Octopus Overlords

Oh, and Zurai - I'd say definitely take two politics cards. There are two types of politics cards that would help us immensely - Support the People (we'll desperately need cards if a -1 fuel crisis comes up), and Preventative Policy (even better, could just pick fuel and essentially guarantee that we won't lose during your turn).

I'd like to wait for the answer of whether Boomer got to use her Recon ability during her turn before proceeding, though.

El Guapo wrote:

Remus West wrote:

El Guapo wrote:

Remus West wrote:

Scoop20906 wrote:Whew!

Well, now we just have to hope for a good crisis.

I'd have thought a better way of achieving this effect would've been to activate Caprica, for what it's worth.

Caprica could not move the jump track back at all. If we had left it where it was you could simply have force jumped out. Also, crises played at Caprica do not activate our ships but can advance the jump track. I personally think it the single most useless place on the board good only for using Supercrisises and nothing else.

But here's the thing - since we can guarantee a jump activation through the Pegasus Engine Room, the only way this helps you is if the next crisis kills us (for example, if it causes -1 fuel), otherwise all that's changed is that we jump a turn later. Given that a crisis is the only way that I can see that you could win, I'd think Caprica would be more useful in that it lets you look at two crises and pick one. That way you would win if EITHER of the next two crises would cause a fuel loss, rather than only if the NEXT crisis caused fuel loss.

But what do I know, I'm just a meatbag.

Exactly, you jump a turn later. If Scoop had not moved the Jump track back you would have jumped this turn and never need to face a crisis - you would have already won. The shape of the board is meaningless if you jump away from it. Right now your Population is 4 so if you fail the jump roll at -3 you win. If the Crisis costs you a Population then you risk losing on that level of force jump. If it costs you other resources it possibly costs you the game.

The flip side of that is that if it had cost you 2 population but advanced the jump track you would be a lock to win still.

Using the Engine room means you use cards - which means you are more likely to fail any crisis and thus cause some sort of damage.

The only crisis that would have benefitted us would have been one that cost you a fuel or 2 morale - both rare.

and just in case it comes up:

Movement powers are abilities that a player may use
during the Movement step of his turn in lieu of moving. A
player may either move or use a Movement ability during his
Movement step, but not both. Note that a player may not
use a Movement ability when he is allowed to move during
someone else’s turn (such as when he has been targeted by
an “Executive Order” Skill Card).

Remus West wrote:

El Guapo wrote:

Remus West wrote:

El Guapo wrote:

Remus West wrote:

Scoop20906 wrote:Whew!

Well, now we just have to hope for a good crisis.

I'd have thought a better way of achieving this effect would've been to activate Caprica, for what it's worth.

Caprica could not move the jump track back at all. If we had left it where it was you could simply have force jumped out. Also, crises played at Caprica do not activate our ships but can advance the jump track. I personally think it the single most useless place on the board good only for using Supercrisises and nothing else.

But here's the thing - since we can guarantee a jump activation through the Pegasus Engine Room, the only way this helps you is if the next crisis kills us (for example, if it causes -1 fuel), otherwise all that's changed is that we jump a turn later. Given that a crisis is the only way that I can see that you could win, I'd think Caprica would be more useful in that it lets you look at two crises and pick one. That way you would win if EITHER of the next two crises would cause a fuel loss, rather than only if the NEXT crisis caused fuel loss.

But what do I know, I'm just a meatbag.

Exactly, you jump a turn later. If Scoop had not moved the Jump track back you would have jumped this turn and never need to face a crisis - you would have already won. The shape of the board is meaningless if you jump away from it. Right now your Population is 4 so if you fail the jump roll at -3 you win. If the Crisis costs you a Population then you risk losing on that level of force jump. If it costs you other resources it possibly costs you the game.

The flip side of that is that if it had cost you 2 population but advanced the jump track you would be a lock to win still.

Using the Engine room means you use cards - which means you are more likely to fail any crisis and thus cause some sort of damage.

The only crisis that would have benefitted us would have been one that cost you a fuel or 2 morale - both rare.

But we WOULD have faced a crisis if you activated Caprica - whichever crisis that Scoop chose. And yeah, this way we're down 2 cards from having used the engine room, but if it's during Scoop's turn then we're down 5 cards, as Apollo wouldn't have his draw yet.

Not that it matters, but my point is this: with either one (Basestar Bridge or Caprica) we only lose if we face a crisis of -1 fuel, or if we get -1 pop and then another crisis that kills us. Given that you're banking on a particular bad crisis, you'd have better odds with Caprica as you'd get to choose one of two crises.

But far be it from me to second guess your genocide.

Making you guys do it means any -1 population crisis with a jump track advancement puts you at risk. The same crisis on Scoop's turn hands you the game.

El Guapo wrote:Say, and this is important - did Boomer do her end-of-turn scout ability? If so, did she put the crisis back on the top of the deck?

I think Turtle might've forgotten to offer me that option; I know I forgot to ask for it.

The first thing we're looking for in a Crisis is one that doesn't cost us either fuel or 2 population.

The second thing we're looking for is something other than Raiders Activate, since I'll be moving to the Pegasus Engine Room on my turn and thus can't cover the civilian in 4.

I'd say a Jump Prep would be third, but you can't tell me there's a jump prep, so I'd have to go to the Engine Room anyway.

Turtle wrote:Because Scoop didn't do anything with the crisis deck, would anyone object to Grund/Boomer getting to do his Recon ability right now?

nah. go ahead.

Remus West wrote:Making you guys do it means any -1 population crisis with a jump track advancement puts you at risk. The same crisis on Scoop's turn hands you the game.

That's a fair point. Anyways, we'll see how this whole genocide thing pans out.

Zurai wrote:The first thing we're looking for in a Crisis is one that doesn't cost us either fuel or 2 population.

The second thing we're looking for is something other than Raiders Activate, since I'll be moving to the Pegasus Engine Room on my turn and thus can't cover the civilian in 4.

I'd say a Jump Prep would be third, but you can't tell me there's a jump prep, so I'd have to go to the Engine Room anyway.

I agree, EXCEPT that it doesn't matter if the next crisis has a "raiders activate" on it, as long as it has a jump activation icon. If the crisis has a raiders activate, all that could happen is that the raider in sector 4 could destroy the viper there. But that doesn't matter, since with a jump activation icon we'd just jump out next turn before the raider could activate again and destroy the civvie.

Actually what we want to avoid more is "basestars activate" (fire at Galactica). That's the one that could hurt us more by damaging the Pegasus Engine Room (there's also a -1 fuel token, but if we got a basestar hit we'd choose Pegasus for that reason).

Also we're looking for a crisis that doesn't have -1 pop, not -2. We're at 4 pop, so reducing us to 3 pop would make jumping next turn (where we'd be risking 3 population) extremely risky and unwise.

But anyways, all the info that we'll get is "Boomer puts the card on the top or bottom." If Boomer puts the card on the top, then it's possible that we might not want you to go to the Engine Room IF you draw Preventative Policy, but we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

Turtle wrote:Cylon Helo still needs to choose his two skill cards for this turn.

Apollo must to choose between his two skills for this turn.

Turn 47: Zurai/Apollo

Decks, Hand Sizes, and Ongoing Effects:

Spoiler:

Destiny Deck: 8

Player hand sizes:
1. El Guapo - Tory: 0
2. Remus West - Cylon Cally: 5
3. Grundbegriff - Boomer: 3
4. Scoop20906 - Cylon Helo: 5 Supercrisis: 1
5. Zurai - Apollo: 5 Quorum: 0
6. Lars - Sympathetic Cylon Dee: 2

Ongoing Card effects:

Oh wait a minute, just realized that this map is wrong. There's an unmanned viper in sector 4, which Boomer moved there with her CAG action on her turn.

Truly, we have never had a CAG as talented and amazing as Boomer.

The Viper you refer to is an ex-Viper and just a bunch of space trash now. It was blown to itty bitty pieces during the very turn in which it dared move between our Raider and it's prey.

Oh. Bah, some rolling that we've gotten this game.

So....yeah, avoid activate raiders this turn.

Checking in. Turtle's up; I haven't seen my choice yet.

I was going to note that if all goes well it will be up to Dee to jump the fleet to achieve victory, and that's a wild card because we don't know Dee's agenda. But then, I just checked and it turns out that literally every "humans have won" sympathetic agenda (which are 4 out of the 6 agendas) have been achieved (with the caveat that "convert the infidels" would depend on us failing the jump population roll, but that's a 75% chance that's probably worth the risk for Lars/Dee).

So, that's good. Just as long as his agenda isn't "Illusion of Hope", which would suck.

Just curious - what if Humans win but he achieves his Agenda? Does he win and everyone else loses? Do the Cylons all win?

stessier wrote:Just curious - what if Humans win but he achieves his Agenda? Does he win and everyone else loses? Do the Cylons all win?

The agendas all require a specific side to win plus one other condition. So for example, "Convert the Infidels" requires the humans to win AND all resources to be at 3 or lower, while "Illusion of Hope" requires that the cylons win AND humans have traveled 6+ distance (they are all listed under "victory conditions" in Turtle's original post FYI). If that agenda is achieved, he wins along with the relevant side. If not, he loses. The humans / cylons win as usual independent.

So one side of humans / cylons win per normal, and the sympathetic cylon wins / loses independently based on his/her agenda.

Also, re: Grund's recon - after further thought, I think the best approach is, if Grund puts the crisis back on top, Grund can then recommend what he thinks is the optimal course of action. He can't say anything about what the crisis is, and so there's very little he could say about *why* the recommended course of action is wise, but he can still suggest the best course of action.

El Guapo wrote:

stessier wrote:Just curious - what if Humans win but he achieves his Agenda? Does he win and everyone else loses? Do the Cylons all win?

The agendas all require a specific side to win plus one other condition. So for example, "Convert the Infidels" requires the humans to win AND all resources to be at 3 or lower, while "Illusion of Hope" requires that the cylons win AND humans have traveled 6+ distance (they are all listed under "victory conditions" in Turtle's original post FYI). If that agenda is achieved, he wins along with the relevant side. If not, he loses. The humans / cylons win as usual independent.

So one side of humans / cylons win per normal, and the sympathetic cylon wins / loses independently based on his/her agenda.

Ah, got it. Thought everyone had agendas, not just the sympathetic Cylon.

stessier wrote:Ah, got it. Thought everyone had agendas, not just the sympathetic Cylon.

We are playing with Personal Agendas, which are special type of Loyalty cards. I had one earlier on Starbuck where we would lose 1 morale at the end of the game if I hadn't revealed the card; in order to reveal the card, we couldn't have any remaining nukes. That ended up not mattering because Starbuck got executed.

There may yet be personal agendas in play that affect resources. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

This is a hard decision, at least for me. Who knows what's next if I ditch this one?!

Boomer chooses to place the crisis card back on top of the deck.

Apollo must to choose between his two skills for this turn.

Politics, please.

Lars wrote:

This seems bad. Care to elaborate?

Grundbegriff wrote:This is a hard decision, at least for me. Who knows what's next if I ditch this one?!

So any recommendations on what we should do next? I think the main options are for Apollo to either (1) move to the Engine Room and activate it; or (2) move to sector 4 and launch a scout (if he has that card) or attack the raider there. Or use preventative policy if he's drawn it, in which case I'm not sure what his other action would be (maybe launching a scout if possible I guess).

Grundbegriff wrote:There may yet be personal agendas in play that affect resources. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

Oh, and if any one of you guys has a personal agenda that would cause us to lose the game (such as -1 fuel), please tell us not to jump out. Though of course you can't say anything about what the agenda is or cost would be.

Apollo has his cards.

Turn 47: Zurai/Apollo

Decks, Hand Sizes, and Ongoing Effects:

El Guapo wrote:

Grundbegriff wrote:This is a hard decision, at least for me. Who knows what's next if I ditch this one?!

So any recommendations on what we should do next? I think the main options are for Apollo to either (1) move to the Engine Room and activate it;

Doesn't that serve only to ensure a Jump Track Activation?

I think the best thing, if it were possible, would be to nuke that Base Ship in sector 3. Unless there's an implication of which I'm unaware.

Interesting set of cards. I have some options, but if Boomer has any input, I'd like to hear it.

With a Jump Track Activation (and assuming Dee isn't about to betray us), we win, barring the Crisis you left being awful.

And we don't have any nukes.

Ah. 0 nukes.

Alas.

Well, you certainly have better things to do than worry about the Jump Track. Bad things are going to happen. The only question is this: will they be bad enough to lose us the game?

If you have any means of buttressing your hand, that would probably be more important than gallivanting around near-space.

El Guapo wrote:

Lars wrote:

This seems bad. Care to elaborate?

No.

Grundbegriff wrote:Ah. 0 nukes.

Alas.

Well, you certainly have better things to do than worry about the Jump Track. Bad things are going to happen. The only question is this: will they be bad enough to lose us the game?

If you have any means of buttressing your hand, that would probably be more important than gallivanting around near-space.

Man, I really hope you didn't pick a skill check crisis whose result would cause us to lose the game.

Anyhow, Zurai, if you have a preventative policy I'd probably do that (for fuel). Either way, it seems like consolidate power might be useful per Grund's advice if you have it.

El Guapo wrote:Man, I really hope you didn't pick a skill check crisis whose result would cause us to lose the game.

I hope that, too. I think it's going to be a matter of luck.

The main problem was this: who knows what the next card would've contained if I had rejected this one?!

Well, -1 fuel will kill us for sure. -1 pop only has a chance to kill us.

Apollo plays Preventative Policy 3 to prevent the next Fuel loss this turn as his Movement. Then he plays Consolidate Power 1 and draws 2 Tactics cards since they're the most common Crisis contribution.

I'm assuming that the Crisis Boomer left has a Basestars Attack Galactica by his comments, so leaving the Raider there won't immediately harm us. Of course, Dee has the potential to totally screw us over, as does the Basestar hitting the Engine Room, but there's not really anything I can do about that right now.

I think this is one of the most tense endings to a BSG board game I have played. Well done all.