That is not dead which can eternal lie, and with strange aeons bring us some web forums whereupon we can gather
http://www.octopusoverlords.com/forum/
I'm with you. I won't speak for him, but I feel like malchior is, too.YellowKing wrote: ↑Tue Jul 12, 2022 2:14 pm The thing is the GOP is "winning" the propaganda war by deceit, aggression, repeating falsehoods until they become the reality, etc. If the left wants to combat that by engaging in the same dirty practices, then where does that leave us? Maybe the only winning strategy is to get down in the mud with the pigs, but I just mentally can't go there. I don't agree with it.
Self policing and punching left, which is a lot of how the Dem's describe "self policing" is how we got here. They are united, we are divided. We are trying to cling with broken fingernails to a bygone era in politics. It'd be like trying to discuss gently with a maddened boar why it should stop. It's only going to rip us apart.Kurth wrote: ↑Tue Jul 12, 2022 7:27 pmI'm with you. I won't speak for him, but I feel like malchior is, too.YellowKing wrote: ↑Tue Jul 12, 2022 2:14 pm The thing is the GOP is "winning" the propaganda war by deceit, aggression, repeating falsehoods until they become the reality, etc. If the left wants to combat that by engaging in the same dirty practices, then where does that leave us? Maybe the only winning strategy is to get down in the mud with the pigs, but I just mentally can't go there. I don't agree with it.
Where I think we disagree with malchior (and maybe smoove) is that there's value in the left self-policing itself in a way the right seldom (or never) does. I think it's really important that we hold ourselves to a high standard while attacking the never ending stream of misinformation and propaganda bullshit being spewed from the right.
From where I sit, malchior seems to see most attempts to self-police as a symptom of the dreaded "bothsidesism" condition. I disagree.
Depends on the issue. "Taking the high road" isn't particularly important to me, mostly because it's a meaningless phrase in the absence of a lot of context. But as general rule: As many as it takes.
So you're willing to commit the lives of your fellow citizens to suffering and death because you wouldn't like Democrats to institute a left police state or defend themselves with force... Check! Good to know.Little Raven wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 4:38 pmDepends on the issue. "Taking the high road" isn't particularly important to me, mostly because it's a meaningless phrase in the absence of a lot of context. But as general rule: As many as it takes.
Eh? I'm the gun-owning type of liberal, remember. To quote one of the long lost elders...."There comes a time when the only moral thing left to do is grab your rifle and start shooting anyone wearing a government uniform." (I miss Tareeq.
)No. We're not.Little Raven wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 4:56 pmEh? I'm the gun-owning type of liberal, remember. To quote one of the long lost elders...."There comes a time when the only moral thing left to do is grab your rifle and start shooting anyone wearing a government uniform." (I miss Tareeq.
I am, however, not convinced we're there quite yet.
None of them are current politicians.Prominent conservatives issue report rebutting Trump election claims...
...The report is signed by retired federal appeals court judges Thomas B. Griffith, J. Michael Luttig and Michael W. McConnell, former Solicitor General Theodore B. Olson, former US Sens. John Danforth and Gordon H. Smith, longtime Republican election lawyer Benjamin L. Ginsberg and veteran Republican congressional chief of staff David Hoppe. Several of them are longtime Trump critics.
WTF is Drazzil even talking about? He's on my ignore list (the only member), so I only see his posts when people reply and quote him, so maybe I'm missing context. But I doubt it. I really don't know why people bother to engage with him.Little Raven wrote: ↑Wed Jul 13, 2022 4:56 pmEh? I'm the gun-owning type of liberal, remember. To quote one of the long lost elders...."There comes a time when the only moral thing left to do is grab your rifle and start shooting anyone wearing a government uniform." (I miss Tareeq.
I am, however, not convinced we're there quite yet.
Missed this in the nonsense. I don't think this is quite what I think. I think there is value in the left self-policing. First, true misinformation isn't useful and undermines credibility. That's ground stakes. More importantly it is used against the interests of 'we the people' to generate a lot of noisy coverage that is meant to distract us from the true threats to our democracy.Kurth wrote: ↑Tue Jul 12, 2022 7:27 pmI'm with you. I won't speak for him, but I feel like malchior is, too.YellowKing wrote: ↑Tue Jul 12, 2022 2:14 pm The thing is the GOP is "winning" the propaganda war by deceit, aggression, repeating falsehoods until they become the reality, etc. If the left wants to combat that by engaging in the same dirty practices, then where does that leave us? Maybe the only winning strategy is to get down in the mud with the pigs, but I just mentally can't go there. I don't agree with it.
Where I think we disagree with malchior (and maybe smoove) is that there's value in the left self-policing itself in a way the right seldom (or never) does. I think it's really important that we hold ourselves to a high standard while attacking the never ending stream of misinformation and propaganda bullshit being spewed from the right.
From where I sit, malchior seems to see most attempts to self-police as a symptom of the dreaded "bothsidesism" condition. I disagree.
+1. I gave up yesterday.
Blackhawk wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 10:43 am
It's kind of fun seeing the responses slowly ramp up from, "Huh?" to "WTF?" to "OMG WTF?" It's like a negative-space drawing, showing what's happening without ever needing to see the actual thing.
Well that's good to know. I can reciprocate and stop wasting my time interacting with these people. Oh and yeah. Blackhawk's been on my ignore list since he told me to stop "polluting the forum" if we're talking about ignoring people by name.
I literally just asked people not to do this. Stop acting like my 8-year olds and continuing to do things that I've asked you not to do.Drazzil wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 10:56 amBlackhawk wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 10:43 am
It's kind of fun seeing the responses slowly ramp up from, "Huh?" to "WTF?" to "OMG WTF?" It's like a negative-space drawing, showing what's happening without ever needing to see the actual thing.Well that's good to know. I can reciprocate and stop wasting my time interacting with these people. Oh and yeah. Blackhawk's been on my ignore list since he told me to stop "polluting the forum" if we're talking about ignoring people by name.
I'm sorry law. I was in the process of a response when you posted. BTW check your PM. Best of luck all! We're gonna need it!ImLawBoy wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 11:06 amI literally just asked people not to do this. Stop acting like my 8-year olds and continuing to do things that I've asked you not to do.Drazzil wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 10:56 amBlackhawk wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 10:43 am
It's kind of fun seeing the responses slowly ramp up from, "Huh?" to "WTF?" to "OMG WTF?" It's like a negative-space drawing, showing what's happening without ever needing to see the actual thing.Well that's good to know. I can reciprocate and stop wasting my time interacting with these people. Oh and yeah. Blackhawk's been on my ignore list since he told me to stop "polluting the forum" if we're talking about ignoring people by name.
208 members of the GOP want to have white supremacists, Nazi supporters and extremists in the military?By a vote of 218-208, Democrats pass an amendment to the 2023 NDAA that would require white supremacists, Nazi-supporters, and extremists to be removed from the military.
Schneider Amendment #31 – Directs the FBI, Department of Homeland Security, and the Secretary of Defense to publish a report that analyzes and sets out strategies to combat White supremacist and neo-Nazi activity in the uniformed services and Federal law enforcement agencies not later than 180 days after enactment and every 6 months thereafter – 5 minutes
I can't find the report right now, but I read yesterday that all of the armed forces are well short of their recruitment goals. First, the labor market is too strong to drive young people into military careers despite signing bonuses of $50k. Second, most young people are too fat to qualify, even though the army (in particular) keeps lowering its physical standards. Third, only 1% of young people say that they would ever consider joining the military. Fourth, vaccine mandates are driving some potential recruits away. And finally, covid restrictions prevent recruiters from being as in-your-face as they customarily get.Smoove_B wrote: ↑Fri Jul 15, 2022 11:03 pm I need more information about this
208 members of the GOP want to have white supremacists, Nazi supporters and extremists in the military?By a vote of 218-208, Democrats pass an amendment to the 2023 NDAA that would require white supremacists, Nazi-supporters, and extremists to be removed from the military.
Every branch of the U.S. military is struggling to meet its fiscal year 2022 recruiting goals, say multiple U.S. military and defense officials, and numbers obtained by NBC News show both a record low percentage of young Americans eligible to serve and an even tinier fraction willing to consider it.
The officials said the Pentagon’s top leaders are now scrambling for ways to find new recruits to fill out the ranks of the all-volunteer force. Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin and Deputy Secretary of Defense Kathleen Hicks consider the shortfall a serious issue, said the officials, and have been meeting on it frequently with other leaders.
“This is the start of a long drought for military recruiting,” said Ret. Lt. Gen. Thomas Spoehr of the Heritage Foundation, a think tank. He said the military has not had such a hard time signing recruits since 1973, the year the U.S. left Vietnam and the draft officially ended. Spoehr said he does not believe a revival of the draft is imminent, but “2022 is the year we question the sustainability of the all-volunteer force.”
The pool of those eligible to join the military continues to shrink, with more young men and women than ever disqualified for obesity, drug use or criminal records. Last month, Army Chief of Staff Gen. James McConville testified before Congress that only 23% of Americans ages 17-24 are qualified to serve without a waiver to join, down from 29% in recent years.
NEW: It turns out a neo-Nazi podcaster first wrote the "Jewish junta" text that was republished Friday on Facebook by the Bracken County Republican Party in Kentucky.
Neo-Nazi Joseph Jordan had posted the text on another platform a day prior.
Here are the posts side by side.
American democracy. It seems to only work in favor of us commoners occasionally and incidentally.
But...but... what about Antifa?Smoove_B wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 12:48 pm I'm sure it's just a coincidence.
NEW: It turns out a neo-Nazi podcaster first wrote the "Jewish junta" text that was republished Friday on Facebook by the Bracken County Republican Party in Kentucky.
Neo-Nazi Joseph Jordan had posted the text on another platform a day prior.
Here are the posts side by side.
$iljanus wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 2:08 pmBut...but... what about Antifa?Smoove_B wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 12:48 pm I'm sure it's just a coincidence.
NEW: It turns out a neo-Nazi podcaster first wrote the "Jewish junta" text that was republished Friday on Facebook by the Bracken County Republican Party in Kentucky.
Neo-Nazi Joseph Jordan had posted the text on another platform a day prior.
Here are the posts side by side.
I get the viewpoint but this isn't realistic in modern times. We have way too much surveillance, too much police, too much of a footprint to be able to reliably fight partisan actions within most western countries. The time to beat the fascists is now. Unfortunately our leaders don't recognize or care about the extreme danger they've placed us. The best plan IMO is to be in the safest place we can be if/when things go down. Unfortunately that excludes parts of the United States right now.LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 11:40 amJews, particularly those who survived the Holocaust, or who know relatives who did, are some of the strongest 2A proponents I know. My FIL, who is Jewish, survived Nazi occupation, fought with the Partisans, and then survived the Communist purges. One of the first things he did when he moved to the US was to buy a shotgun. He's always kept a rifle and shotgun. My wife is largely anti-gun but her father did instill in her the value of firearms as a real tool against fascism ( as opposed to the collectibles amassed by gravy seal LARPers). Any talk of a "Jewish junta" only reinforces this for her, the irony of which is not lost on us.
It's not entirely rational, no. But if all else fails, it's all we have. And no one knows what form things will take. Will we have to defend our Constitution by voting? Defend our privacy with face paint?Defend our homes with guns? Defend our states/cities from Federal overreach with militias?malchior wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 11:47 am I get the viewpoint but this isn't realistic in modern times. We have way too much surveillance, too much police, too much of a footprint to be able to reliably fight partisan actions within most western countries. The time to beat the fascists is now. Unfortunately our leaders don't recognize or care about the extreme danger they've placed us. The best plan IMO is to be in the safest place we can be if/when things go down. Unfortunately that excludes parts of the United States right now.
Absolutely. I'm more an advocate of the wisdom of Mr. Miyagi, "The best defense is no be there." if you have the resources and ability to do so.LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 12:47 pmOnce at the range I met a father teaching his adult son how to shoot a well-worn but clean Beretta 92. They were both Orthodox Jews and it was right after the Tree of Life shooting. The dad said he'd been wanting to do it since Charlottesville/Unite the Right because, "They have the government now.". Is a Beretta 92 going to stop a federally backed army of Neo-nazis? No. But it's better than nothing and the message he is sending to his son is "we don't roll over."
I mean there is precedent.LordMortis wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 1:18 pm That's kind of awesome. I should see an advertising campaign. "If you are LGBetc..., Black, Hispanic, Asian, Jewish, Muslim or Hindi then you should arm yourself and go out and demonstrate for your 2nd amendment rights to defend yourself from government overreach! Vote for 2A rights and vote against the GOP!"
Actually it's only awesome in an intellectual game sort of way. It hurts my soul, where we may be.
Also, I changed my avatar last week. Kind of tongue in cheek, kind of not.The Mulford Act was a 1967 California bill that prohibited public carrying of loaded firearms without a permit.Named after Republican assemblyman Don Mulford, and signed into law by governor of California Ronald Reagan [Republican], the bill was crafted with the goal of disarming members of the Black Panther Party who were conducting armed patrols of Oakland neighborhoods, in what would later be termed copwatching.
...
Both Republicans and Democrats in California supported increased gun control, as did the National Rifle Association of America.[10] Governor Ronald Reagan, who was coincidentally present on the capitol lawn when the protesters arrived, later commented that he saw "no reason why on the street today a citizen should be carrying loaded weapons" and that guns were a "ridiculous way to solve problems that have to be solved among people of good will." In a later press conference, Reagan added that the Mulford Act "would work no hardship on the honest citizen."