Star Wars The Force Awakens SPOILER THREAD!!!!!!!

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 6:28 pm

My kids have declared they know everything they need to know about Star Wars from the LEGO movies.

Daehawk · Post by **Daehawk** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 6:30 pm

Zarathud wrote:My kids have declared they know everything they need to know about Star Wars from the LEGO movies.

Did you wave as you dropped them off at the group home?

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 7:05 pm

El Guapo wrote:
I will add that geeking out on Star Wars with my daughter is easily a top 3 experience for being a parent.

So wonderful. I've been doing it with my boys since they were 6 and 4.

The oldest (now 12) just started reading Dune, so I consider myself to have fully reproduced.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 8:22 pm

Daehawk wrote:
Zarathud wrote:My kids have declared they know everything they need to know about Star Wars from the LEGO movies.
Did you wave as you dropped them off at the group home?

They do know Star Wars lore, to the point of interrupting a discussion about whether they should watch Episode One in the machete order. Even taking my side by pointing out "everyone knows Darth Vader is Luke's father, duh." And it's partially my own damn fault for buying us a ton of LEGOs.

Plus, my kids are empathetic girls who run away at the first sign of violence or dramatic tension. Even in soap commercials.

JSHAW · Post by **JSHAW** » Tue Apr 12, 2016 6:28 pm

Original trilogy making another run in theaters.

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainmen ... -1.2598032

rshetts2 · Post by **rshetts2** » Tue Apr 12, 2016 6:42 pm

JSHAW wrote:Original trilogy making another run in theaters.

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainmen ... -1.2598032

Well thats disappointing. There are no showings anywhere near me. In fact they kinda said FU to the heart of the mid west as there are no showings in Michigan, Ohio, Indiana or Illinois.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Tue Apr 12, 2016 7:00 pm

It looks like the showings are are all at "event theaters" (places that usually do concerts and plays) rather than normal movie theaters. I'm surprised at the limited number of cities, though: just about a dozen.

Daehawk · Post by **Daehawk** » Thu May 19, 2016 3:01 pm

Looking more at Kylo's lightsaber Im wondering why he uses it or made it that way. I know most say either because he didn't know how or couldn't get a good crystal. If you think about it though neither seem likely.

1. He was trained by Luke F'n Skywalker. And at his age he should have already built his own lightsaber under Luke's tutelage.

2. He has access to the galaxy and could go get a crystal anywhere not to mention other lightsabers around to dismantle.

In the end the only conclusion for having a crappy saber is pure stupidity on his part. And from what I saw of him in the movie I can easily go with that line.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Thu May 19, 2016 3:13 pm

I see it as impatience (a trait he shares with Anakin). He thought he was a bad-ass and he didn't want to take the time to properly train and do things by the book.

If lightsabers were dining room tables, he'd be the guy who grabbed something cheap from IKEA then built it without looking at the instructions. Not because he was ignorant or didn't have access to better stuff, but because he's too impatient to do things correctly and thinks he knows everything.

McNutt · Post by **McNutt** » Thu May 19, 2016 4:28 pm

I don't know if any of this is covered in non-movie material. Why do we assume Luke is badass at everything? From what we saw of Luke's own training, it was pretty modest to say the least. Not sure why it's a given that he's a great teacher, especially considering that one of his pupils now destroys planets.

If you look at the way Kylo fights, it doesn't seem like he has much training. He angrily swings his lightsaber at lasers instead of just blocking/deflecting them. He gets outmatched by someone who has never fought with a lightsaber too. I'm guessing all the lightsaber training had yet to take place before Kylo dropped out.

Daehawk · Post by **Daehawk** » Thu May 19, 2016 4:48 pm

I agree with the impatience. That plus anger issues.

But he should have been trained in lightsabers a long time before now...unless he dropped out around age 2. I remember in the prequels the little kids were practicing with them and they looked all of 5.

I think Kylo's biggest trouble is his anger. though I also think that combines with impatience and stupidity. Him getting his but kicked by a total noob to it all says to me he is untalented and wreckless....and a pussy

I just dont like him as a bad guy. he comes across as a angry nerd who found a lightsaber on the floor. I hope he is more a badass by next movie.. I think he has the potential.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Thu May 19, 2016 4:51 pm

But someone made the excellent point upthread about the fact that he was fighting after being shot by the Bowcaster...so let's not say he was a pussy, especially after they made it a point to write into the script how hard that thing hits (no coincidence IMO).

McNutt · Post by **McNutt** » Thu May 19, 2016 5:08 pm

Daehawk wrote: But he should have been trained in lightsabers a long time before now...unless he dropped out around age 2. I remember in the prequels the little kids were practicing with them and they looked all of 5.

That's the way it was done in the past, but that type of training ended before Luke was even born. I'm sure Luke has been able to find sources on how the Jedi were trained. However, since he was only trained for a few days on Dagobah, he's got to be winging it when he decides to take on pupils.

But someone made the excellent point upthread about the fact that he was fighting after being shot by the Bowcaster...so let's not say he was a pussy, especially after they made it a point to write into the script how hard that thing hits (no coincidence IMO).

True. Kylo was wounded when he was fighting. That would explain his poor performance at the physical part of the fighting. His reasons for not just ending the fight with a nice choke or force grab (something he was shown to be pretty good at) has to be due to his lack of focus training.

Luckily for everybody a chasm opened up in between the two fighters <seriously???> allowing the fight to be saved for another day.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Thu May 19, 2016 5:27 pm

In addition to the "being badly injured by the Bowcaster" thing, there's a general vibe throughout the movie of Kylo having strong potential in the force, but at the same time being a pale imitation (and wannabe) of Vader.

Toe · Post by **Toe** » Thu May 19, 2016 5:28 pm

Darth by Darthwest

https://vimeo.com/166006200

msteelers · Post by **msteelers** » Thu May 19, 2016 5:55 pm

Kylo also wasn't trying to kill Rey, he offered to train her. He made pretty quick work of Finn, who was trained in combat.

rshetts2 · Post by **rshetts2** » Thu May 19, 2016 6:54 pm

msteelers wrote:Kylo also wasn't trying to kill Rey, he offered to train her. He made pretty quick work of Finn, who was trained in combat.

+1

Ive seen so many forum complaints about how an untrained Rey was able to take Ren down. I paid attention the last few times to the fight sequence and its clear that when facing Rey, Kylo is basically fighting defensively mostly just blocking Reys wild swings, with no offensive counter attacks. There are two reasons why Rey takes him down at the end of the fight. First she clearly opens herself up to the force ( she also opens herself up to her anger as well ) and we know she is unusually strong in the force, which leads to point 2. While she is bolstered with the Force, possibly with a touch of the darkside as well and Kylo is finally feeling the effects of the bowcaster hit. The combination of those two things allows Rey to take Ren down. There are definitely some flaws with the movie but I dont believe that final fight is one.

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Thu May 19, 2016 7:53 pm

rshetts2 wrote:
msteelers wrote:Kylo also wasn't trying to kill Rey, he offered to train her. He made pretty quick work of Finn, who was trained in combat.
+1

Ive seen so many forum complaints about how an untrained Rey was able to take Ren down. I paid attention the last few times to the fight sequence and its clear that when facing Rey, Kylo is basically fighting defensively mostly just blocking Reys wild swings, with no offensive counter attacks. There are two reasons why Rey takes him down at the end of the fight. First she clearly opens herself up to the force ( she also opens herself up to her anger as well ) and we know she is unusually strong in the force, which leads to point 2. While she is bolstered with the Force, possibly with a touch of the darkside as well and Kylo is finally feeling the effects of the bowcaster hit. The combination of those two things allows Rey to take Ren down. There are definitely some flaws with the movie but I dont believe that final fight is one.

Agreed. He was being overly cautious for a change as well. Could very well have been the first real life/death fight he's been in with someone that force sensitive in Rey. Hell, it may have been his first real light saber duel outside of training.

I suspect he will hit his prime badassness in the next one which is already being called darker. I predict another Rey/Ren duel in part two that goes unfinished as well. Then in part three Rey starts turning to darkside and Luke (who's always straddled that dark/light side) has to kill Ren to save her. Anyhow that's my two sentence prediction anyhow

TiLT · Post by **TiLT** » Fri May 20, 2016 9:02 am

I believe it is mentioned in the behind the scenes stuff on the blu-ray that Kylo Ren's lightsaber is unfinished, and that this is the reason for its unusual behavior. It might get finished in the next movie, or it might not.

JetFred · Post by **JetFred** » Mon May 23, 2016 3:25 am

Did someone already post this?

JetFred · Post by **JetFred** » Sat Jul 09, 2016 10:51 pm

I've been rewatching the Plinkett reviews of the prequel trilogy. I watched them a few years ago and thought that for all the stupid crap shoved into the reviews for humor (making him sound like a filthy drunk Strong Bad), they could not be topped for explaining why the prequels sucked as movies and as Star Wars.

This is the first time I've watched the reviews since The Force Awakes, and they make the prequels suck even more. However, they do make me admit that stuff in TFA like the rapid-fire destruction of fighters by Poe and the screwed up distances in space really were foreseeable problems. They could have been avoided. But I also accept that we will always excuse inconsistencies in the original trilogy because of the legendary status they hold in cinematic history, while not cutting anything new any slack. Such is the nature of handing the trilogy to Disney and hoping for the best. Disney may be the only entity on earth better at appealing to everybody as a business plan than Lucas himself was in the prequel days.

But I'd still rather have more Star Wars this way (waiting for Rogue One) than 1) with Lucas or 2) not at all. I just gotta keep my expectations in check. I think the biggest loss is not any amount of love for the franchise or for Disney (I'm a big dumb over-commercialized Disney fan), but for Lucas. I don't see any way after watching the Plinkett reviews for feeling like he had any idea what he was doing by the end other than making money. I still am fascinated by the serious poetry video. Lucas was not clueless, but that's about all I can say. That's too bad.

Bring on Rogue One, Mickey.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Thu Jul 14, 2016 8:15 am

Dancing stormtroopers at the Ep VIII wrap party.

Daehawk · Post by **Daehawk** » Thu Jul 14, 2016 8:22 am

Anyone getting a Poe / Finn romance vibe?

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:40 pm

So the Aftermath book is actually a trilogy:

Star Wars: Aftermath (September 2015) by Chuck Wendig
Star Wars: Aftermath: Life Debt (July 2016) by Chuck Wendig
Star Wars: Aftermath: Empire's End (February 2017) by Chuck Wendig

And by February, they mean next Tuesday.

Chrisoc13 · Post by **Chrisoc13** » Wed Feb 15, 2017 10:16 pm

I've heard mixed things on those books. Thoughts anyone who has read them? I generally don't like fan fiction type stuff (for instance tried reading rogue squadron and it just drive me crazy) so will these bug me too? I would like you read an actually well written good compelling star wars book

Malificent · Post by **Malificent** » Thu Feb 16, 2017 9:37 am

Chrisoc13 wrote:I've heard mixed things on those books. Thoughts anyone who has read them? I generally don't like fan fiction type stuff (for instance tried reading rogue squadron and it just drive me crazy) so will these bug me too? I would like you read an actually well written good compelling star wars book

I like Chuck Wendig a lot, but that said...

I haven't read his Star Wars books and his non-Star Wars stuff is about as far away in tone from what you'd want in a Star Wars book as you can get.

So all that to say, I have no idea but I would love someone to be the first to check these out and report back.

Hyena · Post by **Hyena** » Thu Feb 16, 2017 12:05 pm

rshetts2 wrote:
msteelers wrote:Kylo also wasn't trying to kill Rey, he offered to train her. He made pretty quick work of Finn, who was trained in combat.
+1

Ive seen so many forum complaints about how an untrained Rey was able to take Ren down. I paid attention the last few times to the fight sequence and its clear that when facing Rey, Kylo is basically fighting defensively mostly just blocking Reys wild swings, with no offensive counter attacks. There are two reasons why Rey takes him down at the end of the fight. First she clearly opens herself up to the force ( she also opens herself up to her anger as well ) and we know she is unusually strong in the force, which leads to point 2. While she is bolstered with the Force, possibly with a touch of the darkside as well and Kylo is finally feeling the effects of the bowcaster hit. The combination of those two things allows Rey to take Ren down. There are definitely some flaws with the movie but I dont believe that final fight is one.

I've had this conversation on here before (maybe even with you), and I disagree. He mentions training her in the Force, and she visibly calms down, then escapes the clinch. Yes, she goes on the offensive, but we've seen plenty of "light side" jedi's go on the offensive before when fighting a darkside opponent. Same thing when she is on the torture chair, both with Ren as she's struggling against him(You can see her face get calm, then she is able to overpower him) and when she mind-controls the storm trooper (she visibly calms down, gathers herself, and then firmly but calmly orders him and he complies). To me she is only accessing the force when she's calmed herself.

Now, some people say it's more apparent in the books that she opens herself up to the dark side, but I haven't read the books, so I will bow to that as cannon, but in the movie I just don't see her giving in to blind rage like we do Luke in RotJ and Ren...well, pretty much any time he touches his lightsaber.

rshetts2 · Post by **rshetts2** » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:51 pm

Its entirely possible you are correct. We really dont have the whole picture on Rey so either way could be possible. I see her using her anger to help fuel her because of how aggressively she beats Ren down at the end. She doesn't finesse him, she completely overpowers him. That doesn't mean I think she is going full on sith or anything. In fact, I am starting to believe that she is neither Jedi or Sith. I think that she is a creature of balance, open to both sides of the force but able to avoid the corruption of the dark side. There is precedence for this in the current canon.

Hyena · Post by **Hyena** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:05 pm

rshetts2 wrote:Its entirely possible you are correct. We really dont have the whole picture on Rey so either way could be possible. I see her using her anger to help fuel her because of how aggressively she beats Ren down at the end. She doesn't finesse him, she completely overpowers him. That doesn't mean I think she is going full on sith or anything. In fact, I am starting to believe that she is neither Jedi or Sith. I think that she is a creature of balance, open to both sides of the force but able to avoid the corruption of the dark side. There is precedence for this in the current canon.

Completely agree. I think she is going to fall under the category of "gray" jedi, neither light nor dark. I watched a video explaining a lot of behind the scenes stuff, including history of Lucas' original plan and how the planet Jedah, with the giant fallen statues in Rogue One, was the home of the religion, hence the temple with guardians that claimed to not be Jedi, but have a definite connection with the force. These "Jedi" (you know, people from the planet Jedah) were the balance to the sith and the light side. Complete guesswork and theories ahead:

Spoiler:

McNutt · Post by **McNutt** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:49 pm

Didn't Anakin bring balance to the force by killing all the Jedi so that the number of Jedi and Sith were even (Obi-Wan and Yoda vs. Darth Vader and Darth Sidious)? There have been Jedi for thousands of years and in that time I'm guessing they've nailed down that you can't try to walk the middle road. If you do you will eventually turn to the dark side.

Biyobi · Post by **Biyobi** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:50 pm

Hyena wrote:
Spoiler:
I think either her or Luke is going to be the titular "Last Jedi" in Episode 8. Luke is going to train her in the force, thus fulfilling the original prophecy of Anakin "bringing balance to the force" by fathering the trainer of the new generation of Gray Jedi.

That's a little far removed, isn't it?

Spoiler:

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:55 pm

Why are we spoilering speculation?

And why does "balance" mean that? Is there some problem with having too might light?

rshetts2 · Post by **rshetts2** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:39 pm

I dont believe "balance in the force" is meant to be strictly numerical.

Hyena · Post by **Hyena** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:51 pm

Biyobi wrote:
Hyena wrote:
Spoiler:
I think either her or Luke is going to be the titular "Last Jedi" in Episode 8. Luke is going to train her in the force, thus fulfilling the original prophecy of Anakin "bringing balance to the force" by fathering the trainer of the new generation of Gray Jedi.
That's a little far removed, isn't it?
Spoiler:
IMO, Anakin already directly brought balance to the Force. He helped cull the huge Jedi order down to Obi-Wan and Yoda, to balance out Vader and Palpatine.

Not only far removed, but lacking with any kind of sport whatsoever. It was just a thought I had it while watching the video that discussed the three different types of Jedi.

Hyena · Post by **Hyena** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:53 pm

rshetts2 wrote:I dont believe "balance in the force" is meant to be strictly numerical.

That was my take as well. I'm sure that the balance to the force thing would have had a much more negative vibe to the Jedi Council if it meant killing hundreds of Jedi across the Galaxy. But, like I said, I have nothing to back that up it was just a thought.

Hyena · Post by **Hyena** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:56 pm

Holman wrote:Why are we spoilering speculation?

And why does "balance" mean that? Is there some problem with having too might light?

If your post means what I think it means, there actually could be a problem with too many Jedi as we know them. One of the tenants of the Jedi is that there is zero passion. Who would want to live in a world with no passion? Yes, there would be peace, but no art, No Love, No anything that makes living worthwhile. That's why I think there needs to be a "balance" of so-called gray Jedi.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 9:00 pm

I always took "balance in the force" to mean not a balance between the Jedi and Sith but the removal or correction or redemption of the Sith to the light side. In other words, the Jedi are already balanced and the Sith are imbalanced.

After all, the Jedi are not fanatic warriors for good at all costs; they are detached and zen-like. Their values seem to be about peace and serenity, not an enforced moral order. They are negotiators, not crusaders.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 9:06 pm

Hyena wrote:
Holman wrote:Why are we spoilering speculation?

And why does "balance" mean that? Is there some problem with having too might light?
If your post means what I think it means, there actually could be a problem with too many Jedi as we know them. One of the tenants of the Jedi is that there is zero passion. Who would want to live in a world with no passion? Yes, there would be peace, but no art, No Love, No anything that makes living worthwhile. That's why I think there needs to be a "balance" of so-called gray Jedi.

But can't the Jedi reject passion in themselves without opposing it in others? After all, they don't seem actively interested in stamping out art or love in the galaxy.

The Jedi don't require everyone to be Jedi.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 9:15 pm

As always, though, I might be wrong here--I haven't delved into the surrounding EU/interview/etc material. Probably Lucas has already defined all this somewhere.

I base all my sense of Star Wars on the core films (treating the prequels as lesser because they're weak and seeing the animated stuff as kind of inconsistent).

Hyena · Post by **Hyena** » Fri Feb 17, 2017 9:58 pm

Holman wrote:As always, though, I might be wrong here--I haven't delved into the surrounding EU/interview/etc material. Probably Lucas has already defined all this somewhere.

I base all my sense of Star Wars on the core films (treating the prequels as lesser because they're weak and seeing the animated stuff as kind of inconsistent).

That's the great thing about this conversation, though...nobody knows, and we're all just making shit up as we go along!!