After a short period of worrying silence, NASA said on Saturday night that it was able to regain contact with the Ingenuity helicopter. The autonomous aircraft unexpectedly ceased communications with the Perseverance rover, which relays all transmissions between Ingenuity and Earth, on Thursday during its 72nd flight on Mars. It had already been acting up prior to this, having cut its previous flight short for an unknown reason, and NASA intended to do a systems check during the latest ascent.
SPACE - random thread about space stuff
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
NASA says it’s reestablished contact with the Ingenuity Mars helicopter
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Space is hard, and it is complex, too. I've been reading Lunar Outfitters: Making the Apollo Space Suit by Bill Ayrey
![Enlarge Image](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/61rKtHxafFL._SL1200_.jpg)
It is astonishing how complex these suits are. The book documents how ILC (International Latex Corporation), which made Playtex undergarments for women, got involve with making flight suits for the military and eventually went on to be contracted by NASA to make the suits that the astronauts wore on the moon. The book talks about the people and organization, but it is more focused on the technical aspects of designing and building the suits. And the suits are amazing. They are, indeed, individual spacecraft which have to be form fitted to individuals and be reasonably comfortable to wear for long periods. They have to allow the user to stand, sit, bend over, reach and grasp, walk and climb up and down ladders and through hatches. They have to provide a pressurized environment with cooling that allows air flow all over the body and yet be constructed with materials, including cables and pulleys
that prevent the suit from ballooning out in the vacuum of space. And it has to protect the wearer in direct sunlight and surface temperatures in the hundreds of degrees and yet be adaptable if the astronaut walks in the shade where the ground temp would be well below zero. Really an amazing achievement.
The author was a long time employee for ILC, a space suit test engineer who spent more than 140 hours pressurized in a Space Shuttle EVA suit (not all at once of course
) during the years of development. Over the past twenty years he has worked with the Smithsonian Institution assisting with the preservation of the suits in the collection.
![Enlarge Image](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/61rKtHxafFL._SL1200_.jpg)
It is astonishing how complex these suits are. The book documents how ILC (International Latex Corporation), which made Playtex undergarments for women, got involve with making flight suits for the military and eventually went on to be contracted by NASA to make the suits that the astronauts wore on the moon. The book talks about the people and organization, but it is more focused on the technical aspects of designing and building the suits. And the suits are amazing. They are, indeed, individual spacecraft which have to be form fitted to individuals and be reasonably comfortable to wear for long periods. They have to allow the user to stand, sit, bend over, reach and grasp, walk and climb up and down ladders and through hatches. They have to provide a pressurized environment with cooling that allows air flow all over the body and yet be constructed with materials, including cables and pulleys
![Shocked :shock:](./images/smilies/icon/eek.gif)
The author was a long time employee for ILC, a space suit test engineer who spent more than 140 hours pressurized in a Space Shuttle EVA suit (not all at once of course
![Wink :wink:](./images/smilies/icon/wink.gif)
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
What happens when an astronaut in orbit says he's not coming back?
Turns out the question has come up.
Turns out the question has come up.
The rest of the story is an interesting read. If you don't have time I'll cut to the juicy bits:Taylor Wang was deeply despondent.
A day earlier, he had quite literally felt on top of the world by becoming the first Chinese-born person to fly into space. But now, orbiting Earth on board the Space Shuttle, all of his hopes and dreams, everything he had worked on for the better part of a decade as an American scientist at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, had come crashing down around him.
Wang was the principal investigator of an experiment called the Drop Dynamics Module, which aimed to uncover the fundamental physical behavior of liquid drops in microgravity. He had largely built the experiment, and he then effectively won a lottery ticket when NASA selected him to fly on the 17th flight of the Space Shuttle program, the STS-51-B mission. Wang, along with six other crew members, launched aboard Space Shuttle Challenger in April 1985.
On the second day of the mission, Wang floated over to his experiment and sought to activate the Drop Dynamics Module. But it didn't work. He asked the NASA flight controllers on the ground if he could take some time to try to troubleshoot the problem and maybe fix the experiment. But on any Shuttle mission, time is precious. Every crew member has a detailed timeline, with a long list of tasks during waking hours. The flight controllers were reluctant.
After initially being told no, Wang pressed a bit further. "Listen, I know my system very well," he said. "Give me a shot." Still, the flight controllers demurred. Wang grew desperate. So he said something that chilled the nerves of those in Houston watching over the safety of the crew and the Shuttle mission.
"Hey, if you guys don't give me a chance to repair my instrument, I'm not going back," Wang said.
Exactly what happened after that may never be known. But thanks to new reporting, we may finally have some answers. And though this is an old story, it still reverberates today, four decades on, with lasting consequences into the era of commercial spaceflight as more and more people fly into orbit.
Spoiler:
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Interesting article, thanks for posting it. Regarding the quote...
By the way, I finished Lunar Outfitters: Making the Apollo Space Suit by Bill Ayrey and it was excellent.
...back in 2015 the Germanwings Flight 9525 was supposedly deliberately crashed by its co-pilot after the pilot left the cockpit. Scary stuff.He noted that the problem is not limited to spaceflight, citing an incident involving Joseph David Emerson last year, in which the off-duty pilot attempted to shut down the engines on an Alaska Airlines plane. Emerson, who was sitting on the flight deck jump seat in the cockpit, attempted to grab and pull two red fire handles that would have activated the plane's emergency fire suppression system and cut off fuel to its engines. He claimed to be having a panic attack.
By the way, I finished Lunar Outfitters: Making the Apollo Space Suit by Bill Ayrey and it was excellent.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Speaking of moon suits, Artemis moon spacesuits prepped for tests ahead of delayed 2026 lunar landing
![Wink :wink:](./images/smilies/icon/wink.gif)
"stiff fabric" is hardly an adequate description of the Apollo moon spacesuits, as the book I just finished has shown. But then I don't expect space reporters to read long, complex tech booksPrivately made spacesuits for NASA moon astronauts could hit a big design milestone this year.
Officials with Axiom Space, the company making spacesuits for the Artemis program, said Monday (Jan. 22) that the garments may reach a critical design review soon. In fact, that review could happen as soon as June. However, the news comes just two weeks after NASA was forced to delay its astronaut touchdown plans by an additional year. As of now, landing is expected to occur no earlier than 2026.
The new generation of moon fashion should allow Artemis astronauts greater flexibility than the bunny-hopping Apollo crews of the 1960s and 1970s, who worked in stiff fabric. But the feat of dressing Artemis explorers safely has caused schedule concerns; the earliest was announced in 2021 by NASA's Office of Inspector General (OIG). The department had warned that NASA's spacesuit development program in general did not allow for a moon landing in 2024 (the goal at that time). NASA added an extra year for landing preparation to target 2025.
Progress has been made since then with two private vendors, but ongoing technical delays with the spacesuits, SpaceX's Starship lander and the crewed Artemis 2 round-the-moon mission forced NASA this month to once again push back Artemis 3's landing to no earlier than 2026 — a decision officials say they took in large part to meet safety requirements.
![Wink :wink:](./images/smilies/icon/wink.gif)
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Japan's moon probe nailed its landing but took a tumble
![Enlarge Image](https://i.imgur.com/xF34Or9.jpeg)
![Enlarge Image](https://i.imgur.com/xF34Or9.jpeg)
A wheeled rover that was released before the SLIM craft landed snapped a photo that appears to show the probe upside-down on the moon’s surface. As such, the lander’s solar panels are not angled properly to harness sunlight and power up the probe, according to JAXA.
The agency said there is still a chance that the lander could recover and generate power as sunlight shifts in the coming days.
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
NASA's Mars helicopter Ingenuity has flown its last flight after suffering rotor damage
![Enlarge Image](https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/CVF6bnw6jfC2cEFtDfWpod-970-80.jpg)
NASA's pioneering helicopter Ingenuity has made its final Mars flight.
Ingenuity — the first-ever robot to ply the skies of an alien world — suffered rotor-blade damage during its most recent hop and "is no longer capable of flight," NASA announced today (Jan. 25).
"The historic journey of Ingenuity, the first aircraft on another planet, has come to an end," NASA Administrator Bill Nelson said in an agency statement.
![Enlarge Image](https://cdn.mos.cms.futurecdn.net/CVF6bnw6jfC2cEFtDfWpod-970-80.jpg)
Though the little helicopter's prime mission was targeted to last just 30 days, it remained operational on the Martian surface for nearly three years. Staying aloft for nearly 129 minutes during its 72 Red Planet flights, Ingenuity covered about 11 miles (17.7 kilometers) of ground, according to the mission's flight log.
But Ingenuity encountered some problems during its final flight, which occurred on Jan. 18. During that sortie, "communications between the helicopter and rover terminated early, prior to touchdown," NASA said in a statement.
The mission team managed to reestablish contact with Ingenuity, but imagery the chopper collected during the Jan. 18 flight revealed that one or more of its four rotor blades "sustained damage during landing," NASA officials wrote in today's update.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
--------------------------------------------
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Don't know how many times I had to deal with a moon (or Mun) lander in Kerbal Space Program that wasn't uprightIsgrimnur wrote: ↑Mon Jan 29, 2024 3:26 pm Japan's upside-down SLIM moon lander wakes up on lunar surface and snaps new photos
![Rolling Eyes :roll:](./images/smilies/icon/rolleyes.gif)
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
European Space Agency project astronaut Marcus Wandt captured this photo of the International Space Station's jam-packed interior in January 2024, during the private Ax-3 mission to the orbiting lab. (Image credit: Marcus Wandt/ESA)
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
More info on JAXA's rover that took the photo of SLIM. It's very cute. I imagine they'll sell a lot of those if they convert the rover design back into toy drone or robot form.Isgrimnur wrote: ↑Mon Jan 29, 2024 3:26 pm Japan's upside-down SLIM moon lander wakes up on lunar surface and snaps new photos
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Sad news for our collegues in JPL today as JPL announces layoffs to 8% of its workforce. It's unfortunate that NASA doesn't have a real 2024 budget to work with and has to continue with numbers from last year. It's also going to impact several JPL projects currently in the pipeline, such as Veritas.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Here is an excellent video about the search for the mysterious, hypothosized Plant 9.
Jaymann
]==(:::::::::::::>
Black Lives Matter
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Black Lives Matter
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Spam…the perfect food for weightless environments?
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
SpaceX to launch Starship again 'in about 3 weeks,' Elon Musk says
![Wink :wink:](./images/smilies/icon/wink.gif)
Personally I'd be fine if Ye took the next flightThe third test flight of SpaceX's giant Starship rocket could be just around the corner, according to Elon Musk.
"Starship were meant to fly and our next one launches in about 3 weeks, but I recommend waiting for a few more test flights before hopping on board," Musk said Monday (Feb. 12) in a post on X .
The billionaire entrepreneur was replying to a post from the rapper Ye (formerly known as Kanye West), who had asked Musk, "Where my rocket ship?" The two moguls have known each other for more than a decade and have interacted frequently on X/Twitter over the years.
![Wink :wink:](./images/smilies/icon/wink.gif)
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
SpaceX set to launch Intuitive Machines IM-1 mission from Florida
A SpaceX Falcon 9 is set to launch a lunar lander for Intuitive Machines (IM) of Houston, Texas. The mission, IM-1, will see the launch of the first of the IM Nova-C class landers from Launch Complex 39A (LC-39A) at Kennedy Space Center in Florida. Teams are currently targeting Feb. 14 at 12:57 AM ET (05:57 UTC) for launch. If IM-1 successfully lands on the Moon, IM will become the first commercial organization, and the first American spacecraft in over 50 years, to successfully land on the surface of the Moon.
We planned to do with with the Space Shuttle carrying a loaded Centaur upper stage in the payload bay. Of course it was a bit trickier because we had to plan for the abort scenarios.The Nova-C class lunar lander for this mission has been aptly named Odysseus after the mythical Greek character renowned for his long, epic journey and his intellectual brilliance, guile, and versatility. The naming is appropriate as Nova-C has been designed with state-of-the-art technology, including the first cryogenic liquid methane and liquid oxygen propulsion, also known as methalox, system to attempt a lunar landing.
The use of methalox to fuel the lander has complicated the well-tuned Falcon 9 “load-and-go” procedure, during which fueling takes place immediately prior to launch to maintain optimal conditioning of the liquid propellants. Cryogenic propellants for the spacecraft within the fairing also have to be loaded as late as possible, and SpaceX has, therefore, designed and built additional connections to the lander from the transporter-erector, which provides ground connections to the Falcon 9. IM has indicated that two wet dress rehearsals were carried out to ensure the new connections function correctly. Fueling of the spacecraft is due to commence approximately two and a half hours prior to liftoff, according to SpaceX.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
The launch of Intuitive Machines’ IM-1 mission on board SpaceX’s Falcon 9 rocket from Launch Complex 39A in Florida was postponed Tuesday, Feb. 13, due to off-nominal methane temperatures prior to stepping into methane load. SpaceX and Intuitive Machines are now targeting 1:05 a.m. EST Thursday, Feb. 15. Additional updates can be found on Intuitive Machines and SpaceX platforms.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
NASA Artemis Science, First Intuitive Machines Flight Head to Moon
A suite of NASA science instruments and technology demonstrations is on the way to our nearest celestial neighbor for the benefit of humanity. Through this flight to the Moon, they will provide insights into the lunar surface environment and test technologies for future landers and Artemis astronauts.
At 1:05 a.m. EST on Thursday, Intuitive Machines’ Nova-C lander launched on a SpaceX Falcon 9 rocket from Launch Complex 39A at the agency’s Kennedy Space Center in Florida. At approximately 1:53 a.m., the lander deployed from the Falcon 9 second stage. Teams confirmed it made communications contact with the company’s mission operations center in Houston. The spacecraft is stable and receiving solar power.
These deliveries are part of NASA’s CLPS (Commercial Lunar Payload Services) initiative and Artemis campaign, which includes new solar system science to better understand planetary processes and evolution, search for evidence of water and other resources, and support long-term human exploration.
NASA science aboard the lander includes:
Intuitive Machines’ Nova-C-class lunar lander, named Odysseus, is scheduled to land on the Moon’s South Pole region near the lunar feature known as Malapert A on Thursday, Feb. 22. This relatively flat and safe region is within the otherwise heavily cratered southern highlands on the side of the Moon visible from Earth. Landing near Malapert A will also help mission planners understand how to communicate and send data back to Earth from a location where Earth is low on the lunar horizon.
- Lunar Node 1 Navigation Demonstrator: A small, CubeSat-sized experiment that will demonstrate autonomous navigation that could be used by future landers, surface infrastructure, and astronauts, digitally confirming their positions on the Moon relative to other spacecraft, ground stations, or rovers on the move.
- Laser Retroreflector Array: A collection of eight retroreflectors that enable precision laser ranging, which is a measurement of the distance between the orbiting or landing spacecraft to the reflector on the lander. The array is a passive optical instrument and will function as a permanent location marker on the Moon for decades to come.
- Navigation Doppler Lidar for Precise Velocity and Range Sensing: A Lidar-based (Light Detection and Ranging) guidance system for descent and landing. This instrument operates on the same principles of radar but uses pulses from a laser emitted through three optical telescopes. It will measure speed, direction, and altitude with high precision during descent and touchdown.
- Radio Frequency Mass Gauge: A technology demonstration that measures the amount of propellant in spacecraft tanks in a low-gravity space environment. Using sensor technology, the gauge will measure the amount of cryogenic propellant in Nova-C’s fuel and oxidizer tanks, providing data that could help predict fuel usage on future missions.
- Radio-wave Observations at the Lunar Surface of the Photoelectron Sheath: The instrument will observe the Moon’s surface environment in radio frequencies, to determine how natural and human-generated activity near the surface interacts with and could interfere with science conducted there.
- Stereo Cameras for Lunar Plume-Surface Studies: A suite of four tiny cameras to capture imagery showing how the Moon’s surface changes from interactions with the spacecraft’s engine plume during and after descent.
The NASA science aboard will spend approximately seven days gathering valuable scientific data about Earth’s nearest neighbor, helping pave the way for the first woman and first person of color to explore the Moon under Artemis.
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After a decade and $1.2 billion, NASA reveals its booty from Bennu: 121 grams
It's about the same mass as a small avocado, and you can't even smear it on toast.
...
And small though the sample may be, it is 20 times greater than the amount of asteroid material previously returned to Earth by a pair of Japanese sample return missions. A little will go a long way as scientists study the organics and other materials in this asteroid dust to divine clues to the origin of life and conditions that existed at the dawn of our Solar System. You don't need handfuls of material to get a meaningful result from an electron microscope.
Moreover, the sample retrieval was double the minimum requirement for the mission, 60 grams. So, OSIRIS-REx can now definitively be labeled as an unqualified success.
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
The show's not over yet. OSIRIS-REx has been granted an extended mission, OSIRIS-APEX: Travel to the asteroid Apophis to study how Earth's gravity affects the asteroidIsgrimnur wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 1:05 pm After a decade and $1.2 billion, NASA reveals its booty from Bennu: 121 grams
It's about the same mass as a small avocado, and you can't even smear it on toast.
...
And small though the sample may be, it is 20 times greater than the amount of asteroid material previously returned to Earth by a pair of Japanese sample return missions. A little will go a long way as scientists study the organics and other materials in this asteroid dust to divine clues to the origin of life and conditions that existed at the dawn of our Solar System. You don't need handfuls of material to get a meaningful result from an electron microscope.
Moreover, the sample retrieval was double the minimum requirement for the mission, 60 grams. So, OSIRIS-REx can now definitively be labeled as an unqualified success.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Intuitive Machines, NASA Science Progress Toward Moon Landing
Intuitive Machines’ Odysseus lander has completed lunar orbit insertion successfully and is currently orbiting the Moon. Odysseus continues to be in excellent health and is approximately 60 miles (92km) from the Moon.
The spacecraft will orbit the Moon for approximately one day before beginning its descent toward the lunar surface. The landing opportunity is targeted for Thursday, Feb. 22, at 5:30 p.m. EST.
All powered NASA science instruments on board have completed their transit checkouts, received data, and are operating as expected, including: LN-1 (Lunar Node 1 Navigation Demonstrator), NDL (Navigation Doppler Lidar for Precise Velocity and Range Sensing), RFMG (Radio Frequency Mass Gauge), ROLSES (Radio-wave Observations at the Lunar Surface of the Photoelectron Sheath), SCALPSS (Stereo Cameras for Lunar Plume-Surface Studies). Since the LRA (Laser Retroreflector Array) instrument is a passive experiment designed for the lunar surface, it cannot conduct any operations in transit.
LN-1 has made three successful passes with NASA’s Deep Space Network, establishing real-time communications with ground stations on Earth. Upon lunar touchdown, the LN-1 team will conduct a full systems checkout and begin continuous operations within 24 hours of landing. NASA’s Deep Space Network will receive its transmissions, capturing telemetry, Doppler tracking, and other data and relaying it back to Earth.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
ETA for landing delayed to 6:24 ET.jztemple2 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:46 pm Intuitive Machines, NASA Science Progress Toward Moon Landing
Intuitive Machines’ Odysseus lander has completed lunar orbit insertion successfully and is currently orbiting the Moon. Odysseus continues to be in excellent health and is approximately 60 miles (92km) from the Moon.
The spacecraft will orbit the Moon for approximately one day before beginning its descent toward the lunar surface. The landing opportunity is targeted for Thursday, Feb. 22, at 5:30 p.m. EST.
All powered NASA science instruments on board have completed their transit checkouts, received data, and are operating as expected, including: LN-1 (Lunar Node 1 Navigation Demonstrator), NDL (Navigation Doppler Lidar for Precise Velocity and Range Sensing), RFMG (Radio Frequency Mass Gauge), ROLSES (Radio-wave Observations at the Lunar Surface of the Photoelectron Sheath), SCALPSS (Stereo Cameras for Lunar Plume-Surface Studies). Since the LRA (Laser Retroreflector Array) instrument is a passive experiment designed for the lunar surface, it cannot conduct any operations in transit.
LN-1 has made three successful passes with NASA’s Deep Space Network, establishing real-time communications with ground stations on Earth. Upon lunar touchdown, the LN-1 team will conduct a full systems checkout and begin continuous operations within 24 hours of landing. NASA’s Deep Space Network will receive its transmissions, capturing telemetry, Doppler tracking, and other data and relaying it back to Earth.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
I'm still not sure whether to be happy about the result.raydude wrote: ↑Thu Feb 22, 2024 4:02 pmETA for landing delayed to 6:24 ET.jztemple2 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2024 7:46 pm Intuitive Machines, NASA Science Progress Toward Moon Landing
Intuitive Machines’ Odysseus lander has completed lunar orbit insertion successfully and is currently orbiting the Moon. Odysseus continues to be in excellent health and is approximately 60 miles (92km) from the Moon.
The spacecraft will orbit the Moon for approximately one day before beginning its descent toward the lunar surface. The landing opportunity is targeted for Thursday, Feb. 22, at 5:30 p.m. EST.
All powered NASA science instruments on board have completed their transit checkouts, received data, and are operating as expected, including: LN-1 (Lunar Node 1 Navigation Demonstrator), NDL (Navigation Doppler Lidar for Precise Velocity and Range Sensing), RFMG (Radio Frequency Mass Gauge), ROLSES (Radio-wave Observations at the Lunar Surface of the Photoelectron Sheath), SCALPSS (Stereo Cameras for Lunar Plume-Surface Studies). Since the LRA (Laser Retroreflector Array) instrument is a passive experiment designed for the lunar surface, it cannot conduct any operations in transit.
LN-1 has made three successful passes with NASA’s Deep Space Network, establishing real-time communications with ground stations on Earth. Upon lunar touchdown, the LN-1 team will conduct a full systems checkout and begin continuous operations within 24 hours of landing. NASA’s Deep Space Network will receive its transmissions, capturing telemetry, Doppler tracking, and other data and relaying it back to Earth.
I watched it live and the IM team claimed it was successful. Bill Nelson claimed it was successful. Hopefully they'll do more than "receive a faint signal".
Conform or be cast out!
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
quote below from the Washington Post article:
LN-1: Lunar Node Navigation Demonstrator - uses NASA's DSN and doppler tracking to help provide real-time position for autonomous spacecraft position determination
RFMG: Radio Frequency Mass Guage - uses radio waves to measure the amount of propellant left in the spacecraft propellant tanks
NDL: Navigation Doppler LIDAR - uses light and doppler ranging to help determine altitude and velocity during descent
I'm guessing these first 3 will be refined and become standard on future IM landers.
Laser Retro-Reflector Array: reflects light directly back in the opposite direction. Useful for future missions to determine distance and location
SCALPSS: Stereo cameras for lunar plume surface studies - takes pictures during landing to help understand the interaction between the landing engines and the lunar surface
Cool, so this isn't exactly their first rodeo. As for science, it looks like a lot of the NASA payloads were there as technology demonstrators to support the landing:Before co-founding Intuitive Machines with entrepreneur Kam Ghaffarian, Steve Altemus and Tim Crain worked together at NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston. There they worked on a NASA effort called Project Morpheus, which was designed to build an experimental low-cost lunar lander.
LN-1: Lunar Node Navigation Demonstrator - uses NASA's DSN and doppler tracking to help provide real-time position for autonomous spacecraft position determination
RFMG: Radio Frequency Mass Guage - uses radio waves to measure the amount of propellant left in the spacecraft propellant tanks
NDL: Navigation Doppler LIDAR - uses light and doppler ranging to help determine altitude and velocity during descent
I'm guessing these first 3 will be refined and become standard on future IM landers.
Laser Retro-Reflector Array: reflects light directly back in the opposite direction. Useful for future missions to determine distance and location
SCALPSS: Stereo cameras for lunar plume surface studies - takes pictures during landing to help understand the interaction between the landing engines and the lunar surface
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Given what I just heard during the News Conference, I think you're right that some of those things will become standard soon.
In particular, Tim Crain spoke very highly of the RFMG (saving them from spending time on a non-anomaly) and the NDL stepping in once they realized their own laser rangefinders were unavailable. They forgot to un-safe their lasers before launch, which required a physical switch to be flipped. They got very lucky that the realized the lasers were not functional before doing their landing burn. They re-wrote the FSW in a couple of hours to use NASA's payload in place of the lasers.
As usual, Flight Software updates come to the rescue.![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon/biggrin.gif)
The poor comms are because the lander is on its side, possibly because they hit a rock and tipped over. They had a bit more lateral velocity than they wanted (none). They're hoping to get some images soon to see.
Thankfully, unlike the other recent lander, they have a solar panel pointing upward so they're getting power. They are hoping that the panel on the top of the lander will start getting illumination as the sun moves toward the horizon.
In particular, Tim Crain spoke very highly of the RFMG (saving them from spending time on a non-anomaly) and the NDL stepping in once they realized their own laser rangefinders were unavailable. They forgot to un-safe their lasers before launch, which required a physical switch to be flipped. They got very lucky that the realized the lasers were not functional before doing their landing burn. They re-wrote the FSW in a couple of hours to use NASA's payload in place of the lasers.
As usual, Flight Software updates come to the rescue.
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon/biggrin.gif)
The poor comms are because the lander is on its side, possibly because they hit a rock and tipped over. They had a bit more lateral velocity than they wanted (none). They're hoping to get some images soon to see.
Thankfully, unlike the other recent lander, they have a solar panel pointing upward so they're getting power. They are hoping that the panel on the top of the lander will start getting illumination as the sun moves toward the horizon.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
When I was working on the Shuttle program, relatives would ask why so many people worked there. I say that we had to have a second set of eyes on everything done, checks and double checks, independent reviews, etc.Hrdina wrote: ↑Fri Feb 23, 2024 8:02 pm In particular, Tim Crain spoke very highly of the RFMG (saving them from spending time on a non-anomaly) and the NDL stepping in once they realized their own laser rangefinders were unavailable. They forgot to un-safe their lasers before launch, which required a physical switch to be flipped.
Thank goodness for flight software updates indeed
![Wink :wink:](./images/smilies/icon/wink.gif)
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Yeah, that is the world I've lived in for 30+ years now. At least we're not worried about manned spacecraft, but we still employ checklists for everything, QA signing off each step, peer reviews, Change Control Boards, etc.jztemple2 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 23, 2024 8:50 pmWhen I was working on the Shuttle program, relatives would ask why so many people worked there. I say that we had to have a second set of eyes on everything done, checks and double checks, independent reviews, etc.Hrdina wrote: ↑Fri Feb 23, 2024 8:02 pm In particular, Tim Crain spoke very highly of the RFMG (saving them from spending time on a non-anomaly) and the NDL stepping in once they realized their own laser rangefinders were unavailable. They forgot to un-safe their lasers before launch, which required a physical switch to be flipped.
Thank goodness for flight software updates indeed![]()
I've fixed on-orbit problems before, but never when orbital mechanics were imposing a deadline measured in a few hours before we needed to perform a deorbit burn. IM did some very impressive engineering there.
I really hope that the problem is that un-safing the lasers was omitted from the pre-flight checklist, and not that someone marked that step "completed" without doing it, or even worse that there were no checklists!
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
When I was still a field engineer we had quality inspectors who had to buy off work done by the technicians. Some bean counter decided that for many jobs the technicians could be their own quality inspector
. NASA insisted on keeping the QA inspectors for some jobs but for others we just had to trust the techs ![Rolling Eyes :roll:](./images/smilies/icon/rolleyes.gif)
![Rolling Eyes :roll:](./images/smilies/icon/rolleyes.gif)
![Rolling Eyes :roll:](./images/smilies/icon/rolleyes.gif)
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
It's a shame we can't pilot landers remotely. The round-trip signal delay is what, 3 seconds? Seems like you could have a human take it most of the way and just leave the last 100 feet to the onboard navigation.
I get that perfecting the landing software and systems is one of the main objectives of these private missions, though, so at least these companies/agencies are getting good data for their next missions. Maybe the landing gear need a wider base to be more tip-resistant.
I get that perfecting the landing software and systems is one of the main objectives of these private missions, though, so at least these companies/agencies are getting good data for their next missions. Maybe the landing gear need a wider base to be more tip-resistant.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
So many companies across so many industries at every scale do or flirt with this. I recall being told we were going to be our own QA for a while (it didn't last) and of course, some things slipped by - non-maliciously.
It's like proofreading your own term paper... You don't see see certain errors that stand out to a fresh set of critical eyes.
When it's put to things like public safety, aerospace engineering, etc - the costs are much greater.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
A short interview with Ben Bussy, Chief Scientist at Intuitive Machines. Ben used to work at APL and he was the PI for Mini-RF, an instrument on LRO that I still do data archiving for. Great guy and yet another reason why I think IM is one to watch. They've certainly got leaders for whom lunar spacecraft is not their first rodeo.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Ironic that he says they found "a good, large, safe area, free of boulders" when they theorize that the landing leg struck a boulder.raydude wrote: ↑Sat Feb 24, 2024 4:48 pm A short interview with Ben Bussy, Chief Scientist at Intuitive Machines. Ben used to work at APL and he was the PI for Mini-RF, an instrument on LRO that I still do data archiving for. Great guy and yet another reason why I think IM is one to watch. They've certainly got leaders for whom lunar spacecraft is not their first rodeo.
His interview reminded me of trying to land at different "biomes" on the Mun in KSP.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
SpaceX tests new emergency escape system to certify pad 40 at Cape Canaveral for astronaut missions
SpaceX is closing in on certifying its launch pad at Space Launch Complex 40 to support astronaut and cargo missions with its second-generation Dragon spacecraft. On Monday, the company performed a test of its new emergency egress system featuring a type of deployable slide.
The red slide flew out of a storage container positioned on the crew access tower and deployed along pre-stationed cables that extend to the ground, safely away from where a Falcon 9 rocket would stand. It differs notably from the slide-wire style baskets featured at Launch Complex 39A.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
And regarding SpaceX... FAA closes investigation into explosive 2nd flight of SpaceX's Starship megarocket
And... Following aborted WDRs Flight 3 enters additional preparationsThe U.S. Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) has closed the investigation into the second flight of SpaceX's huge Starship vehicle, the agency announced this afternoon (Feb. 26).
That test mission, which launched from SpaceX's Starbase site in South Texas on Nov. 18, ended with a bang. Two bangs, actually: Both of Starship's stages exploded high above Earth, around 3.5 minutes and eight minutes after liftoff, respectively.
Ever since, SpaceX has been prepping for Starship flight number 3, in keeping with the company's fast-paced "build, fly and iterate" philosophy. But today's news does not constitute clearance to launch, the FAA stressed.
"Prior to the next launch, SpaceX must implement all corrective actions and receive a license modification from the FAA that addresses all safety, environmental and other applicable regulatory requirements," agency officials wrote in an emailed statement today.
"The FAA is evaluating SpaceX’s license modification request and expects SpaceX to submit additional required information before a final determination can be made," they added.
The mishap investigation, which SpaceX led, identified 17 corrective actions, which the FAA accepted. Seven of them concerned Starship's huge first-stage booster, known as Super Heavy, "including vehicle hardware redesigns, updated control system modeling, reevaluation of engine analyses based on OTF-2 [Orbital Flight Test-2] flight data and updated engine control algorithms," the FAA's emailed statement reads.
The other 10 corrective actions deal with the vehicle's 165-foot-tall (50 meters) upper stage, which is called Starship. Among these modifications are "vehicle hardware redesigns, operational changes, flammability analysis updates, installation of additional fire protection and guidance and modeling updates," FAA officials wrote.
After two Wet Dress Rehearsal (WDR) aborts, SpaceX opted to destack Ship 28 before removing Booster 10 from the Orbital Launch Mount (OLM). The Booster has since rolled back to the Production Site, while Ship 28 conducted standalone testing on Pad B, opening with a Spin Prime test on Monday.
A March launch of Flight 3 for Starship is still possible, pending the completion of full stack testing and approval from the FAA.
SpaceX attempted a full WDR on Feb. 14, loading liquid oxygen into Ship 28 before holding and detanking shortly into the process. Another attempt was made on Feb. 16, which included a small amount of propellant loading on the Booster, before once again detanking.
While the full WDR remains outstanding in the flow towards the upcoming launch, a few interesting observations were made during the attempts, with the most significant change is the Ship begins loading first rather than Booster.
It is unclear why the two WDRs were aborted, but the fact that Booster 10 was rolled back to the Mega Bay and placed on a work stand could mean that it is a vehicle issue and not a tank farm issue.
Regarding Ship 28, SpaceX has placed it on Suborbital Pad B, for more testing. Shortly after placing Ship 28 on Pad B, teams began to do work inside the methane tank while still hooked up to the crane.
While it’s unclear if Ship 28 has new engines or reinstalled engines, teams want to test the connections with at least a spin prime test and possibly a static fire.
Road closures for such testing are scheduled for Feb. 26, 27, and 28, from 8 am – 8 pm CST. With the opening window taken to conduct a Spin Prime test.
Even with the preparations for Flight 3 stealing much of the attention, the Army Corps of Engineers released a request from SpaceX to convert a small sliver of wetlands near Suborbital Pad B for the purpose of building a second orbital launch pad.
In the Public notice, it is stated that: “SpaceX reinitiated the permit application on 12 February 2024 with modified project plans requesting to fill a 0.16-acre wetland to construct a second orbital launchpad which will replace the current suborbital launch pad and test stand.”
This confirms that the second launch tower will be in the area near the suborbital site. Placing it there helps SpaceX minimize the environmental impact and will help get this pad constructed faster, as a lot of groundwork is already completed at the suborbital site.
Currently, there is a public comment period open until March 25, after which the Army Corps of Engineers will evaluate the proposal and decide whether or not a Public Hearing is required.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
Yes by all means destroy wetlands for Musk...I mean Mush. Damn. The money must flow.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
??
You can see the new possible second orbital launch site outlined in green. That tower next to it is (I think) the Pad B suborbital tower which will be upgraded.
![Image](https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/Render-of-Possible-Second-Pad-locatrion-with-new-land.jpg)
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Re: SPACE - random thread about space stuff
The Great Attractor. Defying (ultimately unsuccessful) the expansion of the universe.
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