Qantaga wrote:Unagi, like you, I really don't want to dwell on this.
I try extraordinarily hard to avoid situations like what just went down, but - I really don't let it kill me when and if they do.
Sadly, you will find that I'm all too willing (to a fault) to dissect these kinds of things almost forever. As fun.
Qantaga wrote:At the time, I still thought of you as good, so my listing Chaos, Grund, etc. as who you previously thought evil during the course of the game was not meant as an accusation of you being evil.
Right, but it was meant to mock the choices that I may have made - in that "if ya call
that hunting wolves, then I'm glad I didn't..." kind of way.
From that, it seemed like someone that (at that earlier Chaos = evil? stage of the game) had not been 'living it' as a Good Guy, in that you mocked him as a choice, when it seemed likely to me that many thought he could have been the zerker with his kill of Grund. (at least I did, at the time)
Qantaga wrote:
You were saying I was bad because I hadn't tried to identify a wolf.
The truth was that I hadn't tried to identify a wolf *openly in the thread*.
Well, one thing... IMO, if you don't do something *openly in the thread*, it's open to quite an enormous amount of speculation.
agreed?
Qantaga wrote:At the time, I wasn't implying that you were bad. I was saying to you, in essence, that even good agents with the best intentions can be wrong about who they think is evil, so why is it an automatic condemnation of me just because I admit that I don't know who is evil?
I think we are just sorta talking on different levels maybe. I wasn't expecting you to know who is evil - I expected you to have your opinions more 'at hand' than they appeared to be.
What is interesting is that I basically was indeed picking up on what was indeed the case (absolutely correct me if I am wrong!):
You had not really formulated an opinion on who the wolves were among the remaining players.
You were caught off guard by my accusation and thought that you'd have been cleared by that N-1 vote, and not even really have to prove anything.
Early on (in my accusation), you never had the cynical Villager thought of "whatever, dumb-ass, I'm not a wolf", and just moved on to explain why you thought "X" was the wolf.
You didn't want some 12 hour stretch of 'no posts from you' to add to your frustrations, you wanted to get those explained ahead of time.
My failure was to prescribe it to you being a first time wolf at OO.
The truth was just that you hadn't formulated the opinions, were caught off guard by my attack, thought the N-1 vote would give us all piece of mind on you, and haven't been run up enough by me to have that cynical villager thought of "whatever, dumb-ass, I'm not a wolf".
That's the whole iocane powder part of the game. If there is a moment\mistake\action that someone can manage to define as 'good', someone else may wonder if it was designed to trick others into thinking that.
This game is all about the wolf in sheep's clothing. This is what (I think) theohall was saying about how I was defending stessier, but condemning you for what amounts to the same things. the problem was that I had, myself, come up with the reasons I felt that stessier was good - my brain. You had been the one to try and explain all the reason you were good. I didn't really want to hear all that from you - I wanted to hear who you thought may be a villain and why, and I wanted to see if it sounded like you had actually thought about the things you said you thought about or not. I wanted to consider your alignment by you giving me access to things that you had kept from being exposed openly in the thread.
Qantaga wrote:... my knee jerk reply (even though I tried to say at the time it was meant good-natured)
It's a game of werewolf.
First, please do understand, I never took anything of this bad-natured, and I seriously hope you understand my 'witch hunt' was against Hugo - not Qantaga.
Some of that I also (see, I do get these blinders, where I will indeed start just seeing how something can be spun (and, I swear, It Can!) in the opposite direction), anyhow.... Some of that I also counted against you - like I thought you were trying to keep things cool between you and me (because if you were to win as the wolf, you needed me to be a bit less aggressive)...
But the truth was, you were trying to keep things cool between you and me, because if you were to win as a villager, you needed me to be a bit less aggressive)
Qantaga wrote:It was my attempt to point out to you that my playstyle is vastly different to yours. It seems to me that you like to speculate out in the open
I seriously thought that was sorta the whole game.
Qantaga wrote:perhaps even throwing names out to see what sticks.
I try and minimize that... but I will make my arguments. I also shut-up from time to time and watch. Speculating out in the open doesn't preclude a great amount of private speculation, and some open speculation is actually self-serving (in that one watches for reaction, lack of them, etc...) - plus, and this in clearly the point - this is what creates the public record that we can go back to to see what people were thinking, this creates the material for the game to gain any traction. Open speculation and occasionally throwing a name out there to see what sticks; that is the Hydrogen and Helium of the WW Universe. You can't make any of the heavy elements, like the Mexican Stand Off we just had, without them... I'll take this moment to add that I don't think you
normally play it quite the 'silent' way you describe it. As Scoop remarked, - you actually 'Came Back' finally at the end of this game, as the Qantaga he had come to expect. (Drove me nuts that after the normal villager Qantaga showed up, Scoop accepted it.
)
Qantaga wrote:I am the opposite. I am much more prone to turn things over and over and over in my mind before trying to make a decision.
This was one sloooooow paced game. I thought I had mulled a lot of things over a lot of time. I like to think that I'm more prone to turn things over and over and over in my mind before trying to make a decision too, but I also feel some debt to the game and to contribute a little to the chaos of things with my perspective.
Qantaga wrote:I mainly wanted to address this because my ability to play games at OO will be severely limited if I am judged evil because I can't definitively name a wolf candidate.
I can only say that, from time to time a refusal to contribute your own speculations, a 'wolf candidate', that will probably tend to make people nervous of you. (by people, I mean: Me)