Added my other new characters and equipped all of the free items.

I'm at mostly level 3 characters now (though the bard might be the third one after the first two died, and my magician is relatively new too).

Next thing I need to read up on, because I forget what is recommended, is if and when to change classes. I also think it's about time to check out the sewers just to change things up. (That or nighttime prowling around town).

Cortilian · Post by **Cortilian** » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:08 pm

Baroquen wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:25 pm
Cortilian wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:35 am
Regarding the Fire Horn. You can sell it at the shop for 700G. He will charge it to full and you can then buy it back for like 1200G.
Oooo... thanks for this tip. Didn't know this one.

I can't help with the equipment question as I had no trouble getting the stuff off the pre-made party. I had created 2 new characters, added them to the party unequipped all of the pre-made characters stuff. Removed the A-team. Added my other new characters and equipped all of the free items.

I'm at mostly level 3 characters now (though the bard might be the third one after the first two died, and my magician is relatively new too).

Next thing I need to read up on, because I forget what is recommended, is if and when to change classes. I also think it's about time to check out the sewers just to change things up. (That or nighttime prowling around town).

You switch your mages classes when they hit level 13 and have learned 7th level spells.

infinitelurker · Post by **infinitelurker** » Fri Aug 17, 2018 5:25 pm

Baroquen wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 4:25 pm
Cortilian wrote: ↑Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:35 am
Regarding the Fire Horn. You can sell it at the shop for 700G. He will charge it to full and you can then buy it back for like 1200G.
Oooo... thanks for this tip. Didn't know this one.

I didn't know that either! I'd been hording the uses awaiting really large groups, but knowing that, I'll be firing away, and my bard will finally do some real damage!

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Fri Aug 17, 2018 6:48 pm

Another tip - remove weapons from your monk around level 6, but you can keep the armor (even though manual seems to hint to remove armor as well) since it stacks with his/her bonus.

Also, they added SOME of the functionality of the rogue class from BT3 into this version, since otherwise it's pretty much worthless (to have a rogue in BT1).

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:52 am

This is a fantastic remake. What classes are everyone rolling with? 6 members or 7? Did you reroll your party for an hour like me?

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Sat Aug 18, 2018 12:02 pm

I started out with 2 dwarves (warrior and paladin), two elves (conjurers) 2 humans (monk and bard). I initially left the 7th slot open but since I don't think you get decent summons until very late in the game I went ahead and filled it a bit later with an elf magician. I figure he'll be more useful in the long run than any summons. Everyone's level 5 now except the magician who's level 4.

And yes, I spent a lot of time rolling like you did. I actually enjoy rpgs that allow that.

infinitelurker · Post by **infinitelurker** » Sat Aug 18, 2018 12:06 pm

morlac wrote: ↑Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:52 am This is a fantastic remake. What classes are everyone rolling with? 6 members or 7? Did you reroll your party for an hour like me?

I went with 6, and rolled a Monk, Paladin, Hunter, Bard, Conjurer and Magician. I'm 7 hours in so far, and just nearly finished the sewers and have dipped a toe in the catacombs. All at level 11. My monk is just an instant killing machine, and now knowing the recharge trick for the fire horn, I'm able to stay in the dungeons a bit longer before going out to recharge.

I love the little detail of the mini-map working differently if you have cast the compass spell or not.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Sat Aug 18, 2018 12:25 pm

morlac wrote: ↑Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:52 am This is a fantastic remake. What classes are everyone rolling with? 6 members or 7? Did you reroll your party for an hour like me?

I went with:
1x Human Warrior
1x Dwarven Paladin
1x Half Elf Monk
1x Elf Bard
1x Elf Conjuror
1x Elf Magician

I probably should have rolled my warriors stats a bit more... they're fine, but his strength and con are a little lower than I would like. Everyone else's stats are pretty solid though. I also originally started with a Rogue, but even with the improvements to hide in shadows he couldn't put out the damage my warrior and monk were putting out, and my conjuror was better at taking care of traps (even if it costs 2 SP per trap), so I replaced him with a Paladin. Seems like a good trade so far.

I like leaving the 7th slot open for summons and the random monster. For a lot of the sewers I had a sorcerer in my party that was constantly helping me by casting AOE spells, and it was a big boost to my party.

stimpy · Post by **stimpy** » Sat Aug 18, 2018 1:11 pm

Sepiche wrote: ↑Thu Aug 16, 2018 2:46 pm By the by... looks like I forgot I'm also due a Steam key for the remastered 1-3 from backing The Bard's Tale 4. Anyone interested in a free copy just quote me here and I'll PM it to you. First come, first served!

Ya know.....I qouted this as soon as you posted it. Then it dawned on me that I may already have it in Steam.
I checked and sure enough.....The Bards Tale Remastered and Resnarkled was there in my library.
I had played it for like 25 hours or so and then moved on.
Then I saw something in this thread about only Remastered 1 being released so far, so I dug deeper and realized that this The Bards Tale Remastered and the The Bards Tale Remastered I have are not the same The Bards Tale Remastered.

Confusing?? Um....yea.....
This looks like a The Bards Tale remastered I'd be much more interested in.
Should have left the quoted post...….

Baroquen · Post by **Baroquen** » Sat Aug 18, 2018 2:27 pm

I went with Paladin, Monk, Bard, Hunter, 2 Conjurers and 1 Magician. All are level five now, and I'm exploring the sewers.

I still hate Darkness spaces.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Sat Aug 18, 2018 2:56 pm

I love how powerful magic users get in this. I just ran into the room in the catacombs with 66 skeletons in it. One dragon's breath later... ~4000 gold.

infinitelurker · Post by **infinitelurker** » Sat Aug 18, 2018 3:26 pm

Another quality of life improvement: I finally got the apport arcane spell (teleport anywhere in a dungeon), and the journal has a button within it to cast and click on the map to go there!

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:47 pm

Hmm, so the consensus is for no rogues even with the hide in shadows? Not worried about traps?

I went

Hum Pally
Dwarf War
Hobbit Rogue
Elf Bard
Gnome Conj
Elf Magi

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:49 pm

Yeah, the consensus has always been that rogues are pretty well useless in the first Bard's tale. As for traps, the conjurer's TrapZap does as good or better disarming traps than the rogue does. I'd replace him with a monk. They're killing machines that can't be hit once they get some levels. Put some leather armor on them and give them a weapon until around level 5 then remove the weapon and go with gloves only and watch him kill everything.

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Sun Aug 19, 2018 11:38 am

They did add most of the additonal thief abilities that came in BT 2 and 3. You can hide in shadows and get an instant crit on next hit and also attack mobs at 20' back. They also upped the succes chance of disarming traps (beta update). Im at 95% disarm on level 1 of cellar, thief is level 5. 85% at level 2.

Class is still lakcing but they are actively tweaking it. Looking into having them detect and disarm dungeon traps, having a percantage chance to start combat in shadows and have percantage chance to stay in shadows after attacking. That being said hes my only character to die so far and I have recruited a dwarf hunter to level up just in case.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Sun Aug 19, 2018 2:55 pm

morlac wrote: ↑Sun Aug 19, 2018 11:38 am Class is still lacking but they are actively tweaking it. Looking into having them detect and disarm dungeon traps, having a percentage chance to start combat in shadows and have percentage chance to stay in shadows after attacking. That being said hes my only character to die so far and I have recruited a dwarf hunter to level up just in case.

It's better than it used to be, but the main problem is my fighters can hit an enemy multiple times per attack each round, usually killing whatever they are attacking, while my rogue takes 2 turns to kill one target, and that's assuming he actually makes his hide check. On the trap front it's a chance of success compared to the guaranteed success of a mage, and given how powerful some of the traps are, I'd rather have a sure thing.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Sun Aug 19, 2018 3:52 pm

Now that I’ve seen what this team can do to really old games, I’d love to play Might and Magic III remade by them. And Fallout. And Wasteland. And Eye of the Beholder, and...

Redfive · Post by **Redfive** » Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:55 pm

Picked it up on a whim as well.

I had an IBM PC in the 80s and I could be wrong, but I don't think these games were even available for it. In any case, I never played them.

I played Dragon Wars in the 90s which I understand is something of a spiritual successor, but I didn't finish it.

Fardaza · Post by **Fardaza** » Sun Aug 19, 2018 8:53 pm

Redfive wrote: ↑Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:55 pm Picked it up on a whim as well.

I had an IBM PC in the 80s and I could be wrong, but I don't think these games were even available for it. In any case, I never played them.

I played Dragon Wars in the 90s which I understand is something of a spiritual successor, but I didn't finish it.

My brother had it on his IBM around '86 or '87, and I had it on my Atari 1040ST. We were playing in separate rooms. He walked in to see how I was coming, and I still remember his shocked remark, "Your music has chords!"

Baroquen · Post by **Baroquen** » Sun Aug 19, 2018 10:54 pm

Redfive wrote: ↑Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:55 pm Picked it up on a whim as well.

I had an IBM PC in the 80s and I could be wrong, but I don't think these games were even available for it. In any case, I never played them.

I played Dragon Wars in the 90s which I understand is something of a spiritual successor, but I didn't finish it.

I remember being disappointed in Dragon Wars (but that's about all I remember about it).

Redfive · Post by **Redfive** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:53 am

Fardaza wrote: ↑Sun Aug 19, 2018 8:53 pm
Redfive wrote: ↑Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:55 pm Picked it up on a whim as well.

I had an IBM PC in the 80s and I could be wrong, but I don't think these games were even available for it. In any case, I never played them.

I played Dragon Wars in the 90s which I understand is something of a spiritual successor, but I didn't finish it.
My brother had it on his IBM around '86 or '87, and I had it on my Atari 1040ST. We were playing in separate rooms. He walked in to see how I was coming, and I still remember his shocked remark, "Your music has chords!"

Then I guess I just missed it. The only 'real' rpgs I ever played on our IBM PC were the early gold box games.

I thought Dragon Wars was pretty good but, like most games, I never finished it.

Cort showed me a screenshot last night of his party about 15 hours in and he estimates he'll be done in another 5 hours or so. That seems doable for sure, maybe I'll finish it after all these years!

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:14 am

I think I will stop and wait for the patch to come out, there's a lot of stuff they are working on.

Also, after trying a few parties of 7, I will definitely be dropping down to the 6, to leave room for any NPC crazy enough to want to join my ragtag band of lesbian dungeoneers with deathwishes. All women this go-around:

Warrior
Pally
Monk
Bard
Conj
Mag

Bonus for going with fewer characters is the additional XP for each of course, so you will level faster.

As a side note, if you haven't read the mostly positive comments on the Steam discussion board for this game, there is quite a bit of clamoring to get the devs to redo several older games, now that everyone sees they have the chops. I wouldn't say the devs are all over the board, but they are definitely present, and answering some of the better questions.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:59 am

I remember being starved for cash, but owch! I am constantly in need due to healing costs. Poison and Petrification are evil old school.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 11:04 am

Zarathud wrote: ↑Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:59 am I remember being starved for cash, but owch! I am constantly in need due to healing costs. Poison and Petrification are evil old school.

Poison you should be able to fix with a 4th level magician spell I think? Might be a conjuror spell... I mix those up sometimes.

I was having lots of money issues early on, but once I started running the catacombs money really started pouring in (to be quickly spent teaching my mages more spells). I mentioned it up thread, but those rooms in the catacombs with like 50 - 60 skeletons are bank. At around level 12 with the bard +AC song running I was able to dodge all the attacks they made in the first round before my AOEs landed to finish them all off.

Cortilian · Post by **Cortilian** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 11:04 am

Still thoroughly enjoying this. This brings back a bunch of memories. I'm currently about 15 hours in as noted by Redfive and just started the 2nd floor of Mangar's tower. I know I spent at least 60-70 hours on the original just to beat it the 1st time. Automapping does make it MUCH faster, as does 7 toons to start. Currently using 3 Monks, 1 Bard and 3 casters. 3 more floors to go and then wait for BT II to come out.

I would pay full price for these guys to redo Ultima III or IV. Full price, I say!

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 11:06 am

Cortilian wrote: ↑Mon Aug 20, 2018 11:04 am Still thoroughly enjoying this. This brings back a bunch of memories. I'm currently about 15 hours in as noted by Redfive and just started the 2nd floor of Mangar's tower. I know I spent at least 60-70 hours on the original just to beat it the 1st time. Automapping does make it MUCH faster, as does 7 toons to start. Currently using 3 Monks, 1 Bard and 3 casters. 3 more floors to go and then wait for BT II to come out.

I would pay full price for these guys to redo Ultima III or IV. Full price, I say!

Yeah, it's amazing how much less of a chore the game feels like with the automapping. I picked up the Bard's Tale ARPG game a bit back for the sole reason of playing the original Bard's Tale copy that came with it, but man it was a slog without the nice, new features in this update.

DOS=HIGH · Post by **DOS=HIGH** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:30 pm

I almost gave away my key, glad I didn't. Somehow I refrained myself from re-rolling each character for 20 minutes and just accepted when I had high points in the most relevant stats for the class. I was reading some of Interplay's tips from the original release:

1. Don't be concerned about losing a Level 1 character. Just make another one. But when your characters reach the 3rd level, back them up regularly using your favorite disk copy program.

2. If your favorite character gets killed, there are several things you can do. You can resurrect him by magic or in a temple by spending spell points or gold. You can turn off the computer and reboot, and your entire party will be restored, but without the experience, gold and magic items they have won since the last time you save game. Or you can load the character from your back-up disk onto the main disk, after first deleting the dead character from your main disk.

I wonder how many millennials will read these and go "WTF are they talking about?'

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:16 pm

DOS=HIGH wrote: ↑Mon Aug 20, 2018 1:30 pm I almost gave away my key, glad I didn't. Somehow I refrained myself from re-rolling each character for 20 minutes and just accepted when I had high points in the most relevant stats for the class. I was reading some of Interplay's tips from the original release:

1. Don't be concerned about losing a Level 1 character. Just make another one. But when your characters reach the 3rd level, back them up regularly using your favorite disk copy program.

2. If your favorite character gets killed, there are several things you can do. You can resurrect him by magic or in a temple by spending spell points or gold. You can turn off the computer and reboot, and your entire party will be restored, but without the experience, gold and magic items they have won since the last time you save game. Or you can load the character from your back-up disk onto the main disk, after first deleting the dead character from your main disk.

I wonder how many millennials will read these and go "WTF are they talking about?'

Ha! I was reading that last night and smiling. Especially the part about "just turn your computer off"!!

Note that a lot of the information in that original manual is not accurate for this remake. I think they are working on some kind of revised manual.

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:12 pm

They have been hinting that the Gold Box games are their next target but not until 2019 as they are booked up through the year. I would be down with that right after they finish up Autoduel.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 4:29 pm

morlac wrote: ↑Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:12 pm They have been hinting that the Gold Box games are their next target but not until 2019 as they are booked up through the year. I would be down with that right after they finish up Autoduel.

Man, I'd be all over updated Gold Box games.

I've been slowly playing the GoG versions with the intent on finally beating all 4 in the main series with the party I started in PoR, but I'd definitely restart if we got an updated version. When I was younger I started with the same goal of playing through all 4 games and things were going well until I got to Pool of Darkness with my party only to realize with the racial level restrictions my non-human party members were screwed.

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:13 pm

Your tolerance for pain is better than mine. I tried to play POR a few months ago but couldn't get past rolling a party.

Low Magic Age recaptures some of that; adding more combat tactics but no story unfortunately.

stimpy · Post by **stimpy** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:42 pm

So I got this.
Is the default party good to start with or should I roll my own. If I roll my own, what classes and skill points should I start with?

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:48 pm

IMO, roll your own. For beginners, it’s recommended to use 3 spellcasters (put them in the back). A bard, and your choice of 3 fighters up front.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:00 pm

stimpy wrote: ↑Mon Aug 20, 2018 7:42 pm So I got this.
Is the default party good to start with or should I roll my own. If I roll my own, what classes and skill points should I start with?

Default party is perfectly fine IIRC if you don't want to bother with new characters.

There's a lot of debate about the perfect party, but a few key things:
- At least 2 magic users: 1 conjuror and 1 magician. Some people play with 3 as they get very powerful in the late game.

- Some people take a bard, some don't. They aren't required, but they do have some nice buffs that make up for their lack of weapon skills. You can also get a firehorn off the default bard and give it to yours as it has a powerful attack in the early game.

- Some take a rogue, some don't. They bring some handy skills, notably disarming traps which otherwise costs your magician spell points, but they still don't hit as hard as other classes.

- The remainder can be fighter classes. Warriors, Monks, and Paladins are all solid choices.

- I haven't tried a hunter myself, but I've heard they can hold their own in damage.

- You can take a 7th character if you'd like, but it's not required to beat the game, your party will level a little slower, and you can't use summons which get pretty powerful in the late game.