Gun Politics

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Jaymann
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Jaymann »

How is TSA going to detect plastic guns?
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Jaymann wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:36 pm How is TSA going to detect plastic guns?
By the bullets.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Punisher »

LawBeefaroni wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:06 pm
Jaymann wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:36 pm How is TSA going to detect plastic guns?
By the bullets.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by GreenGoo »

em2nought wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 2:35 pm NPR says the US gov't has been inflating the number of reported school shootings by 66%. WOW

This is the same US gov't that refuses to collect or analyze gun violence data? Is the US gov't multiple personalities?
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Punisher wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 10:34 pm
LawBeefaroni wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:06 pm
Jaymann wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:36 pm How is TSA going to detect plastic guns?
By the bullets.
https://www.sportsmanswarehouse.com/spo ... ekQAvD_BwE
Casings still have to be brass or steel or aluminum and are pretty hard to miss. But good luck with rubber bullets in plastic casings in plastic gun.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by GreenGoo »

Chemical sniffers. Which of course are cheap and super convenient.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Paingod »

Jaymann wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:36 pmHow is TSA going to detect plastic guns?
They won't. Soon we're all going to be required to climb naked into hermetically sealed containers so we can be shipped like cargo. Just hope your wife and kids get shipped to the right vacation destination.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Fitzy »

Paingod wrote: Wed Aug 29, 2018 9:33 am
Jaymann wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:36 pmHow is TSA going to detect plastic guns?
They won't. Soon we're all going to be required to climb naked into hermetically sealed containers so we can be shipped like cargo. Just hope your wife and kids get shipped to the right vacation destination.
That actually sounds more comfortable than current economy class seats.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Punisher »

LawBeefaroni wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:50 pm
Punisher wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 10:34 pm
LawBeefaroni wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:06 pm
Jaymann wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:36 pm How is TSA going to detect plastic guns?
By the bullets.
https://www.sportsmanswarehouse.com/spo ... ekQAvD_BwE
Casings still have to be brass or steel or aluminum and are pretty hard to miss. But good luck with rubber bullets in plastic casings in plastic gun.
Between that and the resin gun powder I will print out, I will be undetectable!!
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by UsulofDoom »

Jaymann wrote: Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:36 pm How is TSA going to detect plastic guns?
Same way they detect mini repeating crossbows.


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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Max Peck »

What's the protocol for this? Will people be burning their jeans or simply shooting holes in them?

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Re: Gun Politics

Post by em2nought »

Max Peck wrote: Thu Sep 06, 2018 11:31 pm What's the protocol for this? Will people be burning their jeans or simply shooting holes in them?
I"ll take "letting loose their bowels in them" for $100. :mrgreen:
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Had a pretty amazing weekend at an unbelievable police/federal agent training facility. There's a lot I'm still unpacking but the most revelatory part was the training simulator (VirTra and Ti for anyone interested).

We did de-escalation and shoot/don't shoot stuff. I "aced" all the de-escalation and shooting but the AAR was crazy. People were asking if I noticed X or heard Y and I didn't. I mean things like gunshots behind me. The whole 80% auditory exclusion thing seemed like BS but I can now say it's true. It's absolutely amazing how your perception changes in a simulated deadly force encounter, can't imagine a real one.

I mean one scenario I could recall the interest rates a bank teller was quoting and what kind of gun a guy flashed but couldn't remember if the teller was black or white or what the shooter was wearing. I didn't hear (or remember?) the aforementioned gunshots as I was assessing the threat.


I think everyone from legislators to gun owners to anti-gun advocates need to go through at least a minimal amount of some kind of training. At the very least to be able to speak the same language.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by GreenGoo »

LawBeefaroni wrote: Tue Sep 11, 2018 12:25 pm The whole 80% auditory exclusion thing seemed like BS but I can now say it's true. It's absolutely amazing how your perception changes in a simulated deadly force encounter, can't imagine a real one.
First, very cool experience. Totally awesome.

Second, I can attest through video game experience and video evidence (confirming what got missed) that when under pressure (real pressure despite simulation of events) all sorts of things get excluded from your brain as your focus narrows to a needle's point on what matters "in the moment".

While understanding that things get missed in general, I am now certain that under extreme pressure like you're describing, entire events will go unacknowledged or even sensed and without some form of "proof" the person in question might even deny their existence. :oops:
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by em2nought »

LawBeefaroni wrote: Tue Sep 11, 2018 12:25 pm We did de-escalation and shoot/don't shoot stuff. I "aced" all the de-escalation and shooting but the AAR was crazy. People were asking if I noticed X or heard Y and I didn't. I mean things like gunshots behind me. The whole 80% auditory exclusion thing seemed like BS but I can now say it's true. It's absolutely amazing how your perception changes in a simulated deadly force encounter, can't imagine a real one.

I mean one scenario I could recall the interest rates a bank teller was quoting and what kind of gun a guy flashed but couldn't remember if the teller was black or white or what the shooter was wearing. I didn't hear (or remember?) the aforementioned gunshots as I was assessing the threat.
This sounded so familiar, I knew I had just read something akin to it the night before http://www.bbc.com/future/story/2017071 ... a-disaster
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Reading an article about something else, I saw these stats:
There have been about 40 shootings by people with concealed carry licenses since Illinois became the last state to allow them four years ago, according to a recent Tribune analysis.

The review found that most of the shootings have been in public places in the Chicago area, and half the cases have involved concealed carry holders firing to defend themselves or someone else from robbers. At least 11 people have been killed, including a man with a license who tried to fend off carjackers on the West Side.

More than 265,000 people have licenses to carry concealed guns in Illinois, about 2 percent of the adult population. Cook County, the state’s most populous county, has nearly 74,000 holders of conceal carry licenses.
In perspective, that's roughly the ususl casualty and body count of one weekend in Cook County by unlicensed/illegal firearm users.

4 years, 265,000 individuals. All with guns, most probably carrying at least a few days a week. And at least half the shootings in self defense against armed robbery alone. I remember predictions 4 years ago of blood in the streets and every car horn honk ending is a shootout. Hasn't happened.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Paingod »

Vice Reporter: There's something profoundly fucked up about shooting a backpack.

The Disturbing Reality of Bulletproof Backpacks
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by em2nought »

Paingod wrote: Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:24 am Vice Reporter: There's something profoundly fucked up about shooting a backpack.
Cool, I can use my ink rewards at Office Depot to get one!

Meanwhile leftist France considers arming all municipal police with firearms. :shock:
https://www.thelocal.fr/20180911/all-po ... carry-guns
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by hepcat »

Gun control doesn’t mean disarming the police. You know that, right? Not all people who didn’t vote for the Orange Klansman are advocating a total ban. Just as not all those who did are racist pieces of human waste.

I hope.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Kraken »

Another story flying under the radar: The NRA is lying low.
the midterm elections Tuesday could show a weakening of the gun lobby’s grip on US politics, with Democrats in key districts openly campaigning on the issue of gun control, some Republicans in retreat, and the NRA hamstrung financially.

Already vulnerable Republicans in swing districts have distanced themselves from the National Rifle Association, downplaying their top ratings that long were a political boon. And the NRA has drastically cut back political spending this cycle, leaving openings for newly energized gun control groups to run emotional ads attacking Republicans over gun violence.

“What you’re witnessing is a sea change in our politics,” said Peter Ambler, executive director of the gun control group founded by former congresswoman Gabby Giffords.
I hope that indicates a real trend, and not just a temporary election tactic.
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Re: Gun Politics

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Not holding my breath.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Anti gun groups are winning in the fundraising battle and the NRA appears to be turtling up to save resources.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Daehawk »

I hope the dems dont start spouting gun control again. It never helps them and hurts I think. im dem but do not want more gun control. Its already good and yet people die. More wont help. If they start spouting it now it will hurt them.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Kraken »

Daehawk wrote: Sun Nov 04, 2018 10:51 am I hope the dems dont start spouting gun control again. It never helps them and hurts I think. im dem but do not want more gun control. Its already good and yet people die. More wont help. If they start spouting it now it will hurt them.
Dem candidates are using gun control to good advantage. A large majority of Americans, including most gun owners, support common-sense measures like expanded background checks.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by Isgrimnur »

WaPo, Dianne Feinstein
The Justice Department issued a regulation Tuesday banning bump-fire stocks, devices that can essentially transform semiautomatic weapons, such as an AR-15, into automatic rifles that fire at a rate of between 400 and 800 rounds per minute. These devices can inflict absolute carnage, as they did in October 2017, when a gunman killed 58 people at a concert in Las Vegas.

Support for banning bump stocks is widespread, and it’s encouraging to see the Trump administration take action on gun safety.

But let’s not celebrate too quickly. Presidents can rescind regulations just as easily as they create them, and in this case, the bump stock ban will likely be tied up in court for years. Only hours after the Trump administration released its final regulation, Gun Owners of America announced it would file a lawsuit.
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by LawBeefaroni »

A Florida investigative panel charged with studying the rampage that left 17 people dead at a Parkland high school last year has recommended arming teachers, reigniting debate over the controversial strategy that has drawn vigorous support from President Donald Trump.

The Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School Public Safety Commission also criticized the response of school staff and the Broward County Sheriff's Office to the Valentine's Day carnage.

The commission's 15 members issued a unanimously approved, 439-page preliminary report Wednesday aimed at preventing similar attacks and improving the response should they occur. The report and its recommendations were sent to the governor's office and Legislature for consideration.
Story includes link to the report.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by GreenGoo »

Next up, childcare workers.

After that, nurses.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by YellowKing »

Usually the people that support arming teachers are incapable of putting themselves into the shoes of another person, and thus can't understand that not everybody wants to be a gun-toting, criminal shooting bad-ass.

There's also the idea that at the cost of preventing one rare occurrence of someone bringing a gun onto campus, we're literally putting dozens of firearms on school property where they can be wrestled away, stolen, or otherwise utilized as weapons of opportunity.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by msteelers »

LawBeefaroni wrote: Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:56 pm
A Florida investigative panel charged with studying the rampage that left 17 people dead at a Parkland high school last year has recommended arming teachers, reigniting debate over the controversial strategy that has drawn vigorous support from President Donald Trump.

The Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School Public Safety Commission also criticized the response of school staff and the Broward County Sheriff's Office to the Valentine's Day carnage.

The commission's 15 members issued a unanimously approved, 439-page preliminary report Wednesday aimed at preventing similar attacks and improving the response should they occur. The report and its recommendations were sent to the governor's office and Legislature for consideration.
Story includes link to the report.
I'm not surprised. The majority of the members on the commission are from some deeply Republican areas of the state, and there are a few real conservative firebrands there as well.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by em2nought »

YellowKing wrote: Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:47 pm Usually the people that support arming teachers are incapable of putting themselves into the shoes of another person, and thus can't understand that not everybody wants to be a gun-toting, criminal shooting bad-ass.
It's funny that you think arming teachers is actually about arming "current" teachers instead of being about replacing liberals with educators of a more conservative bent. Two birds, one stone. :wink: We can be devious too! :wink:
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Re: Gun Politics

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Tenure is your friend.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by GreenGoo »

Jaymann wrote: Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:57 am Tenure is your friend.
Hilarious that anyone (not you) thinks there is a glut of conservative (or any political view really) educators on the bench with their guns, just waiting a chance get in there and show coach just what they've got.

High.
Larry.
Us.

Even better, much of the predicted job growth in education is expected in the areas of science, math and technology. I don't see US flavoured Christianity in there anywhere. Not exactly gun toting conservatives strong suit.

For any actual gun toting conservatives reading this, it's rhetoric for fun.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by LawBeefaroni »

GreenGoo wrote: Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:11 pm
Jaymann wrote: Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:57 am Tenure is your friend.
Hilarious that anyone (not you) thinks there is a glut of conservative (or any political view really) educators on the bench with their guns, just waiting a chance get in there and show coach just what they've got.

High.
Larry.
Us.

Even better, much of the predicted job growth in education is expected in the areas of science, math and technology. I don't see US flavoured Christianity in there anywhere. Not exactly gun toting conservatives strong suit.

For any actual gun toting conservatives reading this, it's rhetoric for fun.
OTOH, what a better way to change the makeup of educators than to require FA training/carrying?

Would that drive qualified teachers away? There's no shortage of unemployed folks with guns and some shootin' experience to take their place.

What if the most important qualification for teaching geometey wasn't knowing geometry but shooting a 95? What if ballistics was the primary pretequisite for physics?
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by GreenGoo »

What if your scenario is pretty much the end of the US as the world knows it.

I can't think of a worse scenario than replacing a country's educators who love teaching with people who meet certain political ideologies as primary qualification.

I'm quite sure there are people willing to be armed in school from both sides of the aisle, I just don't think there is anywhere near enough qualified and motivated (to educate) people willing to do so.

You're already seeing what happens when an education system starts to tear at the seams in places like Texas where facts need to meet certain viewpoints before they can be included in textbooks.

That way lies ignorance, and the only thing a country draped in ignorance can be a world leader of is zealotry. Might as well hand off the technology mantle to the Chinese on the day wearing a gun in school is a requirement.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by YellowKing »

Lawbeefaroni wrote:Would that drive qualified teachers away? There's no shortage of unemployed folks with guns and some shootin' experience to take their place.
We have teacher shortages NOW, even before you start restricting the profession to people who are willing to carry a gun and shoot people.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by hepcat »

em2nought wrote: Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:54 am
YellowKing wrote: Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:47 pm Usually the people that support arming teachers are incapable of putting themselves into the shoes of another person, and thus can't understand that not everybody wants to be a gun-toting, criminal shooting bad-ass.
It's funny that you think arming teachers is actually about arming "current" teachers instead of being about replacing liberals with educators of a more conservative bent. Two birds, one stone. :wink: We can be devious too! :wink:
Please. At best you folks are Wile E. Coyote devious.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by em2nought »

hepcat wrote: Fri Jan 04, 2019 4:38 pm
em2nought wrote: Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:54 am
YellowKing wrote: Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:47 pm Usually the people that support arming teachers are incapable of putting themselves into the shoes of another person, and thus can't understand that not everybody wants to be a gun-toting, criminal shooting bad-ass.
It's funny that you think arming teachers is actually about arming "current" teachers instead of being about replacing liberals with educators of a more conservative bent. Two birds, one stone. :wink: We can be devious too! :wink:
Please. At best you folks are Wile E. Coyote devious.
That's true, we are amateurs at foul play, the folks you good fellas throw your lot in with are definitely the masters. :wink:
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by LordMortis »

hepcat wrote: Fri Jan 04, 2019 4:38 pm Please. At best you folks are Wile E. Coyote devious.
That's an over estimate. I think you mean the fox hounds. Who said that?
Spoiler:
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by hepcat »

em2nought wrote: Fri Jan 04, 2019 4:43 pm That's true, we are amateurs at foul play, the folks you good fellas throw your lot in with are definitely the masters. :wink:
True. Trump is as corrupt as the day is long, but he's so friggin' idiotic that you have to wonder how easily duped you folks are.
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Re: Gun Politics

Post by LawBeefaroni »

YellowKing wrote: Fri Jan 04, 2019 4:11 pm
Lawbeefaroni wrote:Would that drive qualified teachers away? There's no shortage of unemployed folks with guns and some shootin' experience to take their place.
We have teacher shortages NOW, even before you start restricting the profession to people who are willing to carry a gun and shoot people.
Well yeah, if you insist on restricting the profession to those who can teach. Eliminate a circle from the Venn and boom, no shortage. Fewer educated kids but tons of armed babysitters.
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