Terror from the Deep (repurposed).

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GreenGoo
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

NickAragua wrote:On the map, live (stunned) aliens show up as glowy dots. Gray crosses are equipment piles and corpses.
edit: I'll double check when I get home.

This game could definitely have used a little more "usability testing", in terms of pathfinding.

By the way, if you play the original X-Com on superhuman with the XComUtil difficulty fix, it's pretty damned hard. I wind up taking about 25-50% losses on non-trivial missions (terror sites, medium+ UFOs), despite having powered armor, plasma guns and the latest in tactics. The casualty rate goes up to near 100% when the bad guys have psionics.
I was just thinking last night about how poor the pathfinding algorithm is.

I don't know if I could play a game of X-com on superhuman. 50-100% casualties would be too much for me to handle enjoyably.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

I took a night off and played some Freedom Force.

I returned last night and started my retreat, while trying to gather up all the lewt.

I made it a few turns, but then ran into trouble where a lobsterman woke up in one of my guy's backpacks, and ate a bunch of 'nauts. I tried a few things with no luck, so I took a break again. I'll return to it tonight to see how I do.

I'm stuck in the mindset of getting out of there with everyone alive and as much loot as I can get into van. I'm basically cheating like a fiend right now, with reloads happening often.

I hope and expect to go back to a more "fair" style of play after I escape this unbelievable hell of a mission.

The constant reloading is taking its toll though. Moving 13 guys around, then having something fuck up, reloading, then moving all 13 guys again is tedious beyond belief. I can only do it in small bites, which is why I didn't finish it last night.

Sorry for being so lame on this one. Ugh. Fun levels dropping into the basement. Once I get out of this mission things will pick up again. I just need to grind it out.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by dbt1949 »

Whenever I am carrying a stunned alien I like to have someone in back of the guy carrying it to see it if it wakes up.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

dbt1949 wrote:Whenever I am carrying a stunned alien I like to have someone in back of the guy carrying it to see it if it wakes up.
Yeah, I had 4 guys with sticks surrounding him. But unfortunately he only wakes up on the alien turn, with full TU's, which is kind of bullshit, but anyway.

With the new aqua plastic armour, and medikits for everyone, I have a lot of guys injured but not dead. I'd say at least 6 of the 13 survivors are injured in some way.

With the reduced hp, the newly awakened lobsterman can take down 1-3 'nauts if he gets lucky. It doesn't matter how many, because I want to get out of there with everyone, so I reload the moment 1 drops. Of course I've stripped the lobster of weapons, so it's all hth attacks. What's interesting is sometimes a lobster will miss with like 4-5 hth attacks in a row. So I'm gambling a reload will result in my guys surviving and restunning the lob again.

I am completely pussing out. I'll play more hardcore'ish once I'm out of this death trap.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by Buatha »

GreenGoo wrote: I am completely pussing out. I'll play more hardcore'ish once I'm out of this death trap.
Hardly. If anything, my limited gametime does not allow me to play 1+ hour battles again and again. I'm all about saving my progress so I still feel like I'm accomplishing something with my < 2 hour gaming window.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Yeah, I hear ya.

Here's the thing.

I can get caught in a perfectionist cycle where if I lose a guy, I reload. then if I, say, blow up some equipment that I was hoping to take as lewt, I reload. Then if I fail to stun and end up killing an alien I wanted to capture, I reload. I've got this weird compulsion to have everything turn out perfectly. Even if I start with a more relaxed approach, somehow I start being less and less happy with smaller and smaller details. If that happens, I get frustrated and just find something else to do.

This game, I'm trying to take a really laid back approach. If you read my posts above, you'll see I saved and continued playing after having lost 10 of my 14 man response team. I got out of there with 4 'nauts and that's it. No one but me knows how hard it was just to take the loss and move on, instead of restarting the combat from scratch. Call it a psychological issue.

So now, despite being very ironman'ish in my earlier play, I'm doing the absolute worst thing in that I reload a turn if I can't get this awakened alien re-stunned without losing a 'naut.

I hate losing 'nauts, and I hate reloading. I need to find a happier middle ground. Which I will, after I get out of this death trap of a mission.

Also, as the game progresses, and my guys obtain more veteran status, it is harder for me to let them go if they die, and I'm more likely to feel compelled to reload.

As someone who has played through X-Com in full save mode so that I have finished the game with zero losses, and someone who has played through with near ironman'ish discipline, I can tell you that the game and final fight is balanced for somewhere in between those 2 extremes.

Going to Cydonia with mostly rookies or vets of only 2-3 missions, you are going to get your ass handed to you. You can still win mind you, but the carnage will be significant.

Going to Cydonia with a crew that has never died since the beginning of the game, with 10-20-30 missions under their belt, they will just crush the opposition.

I like the challenge of the lobstermen, but the timing is just awful right now. They may as well be invulnerable, for all the damage I can do to them. Next time I see them I will have my revenge. Oh yes. They will pay.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by Sabin Stargem »

You might enjoy "UFO: Extraterrestrials", GreenGoo. One of the options for the Gold edition is to change how likely it is for your soldiers to die, which allows you to play through a mission without them biting the dust. However, the worse the damage they take, the longer it will be until they recover, which means you still have to take some care with them. However, UFO:ET has a fair number of flaws, so I recommend waiting for the UNI-MOD to become compatible with ET Gold before purchase. UNI-MOD adds in a bunch of stuff, including shielded and floating tanks, additional unique items, gameplay changes, X-Com aliens, playing on Earth, ect.

Like you, I am the sort of guy who tends towards perfectionism a little too much, in the sense that I must have EVERY pokemon/item/ect in RPGs, or to not have my troops die in Jagged Alliance 2. A vicious cycle. I find my favorite games tend to be the sort where practice makes perfect, and generally works in small bursts. Spelunky, La-Mulana, and Plants VS Zombies are good in this way.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by Bakhtosh »

Goo, have you tried dropping off the Lobster 1 turn before he usually wakes up, then backing away? When he wakes up, he'll have to run most of his movement points off to get to your guys, and hopefully won't be able to kill any.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Bakhtosh wrote:Goo, have you tried dropping off the Lobster 1 turn before he usually wakes up, then backing away? When he wakes up, he'll have to run most of his movement points off to get to your guys, and hopefully won't be able to kill any.
That's a good idea, but the thing is he's stunned and on the ground. It is the act of picking him up that wakes him. I've tried a bunch of stuff.

1) Surround the body and wait. 5 turns later it's still stunned on the ground.
2) Stand on it. Same result as 1)
3) Pick it up and put it down. Same result as 1)
4) Pick it up and throw it as far as I could. Same result as 1)
5) Pick it up and carry it. Awakens start of alien round and eats people.

Willing to try any other ideas people may have. My "plan" is to pray that the random number generator lets my guys live 1 turn, then I'll save and move forward from there.

Took last night off to play with Desktop Dungeon, which had me up past my bedtime, surprisingly.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by dbt1949 »

Sometimes ( with the help of saved games) I'll shoot the alien on the ground. If he doesn't die he should stayed stunned a lot longer. (IE the saved games)
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

dbt1949 wrote:Sometimes ( with the help of saved games) I'll shoot the alien on the ground. If he doesn't die he should stayed stunned a lot longer. (IE the saved games)
Hah! I thought of that then wondered how I'd shoot them when they are stunned, since they only show up on the inventory screen. The second I read your post dbt I immediately realized I could just shoot the body just like I shoot terrain.

Good idea. I may give it a shot. Thanks!
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Ok, finally got out of there and bailed with the 13 aquanauts left, and as much loot, bodies and live aliens as I could carry.

The last 2 stunned aliens would wake up on the turn immediately after I picked them up, so here's what I did.

I picked them up, walked a few steps, threw them forward on the ground, and ended the turn. Next turn they hadn't woken, so I picked them up, walked them forward, then throw them on the ground a few steps ahead again.

Repeat until you want to smash things. That's why it took til now to get out of the mission. Some days I'd do a turn, save and then quit. Some days I couldn't even face that.

But now it's done, so hopefully I can get back on track.

The terror mission ended with 1 'naut dead and -29 pts. Not bad at all, really. Of course I saved and reloaded a nearly infinite number of times, but hey. There is no way you should ever be in a situation where a mission is impossible. I consider it poor balance. :wink:

LOTS of wounded. At least 1/2 the squad on that mission came back wounded. Some are out for more than a month, including the commander, who was wounded twice and lived to tell about it (because I would have reloaded if he didn't :D ).
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by Bakhtosh »

Nice improvisation. On the positive side, you squad will be kick ass by the time you're ready to end the game. Of course, this is one of the few games I've ever used an editor on...75% ofmy elite squad I'd nourished and protected since they were rookies tested out with minimum psi levels. I would have to scrap every veteran in the bunch. And there's no way to increase that stat.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by Zurai »

Bakhtosh wrote:Nice improvisation. On the positive side, you squad will be kick ass by the time you're ready to end the game. Of course, this is one of the few games I've ever used an editor on...75% ofmy elite squad I'd nourished and protected since they were rookies tested out with minimum psi levels. I would have to scrap every veteran in the bunch. And there's no way to increase that stat.
I think that's hard coded into the game (not really, but it sure feels that way). I've never, ever, EVER had any significant portion of my experienced agents have more than smidgen of psi defense. I don't think I've ever had my highest-ranking soldier ever be salvageable once psi hit, either. I hate that aspect of the original game, which is IMO the only bad gameplay element.

TFTD on the other hand has all kinds of questionable to bad gameplay elements, as GG's AAR shows. They cranked up the difficulty way too much, IMO.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by dbt1949 »

My team before I learn their psi factors is replaceable. After I learn their psi factors the good ones get on the A team and the rest get sent off to far away bases is they're good and fired if they're not. Then it takes another month to find out the new groups psi factors.\By the end of the game I have ten troops with psi factors over 80 and usually over 90.
I also build the psi modules in all my satellite bases too and ship the best to my main base.
The "good" rookies I nourish by letting them get most of the kills each mission to bring their other stats.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

I won't be coddling my 'nauts this much on any other mission. If they die, they die. It was my shear inability to even damage the Lobstermen that got me frustrated enough to reload a zillion times.

I'll let you know how the team's psi stats turn out when the time comes.

Yeah, the month of downtime while you send them to psi camp is a pain.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

So I finally got back at it tonight.

As I feared, another UFO was spotted before my researchers could figure out the clip for the sonic rifle. I was again stuck with gauss going in. The UFO landed before I could intercept, and a Terror alert went off in North America. I short while later my 'nauts landed and began to deploy, with only a few leaving the transport per turn, as they fanned out.

This turned out to be a smart move, as 3 distinct aliens lobbed grenades into the deployment zone. Luckily, all but 1 'naut survived.

I don't know if I'm happy or sad that the enemy forces consisted of Deep Ones and Gillmen. On the one hand, they aren't Lobsters. On the same hand, they were easy prey for my gauss weaponry. On the other hand, they had no Calcinites, which I need before I can figure out thermal lances. I have yet to see a vibro blade, but I have a thermal lance, and now after this last terror mission, a Heavy Thermal Lance. I need these to make Lobstermen missions more interesting instead of suicidal.

The only other loss was a low bravery scout who got clipped by an unlucky opportunity shot through 1 window, across the inside of a building and then out another window.

Any Terror mission that you end in the positive is a success, and this one was. A decent haul of artifacts was just the cherry on top.

Shortly after returning to base where 2 rookies were sent to sick bay (they'd sure earned their fins on this mission), my researchers finally came through. Sonic weaponry was now available, and a full 50% more powerful than my gauss, and incredibly accurate. I look forward to field testing them.

I turned all researchers towards a gillman soldier, who was swimming around his tank in an agitated manner. He folded in less than a day, and the interrogation showed that gillmen are native to Earth, which is hard to imagine. The gillman hinted at more knowledge regarding the Aliens, and so my scientists continue to plumb his mind, hoping for some information about the Alien Origins.

I added several manufacturing projects, and while the engineers grumbled, they got to it. Several suits of aqua armour were rendered useless by alien explosives, and that shortfall had to be made up. They also continue to produce particle displacement sensors, which command a surprisingly high amount on the open market. The profits help fund the X-com project, reducing the pressure felt when sponsoring countries attempt to influence policy.

Well, that's it. Sick bay is packed. 2 new recruits are in transport to X-com base East Coast. Research is progressing with regard to the origin of the alien threat. Manufacturing is chugging along, but needs expansion. A second base on the opposite side of the world has been started. However, due to design constraints, a defensible base requires many times longer to build than a haphazard one, so the 2nd base isn't expected to come online for at least 2 months.

I need to examine the research tree a bit more. I don't want to get caught with my pants down again. That was incredibly frustrating. To make up for it, this last mission was a turkey shoot, and several times my 'nauts managed to stick the barrels of their rifles into the mouths of the aliens before pulling the trigger. Messy, but effective. I didn't begrudge the men their revenge after the humiliation, defeat and forced retreat of the last mission. Morale needed a boost, and alien bodies stacked like firewood in the hold certainly had an effect on morale.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by dbt1949 »

Have you researched the alien grenades yet? Enough of them will even take out a lobsterman.
I don't know if they have fixed it or not but there used to be a bug so that if you didn't research things in order you could never finish the game.
Spoiler:
The other stuff doesn't matter but if they haven't fixed it these things should be researched in order:

deep one corpse
aqua plastics
aqua plastic armor
ion beam accelerator
live deep one
ion armor
lobsterman navigator
magnetic navigation
magnetic ion armor
alien sub consturction
manta
hammerhead
lobsterman commander
leviathon
any commander
t'leth
That is what it was with the Win95 version
The DOS version was a tad different.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by NickAragua »

Along those lines, never research a "Tasoth Commander". Apparently, there's a bug where if you do so, you won't be able to get whatever the TFTD equivalent of psionics is.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Sounds good. I am making liberal use of Kasey's faq, so if I know what I want, I know how to get it, for the most part. The Tasoth commander bug is mentioned in the faq as well.

I did start up I.B.A's, but with 60 scientists the progress was listed as "average" so I bailed on it until I get more established and have more scientists.

I think I'll try and get some MC labs up and running next, since it's a long drawn out process to actually get competent MC 'nauts.

Research
Research
Research (maybe?)
Build
Train (a month here minimum)
Train (to improve skills, another month)

Hopefully the second base will be ready for an MC lab as well, so I can ship off some 'nauts to take an MC vacation. Having 2 sets of 'nauts training at once speeds things up, a little. If you can afford to have 20 'nauts offline for a month that is.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by Chesspieceface »

The latest version of Xcomutil is at http://www.bladefirelight.com/" target="_blank It supports the DosBox/Steam versions of XCOM and TFTD. Even if you don't use the 'extra' features, it fixes bugs including that weird research issue in TFTD.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Well, after an early terror mission in April, the rest of the month past uneventfully. Well, as far as X-com was concerned anyway. Nothing was detected right through to the end of the month. Unfortunately, The Egyptian Cartel signed on with the aliens, thus pulling out of X-com funding and pushing the earth one step closer to complete Alien domination. Nothing I could do about it. No sonar in range, and I don't watch the charts too closely. Australia also reduced funding, so things are looking a bit grim.

April had us discover the secret of Ion Beam Accelerators, and after interrogating a Deep One Terrorist, we now have clues to a more advanced kind of armour. Scientists are working hard on figuring it out, as the Aqua plastic armour is proving les than adequate.

Oh, and after researching a Bio-drone terrorist, our scientists had a few ideas about molecular control, from which they've designed an MC lab, the first of which is under construction as we speak.

Unfortunately, early May has another boat terror mission pop up, and this time it's bio-drones and Tasoth. The MC is coming fast and furious, forcing me to remember the sheer indestructibility of the Lobstermen with some fondness.

I don't think I'm going to be able to do yet another Terror mission. Between the panicking, berserking, and MC'ing, combined with the near perfect accuracy of both Tasoth and Bio-drones along with the aqua armour being as thin as paper, I can barely get anyone into the heart of the ship, let alone to the 2nd stage.

And what the fuck is up with the MC'ing hitting 'nauts that have never left the sub, have never been seen by an alien AND if if they had, are currently behind closed doors, preventing any LOS? I tried to just send a few 'nauts at a time, to reduce the effects of a zerker killing too many people, but that doesn't seem to matter as all 'nauts are susceptible to MC no matter where they are and no matter what LOS is available, even if it's none.

Sigh. Not sure how to proceed. Trying to finish the Terror mission is a guaranteed fail, even more so than the Lobster one. Do I just take it on the chin again and pull out? That seems a bit....ridiculous, from a balance standpoint. The lobstermen were bad enough, but now, if I just leave all my guys in the sub and hit end turn over and over again I'll STILL lose everyone and the sub.

It's a shame that when I get some MC enabled 'nauts that I can't just sit back out of range and pick off every single alien on the map, LOS or no.

I'm a bit frustrated, again. Definitely going to try some funky save and reload scenarios, to see if I can figure something out that will allow me to make progress rather than touching down, wiping my hands together and then lifting off again.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by dbt1949 »

Another "Cheat" you can do is when one of you men gets mind controlled is to reset to a previous turn and remove all his weapons (including grenades). Or perhaps just arm him with a stun rod.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Yeah, I'm really trying hard not to cheese it like that this time around, but I may have no choice.

Tried the mission again. Decided to shoot the barrels right outside the sub, as their is usually an alien hiding behind the boxes (cargo ship mission, first part). I shoot the barrels, everything blows up, even the boxes. Tasoth opportunity fires back into the sub with a knockout/freeze weapon. 11 'nauts go unconscious immediately. I tried using stimulatant to get some to recover, but none ever came around. Eventually 1 standing 'naut is MC'd, shoots another 'naut, and then is himself shot by my last 'naut. My last 'naut dies to an alien who snuck up behind him (not sure how) so he doesn't even see his killer.

The 11 unconscious 'nauts are left to fates unknown. End of mission.

Heh.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Just gave the mission a really serious shot and it ended when the last of my 'nauts was MC'd. I had more kills but never even finished part 1, let alone part 2.

It's a bit ridiculous.

Going to try dbt's method of saving right before the mission, then reloading in the hopes of a different terror mission. Hell, I think Lobstermen would be easier at this point.

That being said, I've already reloaded from about 24 hours earlier several times, and every terror mission was Tasoth and Bio-drones.

If I can't get something else, I'll probably just land, shoot any aliens in the area, then fall back and lift off again.

Sucks, but whatcha gonna do? :evil:
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by dbt1949 »

On the ground I reload after every turn. Don't need them very often but I'm trying to have fun here and if that's what it takes, so be it.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Terror mission changed to cruise liner. Unfortunately, same aliens, same result. It was fun trying to win it though. Bio-drones are quite difficult in close quarters without hth weapons. Stun rods can work, but it often takes 2 or 3 stuns to drop them. That's more TU's than an average 'naut can summon in 1 turn, so it takes more than 1 guy. Of course I could just shoot them, but then you risk getting caught in the explosion.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by dbt1949 »

Vibro blades and their ilk also work great on biodrones and they don't explode!
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

dbt1949 wrote:Vibro blades and their ilk also work great on biodrones and they don't explode!
No Calcinites yet = no hth weapons, including vibroblades.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Still grinding away at the Cruise Liner Terror mission with Tasoth and Bio-drones. It's pretty disheartening to have back to back unwinnable missions. In this case, the mind control is just dominating my guys until no one is left. MC Lab is still under construction.

So....I'm running a turn or 2 and then saving, doing my best to move forward that way. Finding and disabling the MC leader types is priority one, and I've gotten lucky and managed to snag one early, thus lowering the MC attacks per turn.

Unlike the Lobstermen mission where the frustration came from being unable to hurt them, this mission is impossible because I have zero defence against MC, and eventually everyone succumbs to panic, berserk or MC. But churning out 1 turn, then saving, then another, then saving is a chore, so sometimes I just run a bunch of turns in a row, no matter what happens (but I don't save). Man, those times are FUN. Between the bio-drones exploding, the MC'ing, the grenades, the tight quarters, it's a blast to play, and is why I'm playing a game that is over 10 years old. It's a shame that attrition is just too much for me to complete the mission without save/cheesing.

So I'm struggling to get through this mission and get back to some more reasonably balanced missions. Fingers crossed I don't see MC'ing Tasoth for a while after this.

I've got 1/2 my 'nauts in the ship, sweeping each section, while the other 1/2 are still in the sub, with all their weapons dropped in case of MC. They are my reserves. Normally I'd have everyone out at once but that gives too many targets for the MC'ers and increases the dangers of a friendly frag.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Knew I forgot to ask something.

I've been stunning my own guys when they get MC'd. Is that a good idea or a bad idea? What happens if the mission ends while guys are stunned? What happens if they were MC'd when stunned and the mission ends? Does that change if they weren't MC'd and the mission ends? Hopefully MC'd 'nauts are still brought home or forward to mission part 2?

Some of my guys, while MC'd, I've stunned and later have woken up back on my side with seemingly no ill effects (i.e. no bugs or anything). I'm hoping I can get away with stunning MC'd guys as a way to mitigate the impact of MC on a mission, for now.
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dbt1949
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by dbt1949 »

I believe if you MC one of your guys it counts as MIA. (or KIA)
Anyrate you never see them again.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

dbt1949 wrote:I believe if you MC one of your guys it counts as MIA. (or KIA)
Anyrate you never see them again.
Same deal if they are unconscious when the mission ends?
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by dbt1949 »

No, but I don't remember. If worried about it put the unconscious in one of your guy's backpack.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Ok, I didn't screw around. I made sure everyone was awake and on my side before finishing the top level, which is now done. I also picked up as much stuff as I could in order to bring it along, since the things on the floor in the sub are not available for the second part.

I quit out of part two since I had been playing for awhile and needed a break. The score was nearly -600!! That is a huge negative score. I hope at the end it at least takes into count the success I had on the top level.

Took me 79 turns to finish the top part of the ship. And now it's part two. That's ridiculous in my opinion. WAY too long, for me anyway.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Emptied the bottom half of the cruise liner in a surprisingly few 25 turns. Man, it's a wonder that ship is still floating. I feel like the ghost busters in the hotel, except firing explosives rather than proton accelerator rays (or whatever).

Finished researching ion Armour so switched production over to that in the hopes of having some of my guys live after being shot once.

Started researching Sonic Cannon. More firepower is more firepower, and I could certainly use it.

Question: Does the old trick from X-com where you unload all cartridges before the mission ends still work? It's supposed to preserve the clip and refill it after the mission is over. Normally, any partially discharged clip goes away after the mission ends. Poof, gone. But if you unload it before mission ends, surprise full clip!

Seems like I had a lot fewer Sonic Rifle clips after the ship terror mission than I should have had. My first guess is that the trick no longer works in Terror. Can anyone confirm/deny?
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by dbt1949 »

One of my first priorities is researching the sonic cannons. There are a number of things before then of course but when it comes to alien weapons.........
Even more than armor. You have saved games for that! :wink:
I usually try to get 90 scientists working as soon as possible. I found 90 works just as well as 100 and doesn't cost as much in purchase or maintenance.
Do you use the loophole of transferring a ship to another base and as soon as it gets there with zero fuel you send it on patrol? It never needs to be refueled until you bring it back in. It'll stay where ever you want for years if need be. (for lack of ammo or repair)Have to have the sonic AC cannons to make it worth your while tho.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

No, I don't bother with the no fuel required bug. I only do the remove the clip before the mission ends bug because it seems so unfair to lose an entire clip that is missing only 1 shot. Especially when you get into Zrbite ammo. I don't pay that close attention any more so I have no idea if it even works in Terror or not.

So, I think I failed to mention that an Alien Colony was spotted on the other side of the world. In fact, that's where my triton was headed before the cruise liner terror mission popped up and I diverted to the terror mission instead.

Before tackling the colony, I wanted to wait until I had sonic cannons + ammo researched. In the meantime, a small USO flew by my base. I intercepted and crashed it. I sent my Triton out while I waited for my scientists to do their thing. As it turns out, the alien sub was a wreck. It was daylight, in open terrain and I now had sonic rifles. The enemy? Gillmen. It was a slaughter. My forward spotters had little trouble seeing the enemy, and crouching snipers back at my sub picked them off, one by one. No casualties. I don't think the enemy even got a shot off. Unfortunately, with the sub nothing but wreckage, no zrbite was collected, and only 5 aqua plastic. I'm actually manufacturing the plastic now, since I'm out and no idea when I'll see more.

the MC lab was finished, but I am unable to begin training 'nauts until month end, which is disappointing, because the whole process already takes long enough without this delay.

After cannons + ammo were researched, I started on MC readers.

I have begun my assault on the enemy colony. I have discovered that more than 1/2 my 'nauts are susceptible to MC control. Not a surprise, but disappointing nevertheless. I will have to take extra care to prevent friendly fire from eating away at my team. I have written their names down so I know who to sack in the future.

After a few 'nauts fell, I decided to forge on, to see how the rest of the mission would turn out. In the end, I finished both parts with only 4 nauts reaching part 2, and only 3 'nauts making it out again. When the mission ended, all the MC susceptible guys who I left topside were back, so the final tally was 4 'nauts dead, and 2 MIA. Meaning I finished the assault with 8 of my 'nauts making it home afterward. Not bad for playing somewhat free and easy with peoples' lives.

That should have been good enough, except that most of those were the crappy MC'able ones. So I'm going back to see if I can do it better a second time.

The really weird thing was that most of the second level was empty. I found 2 lobsters hanging out together, and 4 lobsters in the final chamber, but other than that, it was silent. Kind of eerie, really.

I did discover that several of my 'nauts are very tough, MC-wise. Which was nice. Particularly nice is a sniper I have with over 70 TU and 72 accuracy. He seems immune to MC. He's a star. Several others proved difficult for the aliens to mess with, so I know that not all of my 26 'nauts will have to be canned to make way for more MC resistant new recruits.

Headed back to the colony for take 2.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by Sandpuppy »

So after reading this and seeing the other X-COM threads, I decided to reinstall TFTD. Even though I still have the original three games in the series, I got the Steam package deal. $15 seems a small price to pay to spare myself a spelunking mission through the closets, and not have to install Dosbox and all that. It's probably been about 8-9 years since I last played, and the return wasn't pretty. Bad luck and rusty skills smacked me down pretty good.

First base I chose to install near the coast of Japan. Turns out this was the quietest area for alien activity. I had already sunk a lot into building the place up by the time I realized that. A couple of USOs skittered past me if the first few weeks, but I was unable to catch or shoot them down. I sent out patrols fairly regularly, but turned up nothing.

It wasn't until mid-February that I got my first mission - a port attack in west Africa. By now I had already researched and produced Gauss rifles and cannons, so I was feeling better about my chances than the usual first-mission harpoon and gas-cannon loadout. I land at the site, and on the second turn, an alien tosses a grenade right at the triton's entrance, dropping 7 aquanauts instantly. The other three panic, drop their weapons and are subsequently picked off. In just four turns on my first mission, I managed to lose everybody, all my equipment, as well as the Triton, - without killing a single alien. The bean-counters aren't gonna like that.

Two weeks later, I get another call. Another port attack in Miami - at night of course. I manage to get everyone out, and even down a few aliens, but the combination of my squad's inaccuracy and my long out-of-practice X-COM tactics have things taking a sharp turn for the worse before long. It's clear I'm going to have to abort, and my primary objective turns to grabbing some alien weaponry so I can at least start research on those. I end up losing three aquanauts just to accomplish that, but I do manage to get out of there with 4 squaddies alive, some Blasta rifles, pulsar grenades, and a couple of dead alien specimens.

My first shipping attack call comes in March. Cargo ship being attacked by bio-drones and tasoth. Again, most of my guys have no experience, and disaster strikes again. I managed to make it into the holds and drop a few aliens, but the mind-control attacks are too overwhelming. My eventual demise comes in the form of an unconscious tasoth that I attempt to drag back to the ship. The folly of temptation. The two remaining aquanauts tasked with this never make it back. Another Triton with all hands lost.

Two days later, I get another call for a shipping attack, but I have no one or even a ship to send, so I have to let it go. A week later, I have my first successful mission - an island attack. I lose 9 of 14 aquanauts, save 5 civilians (that was total luck), and torch an entire beach house :). But I get some goodies to take back with me and have my first ace in the squad. Again, very shortly thereafter, I get another shipping SOS, but I'm too under-manned and under-gunned to feel I can take it on and let it go (I forgot how badly ignoring a terror strikes counts against you in this game).

By June, My production facility in Japan is cranking out Gauss Sub-Cannons to try and cover the rapidly dwindling funding, and I've established a base in the North Atlantic and have transferred a Barracuda there. Lots more activity in this area, and I start sending out the Triton on regular patrol. I turn up a medium-sized USO and land there. This is my first underwater mission - in June. Things go pretty well at first, but storming the alien vessel turns a bit costly. I lost 7 guys, including my ace (who was up to 8 kills by this point) to a head wound on the last turn, and caused significant damage to the USO with grenades. But I do manage to get a nice amount of Zrbite and Aquaplastic.

Shortly after, I shoot down a small USO and send the crew after it. It appears there is one survivor - a lone lobsterman. I've got some Blasta rifles, but few clips, so it's still mostly Gauss weaponry. Mr Lobster manages to get everyone armed with blastas right away and takes at least 15 hits from the Gauss guns without falling. Sending any of my guys to try and reclaim a blasta turns into a death-warrant. Damn thing almost single-handedly wiped out my entire crew. I manage to get one back to the ship and take off empty-handed so that I don't have to purchase a fourth Triton in my first seven months.

By late July, I get my first total success mission - 8 aliens killed, no losses, and an alien USO with no damage. But it's too little too late. At the end of the month, I get the call that everyone has pulled out of X-COM funding and the aliens take over. Once again, I'm responsible for the end of humanity.

I'll start on round two soon, but I think I'll take a (rusty) swing at Apocalypse again first.
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Re: Terror from the Deep AAR: Kinda. Sorta

Post by GreenGoo »

Awesome Sandpuppy, thanks for sharing.
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