Fellowship of the Ring (WW) - Conclusion

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:52 am

Remus West wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:
Arcanis wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:
Brendan wrote:Eh - half the first round deaths in these games are arbitrary or chosen simply for entertainment value.
And yet the other half are as simple as a Remus West/Chaosraven rivalry... still entertaining, but usually just to us.
On the other hand if one was WK the other would be corrupted.
Yep, Remus is the Witchking and I used to be Aragorn, you guys are f'ed.
Thought I told you to claim Gandalf so we could smoke him out. Sheesh. the simplest of plans ruined by poor help.

You know - in this particular setting where Evil can't talk, but the Corrupted knows who converted them, this kind of stuff puts me on edge.

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 11:57 am

Remus West wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:
Arcanis wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:
Brendan wrote:Eh - half the first round deaths in these games are arbitrary or chosen simply for entertainment value.
And yet the other half are as simple as a Remus West/Chaosraven rivalry... still entertaining, but usually just to us.
On the other hand if one was WK the other would be corrupted.
Yep, Remus is the Witchking and I used to be Aragorn, you guys are f'ed.
Thought I told you to claim Gandalf so we could smoke him out. Sheesh. the simplest of plans ruined by poor help.

You know i think your lying to me.

Lagom Lite · Post by **Lagom Lite** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:04 pm

RULES CLARIFICATIONS: (sheesh! keep your panties on!)

Chaosraven wrote:LL - What happens if URUKHAI targets Boromir?

This is the rule for Boromir: He is, and works exactly like, a Warrior of the Free People EXCEPT he has a different victory condition. Therefore, if Boromir is targeted by the Uruk-Hai during a Journey, Boromir is killed - and dies as Free People. The "corrupted for all intent and purposes" line is part of Boromir's (understandably confusing) flavor text.

Chaosraven wrote:
QUESTION:

If playerX is proven as Hobbit, given the Ring on Final Journey and is Captured on Final Journey, do servants win Chapter Seven or are we given the chance to Hunt Some Orc to free him?

In this instance, the Servants would win. The Fellowship is not able to Hunt some Orc in Chapter 7.

stessier wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:
stessier wrote:
Remus West wrote:We would need to free them and they would then need to pass the thing to keep it away from the Servants.
Yep, except the Ring can only be passed before the end of the day and Hunting Orc (and thus freeing prisoners) ends the day. A little conundrum there.
Journey sequence of events:

Uncorrupted Ringbearer may pass on the Ring.
Aragorn protects.
Gollum steals.
Witch-King searches.
Witch-King corrupts.
Uruk-Hai hunts.
Gandalf scans.

Chapter sequence of events:

Broadcast:
Which faction (Fellowship, Servants of the Eye, Gollum) controls the One Ring.
Which players are captured by the Uruk-Hai.
Remaining players.
Display ”You may Hunt some Orc” if ”Hunt some Orc” is legal.

======

Ring passed at Start of JOURNEY, not Chapter
I was going from this

HOBBIT GAMEPLAY

Frodo, Gollum or the Hobbits may become captured by the Uruk-Hai. A captured player is forbidden to post or vote so long as he is captured. A captured player may not be Appointed as Scout (lynched) until freed. If the captured player is a Ringbearer, that player keeps the Ring until he is released. Possession of the One Ring is considered to be with the Servants of the Eye faction in this instance. If the Ringbearer is freed by Hunt some Orc, however, and still uncorrupted the possession of the Ring goes back to whatever faction the Ringbearer has (Fellowship or Gollum). If the Uruk-Hai is killed while players are captured, those players are not freed but the Uruk-Hai is removed as an active player. In this case, goblins and orcs are considered to have run off with the little ones until the Fellowship have successfully Hunted some Orc.

Frodo and Hobbit Ringbearers may pass the Ring on to any other player at any time during a Chapter, before voting is closed, by sending a PM to the Moderator specifying which player the Ring is to be given. The recipient of the Ring will be told the player name of the player who sent the Ring to him. The Ring may only be passed on once per Chapter. The Ring may not be passed to a captured or dead player. If a Ringbearer is voted out before he is able or willing to pass the Ring on, Frodo finds it. If Frodo is dead or captured, it will be determined randomly who finds it. Captured players may not receive the Ring this way. Any of the Free People who holds the ring will be corrupted immediately and ally with the Servants of the Eye.

LL - which is it?

Both. The Ring may be passed, once, during a Chapter. The Ring may be passed, once, during a Journey.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:05 pm

stessier wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:I think I'm going to want answers from the Mod to the Floating Questions
The guy's probably eating dinner. A wee bit impatient today, aren't we?

The answer regarding Boromir is pretty vital to determining where we could be at, with regards to Semajs death.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:05 pm

Remus West wrote:Considering the work he put in to match game to book I would assume the Urakhai would kill Boromir. That is pure conjecture though.

Good point.

Considering all the captured Hobbits shouldn't we have access to Treebeard at some point?

He's not on anybody's side, because nobody's on his side.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:10 pm

Lagom Lite wrote:RULES CLARIFICATIONS: Both. The Ring may be passed, once, during a Chapter. The Ring may be passed, once, during a Journey.

You just made that up, didn't you.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:10 pm

Ok... so Semaj *could* have been Boromir.

1/6 Bad Guy died
5/6 Good Guy Died

and 1/3 Good Special Died

Both. The Ring may be passed, once, during a Chapter. The Ring may be passed, once, during a Journey.

Sweeeeeeeet

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:21 pm

Chaosraven wrote:
stessier wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:I think I'm going to want answers from the Mod to the Floating Questions
The guy's probably eating dinner. A wee bit impatient today, aren't we?
The answer regarding Boromir is pretty vital to determining where we could be at, with regards to Semajs death.

Sure, but there is no time limit I am aware of. We can let the poor man eat.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:22 pm

THE HOBBITS ((5))

Frodo
4 Hobbits

THE FREE PEOPLE ((6)) - ((now at 5))

Aragorn - semaj?
Gandalf - semaj?
Boromir - semaj?
3 Warriors of the Free People - semaj?

THE SERVANTS OF THE EYE

Witch-King
Uruk-Hai

GOLLUM

======================

PLAYERS

1. Arcanis
3. Remus West
4. Isgrimnur
5. Grundbegriff
6. Chaosraven
7. Brendan
8. tru1cy
9. Scoop20906
10. Unagi
11. theohall
12. redrun
13. Newcastle
14. stessier

---------------------------

2. Semaj of the Free People, slain by Uruk-Hai

==================

Journey sequence of events:

Uncorrupted Ringbearer may pass on the Ring.
Aragorn protects. - semaj not protected
Gollum steals.
Witch-King searches.
Witch-King corrupts.
Uruk-Hai hunts.
Gandalf scans.

=======================

If that turn order resolves as listed, semaj was not Corrupted

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:24 pm

stessier wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:
stessier wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:I think I'm going to want answers from the Mod to the Floating Questions
The guy's probably eating dinner. A wee bit impatient today, aren't we?
The answer regarding Boromir is pretty vital to determining where we could be at, with regards to Semajs death.
Sure, but there is no time limit I am aware of. We can let the poor man eat.

Hey, I refrained from sending him half a dozen PMs, ok?
Having played games FTF with me, would you describe me as Frenetic or Manic?

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:24 pm

Chaosraven wrote:Ok... so Semaj *could* have been Boromir.

1/6 Bad Guy died
5/6 Good Guy Died

and 1/3 Good Special Died

Who are the 3 Good Specials that could have died?

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:24 pm

stessier wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:Ok... so Semaj *could* have been Boromir.

1/6 Bad Guy died
5/6 Good Guy Died

and 1/3 Good Special Died
Who are the 3 Good Specials that could have died?

That's odds.

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:26 pm

1/3 as a ratio. there it is 2/6 which was reduced to 1/3.

Lagom Lite · Post by **Lagom Lite** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:27 pm

Grundbegriff wrote:
Lagom Lite wrote:RULES CLARIFICATIONS: Both. The Ring may be passed, once, during a Chapter. The Ring may be passed, once, during a Journey.
You just made that up, didn't you.

No.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:29 pm

Arcanis wrote:1/3 as a ratio. there it is 2/6 which was reduced to 1/3.

Brain fart.

I read it as 1 of the 6 was a Bad guy that could have died. 5 of 6 were Good Guys that could have died. And 1 of the 3 Specials could have died. I object to Boromir being counted as a good Special which is why I asked. Yeah, 5th grade math - got it.

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:31 pm

stessier wrote:Also, I wouldn't count Boromir as a Good Special. He's the Sorcerer.

Still odd?

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:32 pm

pfft. ignore me. I seem to share stessier's fart issue.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:33 pm

Next up: N-dimensional topologies in Elvish mindspace.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:37 pm

You guys are really more comfortable with 16.5% used?

Seems to me that people start arguing about the tiniest discrepancies at that point...

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:38 pm

Chaosraven wrote:You guys are really more comfortable with 16.5% used?

Seems to me that people start arguing about the tiniest discrepancies at that point...

Nah, I just hadn't really read your post then saw his reply and your comment on it and my mind jumped to his comment regarding Boromir as sorc.

tru1cy · Post by **tru1cy** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:39 pm

Grundbegriff wrote:
tru1cy wrote:Send me to scout if you like...
?

Don't you want to play?

I'm always playing....

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:41 pm

Witchraven wrote:THE FREE PEOPLE ((6)) - ((now at 5))

Aragorn - semaj?
Gandalf - semaj?
Boromir - semaj?
3 Warriors of the Free People - semaj?

I find this odd. The King could have successfully converted someone last night. That should say "now at 5 or 4."

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:43 pm

Chaosraven wrote:If that turn order resolves as listed, semaj was not Corrupted

Which implies, IIRC, that either someone else was corrupted xor the Witch-King learned that the target was a member of {Frodo, Hobbit01, Hobbit02, Hobbit03, Hobbit04, Gollum, Uruk-Hai}

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:45 pm

tru1cy wrote:
Grundbegriff wrote:
tru1cy wrote:Send me to scout if you like...
?
Don't you want to play?
I'm always playing....

Ahh. Very well. Carry on. Being tapped to go scouting is too harsh a sentence for tru1cy, wouldn't you say?

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:51 pm

stessier wrote:
Witchraven wrote:THE FREE PEOPLE ((6)) - ((now at 5))

Aragorn - semaj?
Gandalf - semaj?
Boromir - semaj?
3 Warriors of the Free People - semaj?
I find this odd. The King could have successfully converted someone last night. That should say "now at 5 or 4."

Getting to the Conversion side of things in a minute

stessier wrote:The Fellowship was 14.

4 hobbits + Frodo + Gollum + 2 Evil = 8 who wouldn't have died last night. 6 Free People who could have. That's less than 50% chance of someone dying. Clearly this expedition is cursed. We're doomed.

Additional chance of Conversion = 6 Immune, 1 Using ability, 1 Miss, 6 Viable targets
So 7 of 13 targets a Fail
Equally likely as a Kill by UrukHai

Unagi wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:Shit... Even worse, it gives the witchking a shopping list of hobbits to corrupt.
nope on converts (but yes on hunting for the ringbearer).

2. Convert one of the Free People by whispering sweet promises of power into the ear of one player. Corruption this way only works on the Free People but not on Hobbits, Frodo, Gollum or Servants of the Eye.

Arcanis wrote:possible roles of Samaj:
Aragorn, Gandalf, Boromir, 3x Warriors of the Free People.

So there is a 50/50 chance that we lost a special. Not counting chance of corruption by the King.

stessier wrote:So yeah, this is gonna be tough.

Also, I wouldn't count Boromir as a Good Special. He's the Sorcerer.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:57 pm

Chaosraven wrote:Grund, I don't think the urukhai can kill a ringearer. If hobbit, frodo or gollum, they are captured. If free, they would have been corrupted before his order is processed, and its a miss, from the way the order looks. LAGOM - CAN FRODO PASS THE RING TO A CORRUPTED HOBBIT IN CHAPTER SEVEN TO WIN? Or is anyone corrupted given the new role of Servant of the Eye?

I think I missed having that question asked

If free, they would have been corrupted before his order is processed, and its a miss, from the way the order looks.

LL, do the steps resolve in order?
i.e. Corrupted by Ring, Corrupted by WK, Hunted by UH, Scanned by Gandlaf?
Thereby affecting steps following?

Lagom Lite · Post by **Lagom Lite** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:00 pm

Chaosraven wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:Grund, I don't think the urukhai can kill a ringearer. If hobbit, frodo or gollum, they are captured. If free, they would have been corrupted before his order is processed, and its a miss, from the way the order looks. LAGOM - CAN FRODO PASS THE RING TO A CORRUPTED HOBBIT IN CHAPTER SEVEN TO WIN? Or is anyone corrupted given the new role of Servant of the Eye?
I think I missed having that question asked

If free, they would have been corrupted before his order is processed, and its a miss, from the way the order looks.

LL, do the steps resolve in order?
i.e. Corrupted by Ring, Corrupted by WK, Hunted by UH, Scanned by Gandlaf?
Thereby affecting steps following?

Yes.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:05 pm

ok, then Semaj was NOT target of WK

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:08 pm

THE HOBBITS ((5))

Frodo
4 Hobbits

THE FREE PEOPLE ((6)) - ((now at 5)) possibly 4 if WK Corrupted

Aragorn - semaj?
Gandalf - semaj?
Boromir - semaj?
3 Warriors of the Free People - semaj?

THE SERVANTS OF THE EYE ((2)) possibly 3 if WK Corrupted

Witch-King
Uruk-Hai
(possible corrupted)

GOLLUM ((1))

======================

PLAYERS

1. Arcanis
3. Remus West
4. Isgrimnur
5. Grundbegriff
6. Chaosraven
7. Brendan
8. tru1cy
9. Scoop20906
10. Unagi
11. theohall
12. redrun
13. Newcastle
14. stessier

---------------------------

2. Semaj of the Free People, slain by Uruk-Hai

==================

Journey sequence of events:

Uncorrupted Ringbearer may pass on the Ring.
Aragorn protects. - semaj not protected
Gollum steals.
Witch-King searches.
Witch-King corrupts. - semaj not targeted
Uruk-Hai hunts. - semaj hunted to death
Gandalf scans.

redrun · Post by **redrun** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:25 pm

Grundbegriff wrote: One does not simply walk into Mordor.

Grundbegriff wrote: Wasted on cross-country! Very dangerous over short distances!

-- Bah. I don't know which is worse - trying to read Grund, or reading his quotes and thinking about when I'll find time to watch the movies again.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:28 pm

Chaosraven wrote:
stessier wrote:
Witchraven wrote:THE FREE PEOPLE ((6)) - ((now at 5))

Aragorn - semaj?
Gandalf - semaj?
Boromir - semaj?
3 Warriors of the Free People - semaj?
I find this odd. The King could have successfully converted someone last night. That should say "now at 5 or 4."
Getting to the Conversion side of things in a minute

You mean, you decided (for the sake of clarity) not to fold the issue of corruption into your population numbers and to address the effect of corruption on population in a subsequent post?

I guess that means you're the Mother Alien.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:30 pm

Grundbegriff wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:
stessier wrote:
Witchraven wrote:THE FREE PEOPLE ((6)) - ((now at 5))

Aragorn - semaj?
Gandalf - semaj?
Boromir - semaj?
3 Warriors of the Free People - semaj?
I find this odd. The King could have successfully converted someone last night. That should say "now at 5 or 4."
Getting to the Conversion side of things in a minute
You mean, you decided (for the sake of clarity) not to fold the issue of corruption into your population numbers and to address the effect of corruption on population in a subsequent post?

I guess that means you're the Mother Alien.

THERE ARE FIVE CONVICTS

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:32 pm

Grundbegriff wrote:You mean, you decided (for the sake of clarity) not to fold the issue of corruption into your population numbers and to address the effect of corruption on population in a subsequent post?

Or perhaps I deliberately omitted something to see who would respond...

... like Unagi noting that the WK doesn't convert Hobbits...

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:36 pm

Grundbegriff wrote: Players

Arcanis

Brendan

Chaosraven

Grundbegriff

Isgrimnur

Newcastle

redrun

Remus West

Scoop20906

Semaj (One of {Aragorn, Gandalf, Boromir, W01, W02, W03})

stessier

theohall

tru1cy

Unagi
Roles

Frodo

Hobbit01 (Sam)

Hobbit02 (Merry)

Hobbit03 (Pippin)

Hobbit04 (Harpo)

Aragorn {Protects}

Gandalf {Scans}

Boromir {Wins with Servants}

Warrior01 (Gimli)

Warrior02 (Legolas)

Warrior03 (Eowyn)

Witch-King {Seeks, Corrupts}

Uruk-Hai {Kills, Uruk-Haijacks}

Gollum

Who can prove himself?
Who can be emulated by Servants?
Who is expendable?
Is there a rational way to select a Scout?

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:37 pm

1 other possibility on WK's corruption is that Aragorn protected last night as well. The probability of that happening is pretty slim as both WK and Ar had to randomly select the same target, but should also be listed under possible outcomes. I think all of the other possibilities got covered.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:37 pm

Uruk-Hai {Kills, Uruk-Haijacks}

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:41 pm

Hobbit04 (Harpo)
this is Fatty Bolger in the boardgame

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:44 pm

Arcanis wrote:1 other possibility on WK's corruption is that Aragorn protected last night as well. The probability of that happening is pretty slim as both WK and Ar had to randomly select the same target, but should also be listed under possible outcomes. I think all of the other possibilities got covered.

Is there any reason Aragorn should NOT attempt protection?

I think the only way he shouldn't is on Journey Six, to leave options open for Journey Seven, if required.

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:45 pm

Grundbegriff wrote:
Grundbegriff wrote: Players

Arcanis

Brendan

Chaosraven

Grundbegriff

Isgrimnur

Newcastle

redrun

Remus West

Scoop20906

Semaj (One of {Aragorn, Gandalf, Boromir, W01, W02, W03})

stessier

theohall

tru1cy

Unagi
Roles

Frodo

Hobbit01 (Sam)

Hobbit02 (Merry)

Hobbit03 (Pippin)

Hobbit04 (Harpo)

Aragorn {Protects}

Gandalf {Scans}

Boromir {Wins with Servants}

Warrior01 (Gimli)

Warrior02 (Legolas)

Warrior03 (Eowyn)

Witch-King {Seeks, Corrupts}

Uruk-Hai {Kills, Uruk-Haijacks}

Gollum
Who can prove himself?
Who can be emulated by Servants?
Who is expendable?
Is there a rational way to select a Scout?

1.I don't think anyone can prove, at least not without us scouting them or if a scanner their scan target.
2.Any can be emulated by Servants of some kind. WK->Gan Uruk->Ar (by not attacking their declared "protected") No one would want to emulate Go or Bor.
3.Expendable would be badguys, Gol, Bor, with potential to be worth sacrificing freemen and possibly Gan. later. Ar has worth at the very end (as laid out in a plan earlier) but could be sacrificed if needed as well.
4.Scout the non-hobbits as we will need at least 1 proven hobbit for the victory condition.

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:47 pm

Chaosraven wrote:
Arcanis wrote:1 other possibility on WK's corruption is that Aragorn protected last night as well. The probability of that happening is pretty slim as both WK and Ar had to randomly select the same target, but should also be listed under possible outcomes. I think all of the other possibilities got covered.
Is there any reason Aragorn should NOT attempt protection?

I think the only way he shouldn't is on Journey Six, to leave options open for Journey Seven, if required.

I meant that Ar protected from conversion. It would be stupid of him not to attempt to protect someone last night.