SCOTUS Watch

[Drazzil]

Anarchy is great if you’re the biggest kid on the playground.

I suspect some folks think they’re bigger than they really are.

No. I know I'm dead as a doornail if the country collapses. I don't pretend to be good at violence. I'm actually shit at it.

And do you have kids? Honest question - what fucking horse do you even have in this game? We know you are totally cool with just dying, etc... so - if some of us actually give a fucking half-shit about the future - where does your opinion start to matter?

I live here too. I do not have kids. And that last part, my opinion not mattering? That's why the country is in the shitter.

[Unagi]

I may not do it again but tons of hopeless will.

You will, or you will do 'just as good'... and you should take this brief moment on the rise of the hill to realize what drives you: hopelessness. Don't try and tell us your version is better than that version, just a post ago, you pretend to be a stroke above... You aren't.

[Drazzil]

Drazzil, quit saying “we” all the time.

We as in the country. We the people need to do something drastic to survive.

[Unagi]

Anarchy is great if you’re the biggest kid on the playground.

I suspect some folks think they’re bigger than they really are.

No. I know I'm dead as a doornail if the country collapses. I don't pretend to be good at violence. I'm actually shit at it.

And do you have kids? Honest question - what fucking horse do you even have in this game? We know you are totally cool with just dying, etc... so - if some of us actually give a fucking half-shit about the future - where does your opinion start to matter?

I live here too. I do not have kids. And that last part, my opinion not mattering? That's why the country is in the shitter.

No, your disconsolate wretched frame of mind - not to mention cowardice call to violence is the only part of your opinion that doesn't matter. Forgive me for giving your 'lets kill everyone' solution a hard pass.

[hepcat]

Drazzil, quit saying “we” all the time.

We as in the country. We the people need to do something drastic to survive.

A bunch of people (like myself) voted for Obama and were generally fine with his time in office. You don’t speak for me. You don’t speak for most folks, it seems. Remember that and stop trying to make everyone believe you’re right about everything just because you pretend you speak for everyone.

[Blackhawk]

Can we just get a smiley of Homer backing into the hedge? It would save a lot of time.

This attitude my fellow forumers. Its like Stockholm syndrome.

No, this is the response when you peek through the hedge and notice the neighbors banging a goat on a trampoline. You just quietly back away. There is simply no response.

Drazzil, you sound like the guy on the corner who smells like patchouli and pee while carrying an 'End is Nigh!' sign.

[Drazzil]

Anarchy is great if you’re the biggest kid on the playground.

I suspect some folks think they’re bigger than they really are.

No. I know I'm dead as a doornail if the country collapses. I don't pretend to be good at violence. I'm actually shit at it.

And do you have kids? Honest question - what fucking horse do you even have in this game? We know you are totally cool with just dying, etc... so - if some of us actually give a fucking half-shit about the future - where does your opinion start to matter?

I live here too. I do not have kids. And that last part, my opinion not mattering? That's why the country is in the shitter.

No, your disconsolate wretched frame of mind - not to mention cowardice call to violence is the only part of your opinion that doesn't matter. Forgive me for giving your 'lets kill everyone' solution a hard pass.

Wow. I overgeneralize a bit don't I? I had to look up disconsolate. I knew the meaning of the word, I just had to be sure. Thanks for broadening my vocabulary. Very nice of you.

What I am saying is this: Unless the left, or the people who are being given the shit end of the stick, don't do something soon, to change the trajectory of the country, we (as in most of us) will find ourselves in a full on fascist government. Our country has tried protesting. The protests were criminalized and crushed. The people have tried voting, and found itself with politicians who were unwilling to change much of anything.
The country is now extremely jerrymandered. You will not have the success at GOTV in 22, because the Democrats who are supposed to be representing us are in actual fact, in bed with the republicans.

The only way I can see Biden doing anything for this country is that if he starts acting extrajudicially. Our politics and government and elected leaders have tied themselves into a Gordian knot of special interests and partisan politics. The one thing he could do (but won't, because he is part of the system he needs to change) is cut through it with a knife. Starting with citing Madison v Marbury and cutting the Supreme court of pushing their own extraconstitutional originalism out.

[Drazzil]

Can we just get a smiley of Homer backing into the hedge? It would save a lot of time.

This attitude my fellow forumers. Its like Stockholm syndrome.

No, this is the response when you peek through the hedge and notice the neighbors banging a goat on a trampoline. You just quietly back away. There is simply no response.

Drazzil, you sound like the guy on the corner who smells like patchouli and pee while carrying an 'End is Nigh!' sign.

Funny. To me, you guys are the ones banging the goat on the trampoline, cept, the trampoline is on fire and the fire department is standing around it taking bets on whether you can come in the goat before the smoke inhalation gets you.

[Blackhawk]

You know, over the years Draz, we've given you a lot of advice, most (all?) of which you have ignored. Most people quit. I held on and tried to help you longer than most. So here is one final piece of well-meaning advice, given in genuine good will and hopes to help.

Drazzil, you have gone over the edge. You need help. If you don't, you are are very close to coming to a bad end of your own making. You can come back, but you need help. Now.

And with that, I'm retired. Ignore it or not, your choice, but you are rapidly running out of opportunities to make good choices.

[Kraken]

Drazzil, quit saying “we” all the time.

We as in the country. We the people need to do something drastic to survive.

A bunch of people (like myself) voted for Obama and were generally fine with his time in office. You don’t speak for me. You don’t speak for most folks, it seems. Remember that and stop trying to make everyone believe you’re right about everything just because you pretend you speak for everyone.

Yeah, Obama wasn't the reformer we were hoping for, but he was a mostly competent caretaker and a man of integrity, which earns him a rating of Good Enough. Biden is trying to be that reformer and will go down as a great president if he succeeds...which is something I sure didn't see coming, but I'm rooting for him.

I mean, have you even looked at what the Dem reconciliation bill is trying to do? Expand health, child, and elder care...extend antipoverty payments...fight global warming... here are three pages of bullet points. IDK what more you think the government can do, and not all of those bullets are going to survive the sausage making, but maybe you can at least agree that it's trying to do a lot. One might even call it drastic.

[Unagi]

Unless the left, or the people who are being given the shit end of the stick, don't do something soon, to change the trajectory of the country, we (as in most of us) will find ourselves in a full on fascist government.

I don't disagree with this. I'm not sure it's a -given- but I absolutely share the fear.

The people have tried voting, and found itself with politicians who were unwilling to change much of anything.

We avoided keeping Trump in office. Period. I don't honestly know where this country will go in 2022 and 2024 - and it may not be where people assume. And, of course, it may be.... (i.e. south)

the Democrats who are supposed to be representing us are in actual fact, in bed with the republicans.

First, I don't think there is any coordinated 'in league with' aspect to this... but as far as beds go... It's the only bed. THE only bed. You talk about burning the bed, but the game doesn't start again until there is a new 'bed' - and you can't pretend to know how to make a new bed, you just hate the people in the bed and it doesn't fit you to begin with ,etc... I get it. You just don't seem to think about this magical 'next bed' and I don't understand how you think that new bed would even remotely be designed with you in mind? You don't even plan to be a part of this revolution - you just demand it.

The only way I can see Biden doing anything for this country is that if he starts acting extrajudicially.

Let's just carve this one simple point of yours our for a moment. If you expect one person to work extrajudicially, how can you be so upset about the "enemy" that you basically accuse of acting extrajudicially?

I don't have your magic solution to this, but I recognize the folly in breaking the law, in order to keep the law.... but please don't let that sound like I don't understand how hopeless things are.

[Default]

I don't remember protests being "crushed" in Philly, fwiw.

[Alefroth]

Drazzil, quit saying “we” all the time.

We as in the country. We the people need to do something drastic to survive.

As long as it's someone else doing it.

[Zarathud]

The supreme court granted itself the right to judicially examine laws passed in the United States and strike them down at will. That's a judicial overreach. Also I am absolutely correct in my reference of the case.

No. You can't even get the name consistent.

I'm sure it'll do NOTHING.

Marbury v Madison.

I recommend Madison v Marbury and you say "Oh we can't do that, cause then we would have no court to defend us.

Starting with citing Madison v Marbury and cutting the Supreme court of pushing their own extraconstitutional originalism out.

Get some mental help, dude.

We have it much better than every other era in America, Drazzil. You're not in the food lines like those during the Depression. You're not saving scrap metal and rationing for the war effort in World War II. No soldiers are bunking in your house like before the Revolutionary War. Even the riots and shootings are contained. During the civil rights movement during the 60s, the protests were brutally cracked down in the streets, the leaders spied upon, and their efforts subverted. We've seen worse jerrymandering before the Civil War -- whole Slave states were created to balance the vote. It's popular right now to say we're living at the end of America, but that's bullshit. We've come through worse times.

But not by bellyaching on the internet about it. If you really want a revolution, the least you can do is get off your ass and endure some real suffering to struggle for reform. And vote for someone (the Democrats) who might be able to do something if they get more than a tie vote. Rather than quitting and burning everything down. You don't get to ragequit life.

[Drazzil]

The supreme court granted itself the right to judicially examine laws passed in the United States and strike them down at will. That's a judicial overreach. Also I am absolutely correct in my reference of the case.

No. You can't even get the name consistent.

I'm sure it'll do NOTHING.

Marbury v Madison.

I recommend Madison v Marbury and you say "Oh we can't do that, cause then we would have no court to defend us.

Starting with citing Madison v Marbury and cutting the Supreme court of pushing their own extraconstitutional originalism out.

Get some mental help, dude.

We have it much better than every other era in America, Drazzil. You're not in the food lines like those during the Depression. You're not saving scrap metal and rationing for the war effort in World War II. No soldiers are bunking in your house like before the Revolutionary War. Even the riots and shootings are contained. During the civil rights movement during the 60s, the protests were brutally cracked down in the streets, the leaders spied upon, and their efforts subverted. We've seen worse jerrymandering before the Civil War -- whole Slave states were created to balance the vote. It's popular right now to say we're living at the end of America, but that's bullshit. We've come through worse times.

But not by bellyaching on the internet about it. If you really want a revolution, the least you can do is get off your ass and endure some real suffering to struggle for reform. And vote for someone (the Democrats) who might be able to do something if they get more than a tie vote. Rather than quitting and burning everything down. You don't get to ragequit life.

Madison ad nauseum. You're arguing semantics to avoid addressing the point. Namely, the supreme court is a partisan wrecking ball aimed at the very foundations of our nation. They've made some stupid stupid stupid rulings, and shouldn't be allowed to order off a takeout menu, much less muck about in the business of government. We've got a bench stacked with alleged rapists and coup conspirators and ACB just ruled in texas that women don't get a choice anymore. Oh and I'm supposed to campaign for the Democrats? The same ineffectual corporate sock puppets who just allowed a million people to get evicted because they couldn't see a month or so down the road when they dumped this whole shitshow on the CDC?

So, you got an idea about how the president or the democrats can be something other then the other fork on the flicking tongue of the one percenter snake that's ramming though bullshit unconstitutional laws? An idea about how Biden can take his presidential power and other then impeaching them, or yaknow, just quoting that case where they stole the power to affect how government does its business, by all means, lay it on me.

Cause DC statehood? Making more states? Giving DC the right to vote? That ain't happening through congress. That's why I say impeaching or ignoring the court is the only option I see at this point, and all the other stuff is just hopium because we don't have the time anymore. 2022 we will lose congress, and in 2024 the Democrats will be facing the last fair election this country may ever see. Someone on our side needs to play some serious hardball, or we are done.

Prove me wrong.

[stessier]

We've got a bench stacked with alleged rapists and coup conspirators and ACB just ruled in texas that women don't get a choice anymore.

That's the (hopefully short term) effect of the ruling, but that's not what the ruling said.

[Drazzil]

We've got a bench stacked with alleged rapists and coup conspirators and ACB just ruled in texas that women don't get a choice anymore.

That's the (hopefully short term) effect of the ruling, but that's not what the ruling said.

How is this a short term effect? Who is a higher authority then the supreme court? The appeal was struck down.

[Zarathud]

The Supreme Court has made plenty of bad rulings. Stop being hysterical.

Yes, there’s injustice. But you were never promised a rose garden.

You’re expecting everything to happen the way you want. But the world never worked that way. Obama said that progress will come in fits and starts. Not a smooth line or straight path. And that the cynics will accomplish the least.

You keep saying crazy, stupid shit, Drazzil. The world is not ending. It’s not game over. It’s a shit show, but that happens periodically.

Armed internal conflict in the streets will not improve the situation . Ask Afghanistan. Or Lebanon. Or Egypt. Or the French post revolution.

[Blackhawk]

Never get involved in a land war in Asia, and never argue law with a lawyer.

[Zarathud]

Well, Drazzil does want bloodshed. And admitted to being terrible at it.

If you really believe armed conflict is the only way to change things, start with this — get your ass out to the Portland protests — or soon to be protests in Texas. Put your body on the streets against violent conservatives. Let me know how it goes, and how much you can take.

When we were young in the 90s, my wife did abortion clinic defense. Putting her body on the line so women could go in and get health services, including abortions. It’s easy to call for a revolution from your comfy chair at home. Being out there is entirely different.

[Drazzil]

Well, Drazzil does want bloodshed. And admitted to being terrible at it.

If you really believe armed conflict is the only way to change things, start with this — get your ass out to the Portland protests — or soon to be protests in Texas. Put your body on the streets against violent conservatives. Let me know how it goes, and how much you can take.

When we were young in the 90s, my wife did abortion clinic defense. Putting her body on the line so women could go in and get health services, including abortions. It’s easy to call for a revolution from your comfy chair at home. Being out there is entirely different.

Yep... You're right. On both counts.

[gbasden]

The Supreme Court has made plenty of bad rulings. Stop being hysterical.

Yes, there’s injustice. But you were never promised a rose garden.

You’re expecting everything to happen the way you want. But the world never worked that way. Obama said that progress will come in fits and starts. Not a smooth line or straight path. And that the cynics will accomplish the least.

You keep saying crazy, stupid shit, Drazzil. The world is not ending. It’s not game over. It’s a shit show, but that happens periodically.

Armed internal conflict in the streets will not improve the situation . Ask Afghanistan. Or Lebanon. Or Egypt. Or the French post revolution.

The world may or may not be ending (see: global warming), but I have to agree with Drazzil that I think there's a better than average chance we end up in a fascist authoritarian dystopia in the relatively near future. I think it's terrifying what the right is doing currently. I just differ in thinking that Democrats turning it into a different authoritarian dystopia is the answer. But I very much disagree that this is just normal partisan gamesmanship.

[Zaxxon]

Yeah, nothing about the past few years is normal.

[YellowKing]

The one thing that somewhat gives me hope (at least over the long-term) is that conservatives are, on paper, in a bad spot.

Their social policies are extremely unpopular, and most of them (aside from gun control) are all about putting a genie back in the bottle. That's always a hard position to fight from. And the demographics aren't on their side. I mean there's a reason why they have to gerrymander, restrict voting rights, and pour gasoline on political divisiveness. If they could win elections on their platform alone, there would be no need to go to such extremes.

I feel like we're living through the cornered honey badger phase of the Republican party, and we're going to have to deal with scratches, bites, and flung feces for awhile until the slow, grinding gears of progress chew them up. But I feel like long-term, we will move in the right direction. Because I don't think the conservative fascist state is sustainable.

To those of us who are news junkies and follow this stuff religiously, what the right's doing is horrendous. For most people on the street, until it impacts them personally it's just peripheral noise. That's why I think the Texas abortion law may have crossed a line the GOP will regret. They went from underdog on abortion (which fuels their base) to victory and actually impacting millions of women. You think those millions of women are going to roll over and just say "Oh well?" Not a chance. When the GOP starts actually fucking with the status quo, instead of just threatening it, they are likely in for a world of hurt.

I know there's this overwhelming sense of complacency, that the left isn't fighting hard enough, etc. But again, I don't think we've hit the point where people are truly personally impacted. If we reach that point, and people roll over, *then* I'll panic. But so far I haven't seen evidence that it's the case. Trump lost. Dems won the Senate. It was messy, it was close, but it still happened. And that was under circumstances in which, by and large, most people weren't personally impacted all that much by Trump's reign as bad as it was.

[Blackhawk]

My fear is that when we reach that point, they may have had enough time to stack the deck that it won't matter.

They're trying to legally rig the elections so that they can't lose. If they pull that off, popularity won't matter.

[Drazzil]

The Supreme Court has made plenty of bad rulings. Stop being hysterical.

Yes, there’s injustice. But you were never promised a rose garden.

You’re expecting everything to happen the way you want. But the world never worked that way. Obama said that progress will come in fits and starts. Not a smooth line or straight path. And that the cynics will accomplish the least.

You keep saying crazy, stupid shit, Drazzil. The world is not ending. It’s not game over. It’s a shit show, but that happens periodically.

Armed internal conflict in the streets will not improve the situation . Ask Afghanistan. Or Lebanon. Or Egypt. Or the French post revolution.

The world may or may not be ending (see: global warming), but I have to agree with Drazzil that I think there's a better than average chance we end up in a fascist authoritarian dystopia in the relatively near future. I think it's terrifying what the right is doing currently. I just differ in thinking that Democrats turning it into a different authoritarian dystopia is the answer. But I very much disagree that this is just normal partisan gamesmanship.

Id rather have a democratic authoritarian dystopia then a republican one. Hail President Redford!

[Carpet_pissr]

It pained me to click on an article about Trump (and I know it’s folly thinking that my one “non click” on Trump articles makes a difference), but here is an excerpt from some of his comments about the recent SCOTUS decision in TX re: abortion:

“I think other things will happen,” he said. “And that will be the big deal in the big picture, so we’ll see what would happen. ”

So what, right? Very typical Trump-speak.

I guess I have been so actively avoiding reading anything about him lately that this one time I did, it (still) shocked me just how…idiotic he sounds so much of the time.

Politicians say stupid, meaningless shit all the time. People that talk constantly often use fillers that have little to no meaning. But he just takes it to a whole new level.

And yes, it’s a selected phrase out of a longer interview, but the rest is not much better.

He really is the King of Gibberish.

[stessier]

We've got a bench stacked with alleged rapists and coup conspirators and ACB just ruled in texas that women don't get a choice anymore.

That's the (hopefully short term) effect of the ruling, but that's not what the ruling said.

How is this a short term effect? Who is a higher authority then the supreme court? The appeal was struck down.

Do you know what the appeal was asking? Do you know what the Court said? Or did you just read headlines?

If you're in a "burn the world down" type of mood, at least be sure you know why you're doing it. Here's a link to SCOTUSBlog's article on the case. In it they link to all the opinions. Worth a read.

[El Guapo]

It pained me to click on an article about Trump (and I know it’s folly thinking that my one “non click” on Trump articles makes a difference), but here is an excerpt from some of his comments about the recent SCOTUS decision in TX re: abortion:

“I think other things will happen,” he said. “And that will be the big deal in the big picture, so we’ll see what would happen. ”

So what, right? Very typical Trump-speak.

I guess I have been so actively avoiding reading anything about him lately that this one time I did, it (still) shocked me just how…idiotic he sounds so much of the time.

Politicians say stupid, meaningless shit all the time. People that talk constantly often use fillers that have little to no meaning. But he just takes it to a whole new level.

And yes, it’s a selected phrase out of a longer interview, but the rest is not much better.

He really is the King of Gibberish.

It is really something else to read transcripts of Trump's remarks, which really make clear how unable he is to articulate coherent thoughts most of the time.

Remember this doozy?

TRUMP: It does not show that. The record shows that I'm right. When I did an interview with Howard Stern, very lightly, the first time anybody's asked me that, I said, very lightly, I don’t know, maybe, who knows. Essentially. I then did an interview with Neil Cavuto, we talked about the economy, it’s more important. I then spoke to Sean Hannity, which everybody refuses to call Sean Hannity. I had numerous conversationa with Sean Hannity at Fox. And Sean Hannity said -- and he called me the other day and I spoke to him about it and he said you were totally against the war, because he was for the war and that was before the war started. Sean Hannity said very strongly, to me and other people, he's willing to say, but nobody wants to call him, I was against the war. He said you used to have fights with me, because Sean was in favor of the war.

And I understand that side also. Not very much, because we should have never been there, but nobody called Sean Hannity. And then they did an article in a major magazine, shortly after the war started. I think in '04. But they did an article, which had me totally against the War in Iraq. And one of your compatriots said, you know, whether it was before or right after, Trump was definite because if you read this article, there's no doubt. But if somebody, and I'll ask the press, if somebody would call up Sean Hannity, this was before the war started. He and I used to have arguments about the war. I said it's a terrible and a stupid thing. It's going to destabilize the Middle East. And that’s exactly what this's done.

[malchior]

It's his secret power. He is the broccoli of politics. He absorbs whatever flavor he stews in. Saying nonsense allows his cult followers to fill in the gap with whatever they want or believe in already.

[Jaymann]

What does everybody call Sean Hannity?

[Carpet_pissr]

It does make me wonder if he actually has something in mind when he says shit like that ("other things will happen" and "the big deal in the big picture" ) or it's just total and complete word salad horseshit bc his brain is just that scrambled?

Maybe a case where he knows or heard about the (R) playbook on this, has a vague idea what the overall goal is (don't we all?) and wants to seem mysterious yet "in the know".

"Not many people know this, but the Republicans have been trying to remove, or take away (they call it "REPEAL" (not many people know that word, but it's true), Roe (which stands for ROE v WADE - not many people know that) for years now. I told them years ago (ask anybody) to get that roe out of here, nobody wants it! and they all agreed with me, and started working on it. Nobody had really thought how bad it was before I came in but I strongly told them many many people were angry about it."

Dammit why am I posting about Trump?! I've done so well ignoring him for the past several months.

[Carpet_pissr]

What does everybody call Sean Hannity?

Dammit, I actually posted that word for word, then deleted it! Ha!

And it's "Herb". Everyone calls Hannity, "Herb".

[malchior]

It does make me wonder if he actually has something in mind when he says shit like that ("other things will happen" and "the big deal in the big picture" ) or it's just total and complete word salad horseshit bc his brain is just that scrambled?

Maybe a case where he knows or heard about the (R) playbook on this, has a vague idea what the overall goal is (don't we all?) and wants to seem mysterious yet "in the know".

He never has anything particular in mind except do people love me. If he says something and people react negatively, well that's bad. A recent example would be when he advocated for the vaccines. He got booed. He throws that shit away. It makes people not love him.

He does the same thing the other way. He is basically acting like a pro wrestling promotion. He will say whatever gets him over. Luckily for us he is too stupid to realize he is only listening to a tiny part of the audience. Unfortunately those people figured out a way they might win no matter what. And everyone in the GOP is aping his act now.

[malchior]

What's the thought here? Intellectual dishonesty or bubble of delusion?

[El Guapo]

It's both, with a heavy dose of self-delusion. Barrett doesn't want to think of herself as a partisan hack, she wants to think of herself as a disinterested arbiter of justice - it just so happens that what "justice" mandates happens to line up pretty neatly with her political beliefs.

[Smoove_B]

Sounds like she's concerned people aren't taking her seriously - like the only reason she was appointed was due to political shenanigans and that somehow diminishes her presence.

She could resign (along with Justice Beer Bro) if it means that much to her.

Or maybe Biden should just add more Justices to restore integrity?

[El Guapo]

Sounds like she's concerned people aren't taking her seriously - like the only reason she was appointed was due to political shenanigans and that somehow diminishes her presence.

She could resign (along with Justice Beer Bro) if it means that much to her.

Or maybe Biden should just add more Justices to restore integrity?

It's also true that the more people and the media think of the SCOTUS as a partisan institution, the less useful it is to the conservative movement. So they need to spend some time / effort spreading the perception that the SCOTUS isn't partisan (to free up space for it to be partisan).

[Archinerd]

Or maybe Biden should just add more Justices to restore integrity?

Sounds good to me.
I wasn't on board with this idea before, but at this point I think we need to put the fire out and worry about how to rebuild the house later.

[Smoove_B]

In case you were wondering where this is apparently all going:

FYI: In the SCOTUS challenge to MS's 15-week abortion ban, Jonathan Mitchell, the architect of TX's SB 8, has filed an amicus brief on behalf of TX Right to Life. The brief invites the Court to overrule Roe & Casey AND Lawrence & Obergefell, 2 major LGBTQ equality decisions.

Lawrence v. Texas is the 2003 decision that decriminalized same-sex sex. Obergefell v. Hodges is the 2015 decision that legalized marriage equality across the country.

So the focus here is on Roe & Casey ... for now. The long-term plan is to overturn all of these decisions.