Octopus Overlords

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 4:47 pm**

He just says what he thinks his audience wants to hear. If anything he says has a basis in reality, it is purely by accident.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 5:24 pm**

I wouldn't discount it. Incoming administrations have the ability to clean house and replace mid- and high-level officials.

Maybe the lower-level offices go generally untouched, but that doesn't matter when their new supervisors can bury and/or punish wave-making.

For example, Alexander Vindman's exposure of Trump's Ukraine phone call went through proper channels. Trump now understands that the key to success is clogging those channels--and also to make sure no unvetted figure like Vindman is anywhere near the next call.

All of which is to say: when they say "Deep State," they mean anyone in a position of any power who is not personally loyal to Dear Leader.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:47 pm**

malchior wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 7:00 am

Wouldn't people who want jobs just put down what Florida Man wants to hear?

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:59 pm**

Holman wrote:I wouldn't discount it. Incoming administrations have the ability to clean house and replace mid- and high-level officials.

You can 100% discount it. The claim wasn’t mid- and high-level officials. The claim was “every federal employee”. And no, that isn’t ever happening.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 7:05 pm**

RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:59 pm
Holman wrote:I wouldn't discount it. Incoming administrations have the ability to clean house and replace mid- and high-level officials.
You can 100% discount it. The claim wasn’t mid- and high-level officials. The claim was “every federal employee”. And no, that isn’t ever happening.

Even if we don't take the claim literally, it's a signal to every federal employee that they will be vulnerable to ideological pressure and that their supervisors will be chosen for MAGA loyalty.

I'm sure you know that this kind of shit will affect promotions and retirements and shape the makeup of federal institutions. And that, in turn, will shape the work of government where everyday issues actually encounter it.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 7:17 pm**

Most federal employees are going to completely ignore his stupidity, just like they did the last time.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 8:20 pm**

RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 7:17 pm Most federal employees are going to completely ignore his stupidity, just like they did the last time.

Do you think a second Trump administration will be less corrupt and less manipulated than the first?

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 8:21 pm**

If he's re-elected I fully expect him to literally crucify people at the National Mall.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 2:13 am**

Last time taught me not to say, "It'll never happen." The absurd actually happened, and was accepted, far too often.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 7:09 am**

Blackhawk wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 2:13 am Last time taught me not to say, "It'll never happen." The absurd actually happened, and was accepted, far too often.

Even normalized.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 12:09 pm**

RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:59 pm You can 100% discount it. The claim wasn’t mid- and high-level officials. The claim was “every federal employee”. And no, that isn’t ever happening.

That's not even legal in Canada. I imagine the same for the US.

In Canada the government would be (successfully) sued for millions and millions and millions.

In the US? I have no idea how your courts work. Or maybe they don't.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 12:14 pm**

Holman wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 7:05 pm
RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:59 pm
Holman wrote:I wouldn't discount it. Incoming administrations have the ability to clean house and replace mid- and high-level officials.
You can 100% discount it. The claim wasn’t mid- and high-level officials. The claim was “every federal employee”. And no, that isn’t ever happening.
Even if we don't take the claim literally, it's a signal to every federal employee that they will be vulnerable to ideological pressure and that their supervisors will be chosen for MAGA loyalty.

I'm sure you know that this kind of shit will affect promotions and retirements and shape the makeup of federal institutions. And that, in turn, will shape the work of government where everyday issues actually encounter it.

Will this specific threat come to pass? Who knows. What I do feel confident of is that Trump's initial second term appointees would emphasize loyalty to Trump far more than his initial first term appointees, and those appointees in turn will prioritize loyalty to Trump in their departments. Especially for key places like DoJ. And ultimately they don't need to fire everyone, they just need to make a show of firing a few people for disloyalty / insufficient displays of fealty, and probably the bulk would fall into line.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 12:34 pm**

IMO the evergreen mistake when analyzing Trump's "decrees" is focusing on how impossible/unrealistic they are instead of focusing on the henchmen who will do terrible things in *the direction pointed* to make him happy. In this case, this "idea" is well aligned with a known plan - schedule F reform.

Former President Donald Trump on Tuesday seemed to endorse a recently unveiled plan by a cadre of his former staffers to strip tens of thousands of federal workers of their civil service protections and fire them at will under the next Republican administration.

Trump spoke Tuesday at an event hosted by the America First Policy Institute, a think tank founded by former staffers in his administration. His speech came on the heels of an Axios report last week that former White House aides are planning to revive the controversial Schedule F, a job classification system that would take current federal workers in “policy-related” positions out of the competitive service, stripping them of civil service protections and making them effectively at-will employees.

Schedule F was authorized via executive order in October 2020, but the Trump administration failed to implement the measure before he left office in January 2021. One of President Biden’s first acts as president was to rescind the edict.

“We need to make it much easier to fire rogue bureaucrats who are deliberately undermining democracy or, at a minimum, just want to keep their jobs,” Trump said. “They want to hold onto their jobs. Congress should pass historic reforms empowering the president to ensure that any bureaucrat who is corrupt, incompetent or unnecessary for the job can be told—did you ever hear this—‘You’re fired, get out, you’re fired.’ [You] have to do it. Deep state. Washington will be an entirely different place.”

Those involved in the effort to revive Schedule F told Government Executive last week that they have identified 50,000 federal employees that could be fired under the proposed new authority, although they hope to fire only a fraction of that total to create a “chilling effect” to keep the rest of them in line.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 12:52 pm**

Right. At the end of the day all they need is the established ability to fire any federal employee at any time for any reason. Once they have that, and make it known that they'll fire anyone who displeases the president or his loyalists, then then have 95% of what they want.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:18 pm**

I don’t know what it looks like from the outside, but from the inside, the identity of the Prezodent plays absolutely no role in the day to day. The federal workforce is substantially unionized and there’s no chance that every federal employee is taking a bullshit political test and being fired for “failing” it.

I get that this shit bag has normalized so many things, but he’s still not an emperor, and there is no way the unions would allow that. I get the anxiety, I’m just reassuring you that on THIS, it’s a stupid fantasy that will never come to pass.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:19 pm**

El Guapo wrote:Right. At the end of the day all they need is the established ability to fire any federal employee at any time for any reason. Once they have that, and make it known that they'll fire anyone who displeases the president or his loyalists, then then have 95% of what they want.

Have you ever tried to fire a federal employee?! I’ve seen what it takes, and it’s beyond ludicrous.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 12:19 am**

RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:19 pm
El Guapo wrote:Right. At the end of the day all they need is the established ability to fire any federal employee at any time for any reason. Once they have that, and make it known that they'll fire anyone who displeases the president or his loyalists, then then have 95% of what they want.
Have you ever tried to fire a federal employee?! I’ve seen what it takes, and it’s beyond ludicrous.

I know what it's like if you follow procedures. But they will: (a) change those procedures; and (b) rely on a friendly judiciary and complete indifference to the rule of law to do the rest.

Like I said, I don't know whether this specific threat would come to pass. But clearly replacing as much of the federal workforce as possible with MAGA loyalists is high on the wish list of a second Trump term, and given four years to do so I think there's ample reason to believe that they would make a lot of progress on that.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 1:58 am**

Just imagine the outrage if the good guys decided to impose a woke test. But then, the MAGAts probably believe there already is one.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 8:50 am**

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 8:54 am**

RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:18 pm I don’t know what it looks like from the outside, but from the inside, the identity of the Prezodent plays absolutely no role in the day to day. The federal workforce is substantially unionized and there’s no chance that every federal employee is taking a bullshit political test and being fired for “failing” it.

I get that this shit bag has normalized so many things, but he’s still not an emperor, and there is no way the unions would allow that. I get the anxiety, I’m just reassuring you that on THIS, it’s a stupid fantasy that will never come to pass.

This is correct. Where I work, things change based off whenever Congress randomly puts us in their crosshairs, or whenever some judge (including SCOTUS) decides to take up something that changes how we work. Otherwise? I've done my job more or less the same way for over 20 years and through 4 presidential administrations. We kept humming along without dysfunction even during the Trump years.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:01 am**

pr0ner wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 8:54 am
RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:18 pm I don’t know what it looks like from the outside, but from the inside, the identity of the Prezodent plays absolutely no role in the day to day. The federal workforce is substantially unionized and there’s no chance that every federal employee is taking a bullshit political test and being fired for “failing” it.

I get that this shit bag has normalized so many things, but he’s still not an emperor, and there is no way the unions would allow that. I get the anxiety, I’m just reassuring you that on THIS, it’s a stupid fantasy that will never come to pass.
This is correct. Where I work, things change based off whenever Congress randomly puts us in their crosshairs, or whenever some judge (including SCOTUS) decides to take up something that changes how we work. Otherwise? I've done my job more or less the same way for over 20 years and through 4 presidential administrations. We kept humming along without dysfunction even during the Trump years.

I know, it's been like that for me too. But it's a mistake to infer that it will always be so, especially when powerful people are specifically trying to change that.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:14 am**

El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:01 am
pr0ner wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 8:54 am
RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:18 pm I don’t know what it looks like from the outside, but from the inside, the identity of the Prezodent plays absolutely no role in the day to day. The federal workforce is substantially unionized and there’s no chance that every federal employee is taking a bullshit political test and being fired for “failing” it.

I get that this shit bag has normalized so many things, but he’s still not an emperor, and there is no way the unions would allow that. I get the anxiety, I’m just reassuring you that on THIS, it’s a stupid fantasy that will never come to pass.
This is correct. Where I work, things change based off whenever Congress randomly puts us in their crosshairs, or whenever some judge (including SCOTUS) decides to take up something that changes how we work. Otherwise? I've done my job more or less the same way for over 20 years and through 4 presidential administrations. We kept humming along without dysfunction even during the Trump years.
I know, it's been like that for me too. But it's a mistake to infer that it will always be so, especially when powerful people are specifically trying to change that.

It may not always be so, but it won't be for the particular reason being discussed here.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:25 am**

pr0ner wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:14 am
El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:01 am
pr0ner wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 8:54 am
RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:18 pm I don’t know what it looks like from the outside, but from the inside, the identity of the Prezodent plays absolutely no role in the day to day. The federal workforce is substantially unionized and there’s no chance that every federal employee is taking a bullshit political test and being fired for “failing” it.

I get that this shit bag has normalized so many things, but he’s still not an emperor, and there is no way the unions would allow that. I get the anxiety, I’m just reassuring you that on THIS, it’s a stupid fantasy that will never come to pass.
This is correct. Where I work, things change based off whenever Congress randomly puts us in their crosshairs, or whenever some judge (including SCOTUS) decides to take up something that changes how we work. Otherwise? I've done my job more or less the same way for over 20 years and through 4 presidential administrations. We kept humming along without dysfunction even during the Trump years.
I know, it's been like that for me too. But it's a mistake to infer that it will always be so, especially when powerful people are specifically trying to change that.
It may not always be so, but it won't be for the particular reason being discussed here.

Ultimately my prediction is that by the end of a second Trump term, he and/or his appointees will be able to fire any federal employee that they believe is disloyal without too much hassle or trouble. Probably true for DeSantis as well, but maybe slightly less so.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:36 am**

RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:19 pm Have you ever tried to fire a federal employee?! I’ve seen what it takes, and it’s beyond ludicrous.

+1.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 10:51 am**

El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:25 am
pr0ner wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:14 am
El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:01 am
pr0ner wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 8:54 am
RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:18 pm I don’t know what it looks like from the outside, but from the inside, the identity of the Prezodent plays absolutely no role in the day to day. The federal workforce is substantially unionized and there’s no chance that every federal employee is taking a bullshit political test and being fired for “failing” it.

I get that this shit bag has normalized so many things, but he’s still not an emperor, and there is no way the unions would allow that. I get the anxiety, I’m just reassuring you that on THIS, it’s a stupid fantasy that will never come to pass.
This is correct. Where I work, things change based off whenever Congress randomly puts us in their crosshairs, or whenever some judge (including SCOTUS) decides to take up something that changes how we work. Otherwise? I've done my job more or less the same way for over 20 years and through 4 presidential administrations. We kept humming along without dysfunction even during the Trump years.
I know, it's been like that for me too. But it's a mistake to infer that it will always be so, especially when powerful people are specifically trying to change that.
It may not always be so, but it won't be for the particular reason being discussed here.
Ultimately my prediction is that by the end of a second Trump term, he and/or his appointees will be able to fire any federal employee that they believe is disloyal without too much hassle or trouble. Probably true for DeSantis as well, but maybe slightly less so.

I think it'll be more "in the middle". The above would likely require changes in civil service protections that'd likely have to go through Congress and I'm skeptical of that being possible. We haven't seen the appetite (yet) for the judicial unmaking at that base level that we have feared - for example taking a swing at the APA or administrative judges like the hardliners want. However, the schedule F EO that Biden rescinded if restored would be a significant test of their capability to crack the top layer of the civil service under the political appointees. If they are able to do that, then they potentially don't need to go farther and fire individual employees.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 12:01 pm**

malchior wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 10:51 am
El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:25 am
pr0ner wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:14 am
El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 9:01 am
pr0ner wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 8:54 am
RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 10:18 pm I don’t know what it looks like from the outside, but from the inside, the identity of the Prezodent plays absolutely no role in the day to day. The federal workforce is substantially unionized and there’s no chance that every federal employee is taking a bullshit political test and being fired for “failing” it.

I get that this shit bag has normalized so many things, but he’s still not an emperor, and there is no way the unions would allow that. I get the anxiety, I’m just reassuring you that on THIS, it’s a stupid fantasy that will never come to pass.
This is correct. Where I work, things change based off whenever Congress randomly puts us in their crosshairs, or whenever some judge (including SCOTUS) decides to take up something that changes how we work. Otherwise? I've done my job more or less the same way for over 20 years and through 4 presidential administrations. We kept humming along without dysfunction even during the Trump years.
I know, it's been like that for me too. But it's a mistake to infer that it will always be so, especially when powerful people are specifically trying to change that.
It may not always be so, but it won't be for the particular reason being discussed here.
Ultimately my prediction is that by the end of a second Trump term, he and/or his appointees will be able to fire any federal employee that they believe is disloyal without too much hassle or trouble. Probably true for DeSantis as well, but maybe slightly less so.
I think it'll be more "in the middle". The above would likely require changes in civil service protections that'd likely have to go through Congress and I'm skeptical of that being possible. We haven't seen the appetite (yet) for the judicial unmaking at that base level that we have feared - for example taking a swing at the APA or administrative judges like the hardliners want. However, the schedule F EO that Biden rescinded if restored would be a significant test of their capability to crack the top layer of the civil service under the political appointees. If they are able to do that, then they potentially don't need to go farther and fire individual employees.

It does also matter if the GOP also gets control of both chambers of Congress - if so their path to this stuff (and a lot else) gets much easier.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 6:28 pm**

For the next plank in his 2024 platform, Trump has now proposed…wait, this can’t be right…internment camps for the homeless.

Surely this will be the thing that causes sane conservatives to back slowly out of the room, right?

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 6:36 pm**

There's no way this plan would work, if only because conservatives would never agree to pay for it.

What Trump is really doing here is market-testing open demonization of the homeless, presenting them as enemies to be punished rather than unfortunates to be helped. Otherwise, he wouldn't have led with the jail part.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 7:15 pm**

A federal ban on "urban camping"?

It's crazy talk but you can't even trust the video. Is that real? Source?

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 7:17 pm**

It is stupid but that is hardly the point. It isn't meant to be realistic. It is straight up lifted from the "hellhole" blue city storyline trope that deplorables eat up without thought.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 8:08 pm**

Skinypupy wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 6:28 pm For the next plank in his 2024 platform, Trump has now proposed…wait, this can’t be right…internment camps for the homeless.

Surely this will be the thing that causes sane conservatives to back slowly out of the room, right?

Sound like what they do in socialist third world countries.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 8:45 pm**

Next he’s going to outlaw getting murdered. If you get murdered, you will be arrested and then moved to a secondary death holding area where you will be killed again.

Posted: **Tue Apr 18, 2023 10:13 pm**

Lol. “Those that don’t comply with not being homeless.”

What a fucking piece of work.

Posted: **Mon May 01, 2023 11:16 am**

hepcat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 18, 2023 8:45 pm Next he’s going to outlaw getting murdered. If you get murdered, you will be arrested and then moved to a secondary death holding area where you will be killed again.

If you have any negative thing happen to you, you’re a loser, period. Get shot while serving your country? Loser! Get shot as a non-targeted drive by victim? Loser! Murdered? Loser! Husband beats you? Loser!

Posted: **Mon May 01, 2023 11:24 am**

He is completely devoid of empathy or human compassion. Sure, he can mimic it enough to fool the morons that worship at his feet, but he gets confused when confronted with a situation that requires it.

Posted: **Tue May 02, 2023 7:29 am**

Tried my first outside walk a couple of days ago. It didn't work too well. On my walk the Trump style support swag is starting to come out already. Of note, a Black, Red, and Blue flag "Trump 2024: The Rules Have Changed" What does that even mean? Is that about gerrymandering? The Courts? His disregard for the electoral system? A threat?

Posted: **Tue May 02, 2023 7:39 am**

Seriously.

"Trump 2024: We've moved the goalposts."

Posted: **Tue May 02, 2023 7:48 am**

LordMortis wrote: ↑Tue May 02, 2023 7:29 am Of note, a Black, Red, and Blue flag "Trump 2024: The Rules Have Changed" What does that even mean? Is that about gerrymandering? The Courts? His disregard for the electoral system? A threat?

Yes.

Posted: **Fri Aug 11, 2023 8:40 am**

Federalist Society to the rescue:

Posted: **Fri Aug 11, 2023 9:25 am**

Whatever happened to loyalty to country and loyalty to the constitution? It’s not loyalty to the president.

I don’t think I’ve ever seen people rejoice the death of a war hero like John McCain or the loss of American sports teams.

And for what.

For Trump. Even people in the media and in congress he’s stomped on love him. I honestly can’t see why.

By all means end democracy for some charismatic amazing neo-Hitler but for Trump? Makes me want to watch reality shifting videos on you tube.

Octopus Overlords

Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024

Re: Trump 2024