What are your next major purchases?

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Isgrimnur
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Isgrimnur »

Make sure you get warranties for parts AND labor.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zaxxon »

And perhaps get a heat pump to replace both, depending on local climate.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Skinypupy »

Zaxxon wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 7:55 pm And perhaps get a heat pump to replace both, depending on local climate.
If you’re considering a heat pump for your Utah home or building, you may want to think again. This is because climate plays a big role in the effectiveness of a heat pump – in colder temperatures, heat pumps simply aren’t as efficient despite their ability to pull warmth from seemingly cold air. Many models come with additional heat sources that kick in when the cold air isn’t providing enough, but this dramatically lowers efficiency.

Utah isn’t the coldest state in the union, but it’s also not a tropical paradise during winter. Heat pumps are liable to cost you far more than a basic furnace would, and they often lead to significant maintenance issues due to more wear and tear being placed on the pipe system. These systems absolutely may have benefits in certain places, but in this climate, we don’t recommend them.
Good to know though, as I’d never even heard of one until you mentioned it.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zaxxon »

It's definitely more expensive than a furnace. It may not be more expensive given that you're buying both. Newer models are good down to 0F, but I'm not sure on cost these days--ours was bought 5 years ago, and has a gas furnace second stage backstop since the heat pump is only efficient down to ~30F.

I guess what I'm saying is make sure the advice you're getting is current. Heat pump HVAC systems are a lot like EVs--the tech is improving rapidly.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Kraken »

Heat pumps are the future of HVAC, at least in the medium term. Mass. wants to phase out all oil and gas heat by 2030, although we're way behind pace to do that. It seems the gas companies have other ideas. Some towns have banned new gas hookups and there's still a legal brouhaha over those laws.

We had a heat pump in an apartment in upstate NY back in the late '80s, and it worked well enough except in extreme winter weather -- you know, when you need heat the most. Every time it crapped out we'd call the landlord who would fuss and curse and finally somehow get it working again. It ultimately turned out that it had been mounted too low to the ground and snow was burying the air intake. Whoops.

Anyway, there are tax credits for converting that make the cost competitive here. My gas boiler is 30 years old. If I had to replace it, I'd be tempted by a heat pump, except that we have radiant heat. I'm pretty sure heat pumps only do forced air so we'd need to replace our radiators with duct work.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Skinypupy »

Zaxxon wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 8:27 pm I guess what I'm saying is make sure the advice you're getting is current. Heat pump HVAC systems are a lot like EVs--the tech is improving rapidly.
For sure.

We got the first bid from the big local company that you see in every billboard and hear on every sports radio break. I about puked when I saw it. Got a couple family referrals, one coming tomorrow and one coming Friday. The guy coming Friday does all the HVAC work on my father-in-law’s commercial properties, as well as bunch of residential work for his neighbors. He kinda laughed when I told him about what the other company told me, and will come out and give me his opinion on what I need to do. Figure he’ll be pretty straight with me…lots of other work at risk if he’s not.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by YellowKing »

Update on the rowing machine. We got an Aviron, which is one of the big top 3 smart rowers along with the Hydrow and the Ergatta. I went with the Aviron because it has a wider variety of workout types, and the monthly sub was a good bit less than the Hydrow.

I'm really enjoying it so far. It has a bunch of rowing games, plenty of guided workouts, a handful of trainer-led workouts, and free scenic rows in various geographical locations. One thing I really love is that it has built-in Hulu, Netflix, Disney+ and (coming this week) Amazon Prime. When you want to just turn your mind off and row, it's great to just be able to watch "Is It Cake?" while burning calories. They're also adding in the ability to unlock workouts and other things with points you earn from completing sessions, which sounds cool.

One of my favorite features is "Power Plays" which are essentially games combined with guided workouts. So for instance, the underlying workout may be 5000 meters at various strokes per minute. But on-screen, you're driving a car on a track filled with various point lanes corresponding to your SPM. Go too slow or too fast, and you either lose points or get less points than hitting your sweet spot. It's a ton of fun and makes you forget how hard you're working.

The one aspect of the rower I've heard good things about but haven't explored yet is the community. You can join group workouts and add friends with other Aviron owners. It's a fairly new rower (debuted in 2018), so the community isn't huge at the moment. I haven't had much luck finding a populated group session from the rower, but supposedly they have a very active Discord where people schedule workouts.

Of course, the value of any piece of exercise equipment is not in all the fancy features, but whether or not you actually use it. My wife (who is by no means someone who exercises regularly) has been doing 30 minutes a night on it for the last 2 weeks. I've been doing a minimum half hour every night since we got it as well. Even the kids jump on it from time to time. I'm sure the novelty will wear off eventually, but neither treadmills nor gym memberships have inspired this kind of habitual workouts from the family so I'll take it.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zarathud »

$6,000 of car repair work after getting rear ended. My auto insurance is paying its first claim ever on me, but I’ll be without a car for a minimum 2 more weeks because we weren’t paying for the rental insurance too.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zenn7 »

Zenn7 wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 12:27 am About $700 for a new lofted bed w/ desk/drawers underneath for the kid. Wood and fairly heavy duty (supports 400lbs plus mattress - good as he's a full grown adult and no one in this house is anywhere near the skinny side). Old one was metal, though it held him (had it since late 2019, no issues), it is kinda of rickety and only had a table, no drawers.

Disassembled the old one tonight. Going to start assembling the new one tomorrow. Wonder if that will involve more cussing than the disassembly did.
For the record, it is involving MUCH MORE cussing than the disassembly did. Hoping to finish it Thursday night (only get about 2 hours/night to work on it and having lots of trouble and a few parts we had to take apart and turn around and instructions sometimes have issues, like telling me I should have 4 of 1 part I only have 2 of, but only need 2; or having 1 of something instructions to put it in 2 different places).
Think the biggest challenge is likely to be the barrel screws that the wholes aren't deep enough for for at least one of them. Guess I'm supposed to drill the hole a little deeper in this scenario, but I don't have a suitable/right size drill bit (just got a cordless drill with handful of bits, never drilled much, not a handy person).

To make it more fun, house is crowded, so we have to move the mattress out and put it back on the floor every night so kid can sleep (and all the crap he keeps on it). Wife and kid are both highly stressed out about the time it's taking and the mess/hassle. Too busy to take time off work to do this right now.
Really hate handy work projects of any sort.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Carpet_pissr »

Zarathud wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 11:19 pm $6,000 of car repair work after getting rear ended. My auto insurance is paying its first claim ever on me, but I’ll be without a car for a minimum 2 more weeks because we weren’t paying for the rental insurance too.
I’ll be shocked if you can get any kind of serious body repair work (that a legit insurance company will use) done these days anywhere CLOSE to 2 weeks.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by stimpy »

Carpet_pissr wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 7:57 am
Zarathud wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 11:19 pm $6,000 of car repair work after getting rear ended. My auto insurance is paying its first claim ever on me, but I’ll be without a car for a minimum 2 more weeks because we weren’t paying for the rental insurance too.
I’ll be shocked if you can get any kind of serious body repair work (that a legit insurance company will use) done these days anywhere CLOSE to 2 weeks.
If it's just body work, that might be doable.
Any type of mechanical parts that need to be ordered........not so much.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by LordMortis »

Carpet_pissr wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 7:57 am
Zarathud wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 11:19 pm $6,000 of car repair work after getting rear ended. My auto insurance is paying its first claim ever on me, but I’ll be without a car for a minimum 2 more weeks because we weren’t paying for the rental insurance too.
I’ll be shocked if you can get any kind of serious body repair work (that a legit insurance company will use) done these days anywhere CLOSE to 2 weeks.
My dad hit a deer last week and it some light damage. The only functional issue was it knocked out a turn signal. Fortunate for my dad, not so much for the deer. You have to drop the bumper or take apart the wheel well to get in to replace a turn signal on his Escape. No one can get that turn signal until the end of June for his car and replacing it costs around $200. Not the housing or assembly. The signal.

I'm fearing the day I have to replace my 2009 Focus even as gas approaches $5 a gallon. I can't drop a bumper or take apart a wheel well and the idea of paying for the labor to do so to replace turn signal is baffling to me.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zenn7 »

Zenn7 wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 12:08 am
Zenn7 wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 12:27 am About $700 for a new lofted bed w/ desk/drawers underneath for the kid. Wood and fairly heavy duty (supports 400lbs plus mattress - good as he's a full grown adult and no one in this house is anywhere near the skinny side). Old one was metal, though it held him (had it since late 2019, no issues), it is kinda of rickety and only had a table, no drawers.

Disassembled the old one tonight. Going to start assembling the new one tomorrow. Wonder if that will involve more cussing than the disassembly did.
For the record, it is involving MUCH MORE cussing than the disassembly did. Hoping to finish it Thursday night (only get about 2 hours/night to work on it and having lots of trouble and a few parts we had to take apart and turn around and instructions sometimes have issues, like telling me I should have 4 of 1 part I only have 2 of, but only need 2; or having 1 of something instructions to put it in 2 different places).
Think the biggest challenge is likely to be the barrel screws that the wholes aren't deep enough for for at least one of them. Guess I'm supposed to drill the hole a little deeper in this scenario, but I don't have a suitable/right size drill bit (just got a cordless drill with handful of bits, never drilled much, not a handy person).

To make it more fun, house is crowded, so we have to move the mattress out and put it back on the floor every night so kid can sleep (and all the crap he keeps on it). Wife and kid are both highly stressed out about the time it's taking and the mess/hassle. Too busy to take time off work to do this right now.
Really hate handy work projects of any sort.
Bed was put together (except drawers and a couple trim pieces).

Tested the ladder, first board, fine. Second board, split. Fortunately not all the way through so I was able to get off w/o any injury.
Now being very nervous about the bed, used my ladder, climbed up and leaned on the bed, putting hands spread out and pressing down, wife saw some of the slat boards crossing the bed bending where i was putting pressure.

Lay down on that? um... no thanks.

It is supposed to support 400 lbs + mattress. Maybe if you carefully distributed that 400 lbs, but not something I'd want to be on the bed while testing.

So, wife has put a return request in. Tomorrow, I start disassembling the bed. Guessing that will take 2 nights to fully complete. Then the jigsaw puzzle of packing them back into their original boxes. And then seeing how we ship this back (each box is nearly 100lbs).

Have to see if the desk that's been sitting outside in the rain is still solid/serviceable until he finds a suitable replacement for that.

Told kid NO MORE LOFT BEDS! Now looking at twin beds with under storage or just a high enough twin bed we can put maybe 18 gallon storage totes under or something.

If I was a handy guy, I'd build one. But I got a D- in shop class and am not handy. Only power tool I own is a cordless screwdriver/drill.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by gbasden »

stimpy wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 8:45 am
Carpet_pissr wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 7:57 am
Zarathud wrote: Tue May 17, 2022 11:19 pm $6,000 of car repair work after getting rear ended. My auto insurance is paying its first claim ever on me, but I’ll be without a car for a minimum 2 more weeks because we weren’t paying for the rental insurance too.
I’ll be shocked if you can get any kind of serious body repair work (that a legit insurance company will use) done these days anywhere CLOSE to 2 weeks.
If it's just body work, that might be doable.
Any type of mechanical parts that need to be ordered........not so much.
I had a minor parking lot fender bender where all happened was scratches to my bumper. Getting an appointment at the body shop was two weeks and they told me the soonest they could even get started was beginning of July.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Kraken »

New AC compressor and related thingamabobs for the Honda; $2,200 using remanufactured parts. That's a lot of money to put into an 11-year-old car, but this is also the worst time to try to buy a new car, which we aren't planning to do for a couple more years. It's only got 65k miles on it and should last us until then.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Blackhawk »

My kids - 18 and 20 - still sleep in the same bunk bed that they've had for a decade. It is some monstrosity that some relative cobbled together out of scraps. That said, it's made out of solid oak held together with steel bolts, and you could use it to park small cars on for an oil change.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Carpet_pissr »

Kraken wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:48 am New AC compressor and related thingamabobs for the Honda; $2,200 using remanufactured parts. That's a lot of money to put into an 11-year-old car, but this is also the worst time to try to buy a new car, which we aren't planning to do for a couple more years. It's only got 65k miles on it and should last us until then.
Unless budget was of no concern, in the current market I would not even blink at paying that amount to fix a car with 65K on it, especially considering it’s a Honda. The alternatives are…not pretty.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Octavious »

Ya that's a no brainer in this market. If you have had it for 11 years and only have 60k miles it should last until maybe the world gets a bit more normal. We hope. ;)
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Isgrimnur »

Or it ends.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Kraken »

Carpet_pissr wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 12:20 pm
Kraken wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:48 am New AC compressor and related thingamabobs for the Honda; $2,200 using remanufactured parts. That's a lot of money to put into an 11-year-old car, but this is also the worst time to try to buy a new car, which we aren't planning to do for a couple more years. It's only got 65k miles on it and should last us until then.
Unless budget was of no concern, in the current market I would not even blink at paying that amount to fix a car with 65K on it, especially considering it’s a Honda. The alternatives are…not pretty.
The plan is to replace it just before we retire, ideally with an EV. My Miata will be paid off in six months and then I can redirect that car payment into savings. By the time we're ready to buy we'll have a healthy down payment, and there will be more EVs on the market to choose from, and one hopes that the marketplace will normalize by then. If my arthritis keeps getting worse I might sell the Miata at that time, and we'd be a one-car couple with a nice new car and no payments. But I would not enjoy sharing a car with Wife, whose beat-up Honda is always filthy and full of junk.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by coopasonic »

Zenn7 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 12:26 am Told kid NO MORE LOFT BEDS! Now looking at twin beds with under storage or just a high enough twin bed we can put maybe 18 gallon storage totes under or something.
We bought this for my son maybe 18 months ago and it has been great. I've been using it as my work from home desk for those same 18 months.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zenn7 »

coopasonic wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 5:38 pm
Zenn7 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 12:26 am Told kid NO MORE LOFT BEDS! Now looking at twin beds with under storage or just a high enough twin bed we can put maybe 18 gallon storage totes under or something.
We bought this for my son maybe 18 months ago and it has been great. I've been using it as my work from home desk for those same 18 months.
Would you trust it to support you? Kid's full grown adult (22). Guess they're going with a day bed and buy bins for under bed storage. Taking wife's desk back (it was his before) and then buy some new desk for wife.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zenn7 »

Zenn7 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 12:26 am
Zenn7 wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 12:08 am
Zenn7 wrote: Sun May 15, 2022 12:27 am About $700 for a new lofted bed w/ desk/drawers underneath for the kid. Wood and fairly heavy duty (supports 400lbs plus mattress - good as he's a full grown adult and no one in this house is anywhere near the skinny side). Old one was metal, though it held him (had it since late 2019, no issues), it is kinda of rickety and only had a table, no drawers.

Disassembled the old one tonight. Going to start assembling the new one tomorrow. Wonder if that will involve more cussing than the disassembly did.
For the record, it is involving MUCH MORE cussing than the disassembly did. Hoping to finish it Thursday night (only get about 2 hours/night to work on it and having lots of trouble and a few parts we had to take apart and turn around and instructions sometimes have issues, like telling me I should have 4 of 1 part I only have 2 of, but only need 2; or having 1 of something instructions to put it in 2 different places).
Think the biggest challenge is likely to be the barrel screws that the wholes aren't deep enough for for at least one of them. Guess I'm supposed to drill the hole a little deeper in this scenario, but I don't have a suitable/right size drill bit (just got a cordless drill with handful of bits, never drilled much, not a handy person).

To make it more fun, house is crowded, so we have to move the mattress out and put it back on the floor every night so kid can sleep (and all the crap he keeps on it). Wife and kid are both highly stressed out about the time it's taking and the mess/hassle. Too busy to take time off work to do this right now.
Really hate handy work projects of any sort.
Bed was put together (except drawers and a couple trim pieces).

Tested the ladder, first board, fine. Second board, split. Fortunately not all the way through so I was able to get off w/o any injury.
Now being very nervous about the bed, used my ladder, climbed up and leaned on the bed, putting hands spread out and pressing down, wife saw some of the slat boards crossing the bed bending where i was putting pressure.

Lay down on that? um... no thanks.

It is supposed to support 400 lbs + mattress. Maybe if you carefully distributed that 400 lbs, but not something I'd want to be on the bed while testing.

So, wife has put a return request in. Tomorrow, I start disassembling the bed. Guessing that will take 2 nights to fully complete. Then the jigsaw puzzle of packing them back into their original boxes. And then seeing how we ship this back (each box is nearly 100lbs).

Have to see if the desk that's been sitting outside in the rain is still solid/serviceable until he finds a suitable replacement for that.

Told kid NO MORE LOFT BEDS! Now looking at twin beds with under storage or just a high enough twin bed we can put maybe 18 gallon storage totes under or something.

If I was a handy guy, I'd build one. But I got a D- in shop class and am not handy. Only power tool I own is a cordless screwdriver/drill.
Bed is disassembled. Taking tomorrow night and Saturday off (tomorrow night cause we really need a break, this has been extremely stressful on all 3 of us; Saturday is D&D w/ friends from noon til probably 7-9pm). Sunday is jigsaw puzzle/repacking. It has to be returned in the original boxes (it said that ont he original boxes - do not use a knife or you will not be able to return it).

Assuming we can return it. Wife sent one request, they asked for more details. We're waiting for more feedback on that part.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by coopasonic »

Zenn7 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 11:08 pm
coopasonic wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 5:38 pm
Zenn7 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 12:26 am Told kid NO MORE LOFT BEDS! Now looking at twin beds with under storage or just a high enough twin bed we can put maybe 18 gallon storage totes under or something.
We bought this for my son maybe 18 months ago and it has been great. I've been using it as my work from home desk for those same 18 months.
Would you trust it to support you? Kid's full grown adult (22). Guess they're going with a day bed and buy bins for under bed storage. Taking wife's desk back (it was his before) and then buy some new desk for wife.
We've had close to 400 pounds (two {small-ish} adults and a middle schooler) on there with a mattress and had no concerns.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zenn7 »

coopasonic wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 8:42 am
Zenn7 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 11:08 pm
coopasonic wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 5:38 pm
Zenn7 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 12:26 am Told kid NO MORE LOFT BEDS! Now looking at twin beds with under storage or just a high enough twin bed we can put maybe 18 gallon storage totes under or something.
We bought this for my son maybe 18 months ago and it has been great. I've been using it as my work from home desk for those same 18 months.
Would you trust it to support you? Kid's full grown adult (22). Guess they're going with a day bed and buy bins for under bed storage. Taking wife's desk back (it was his before) and then buy some new desk for wife.
We've had close to 400 pounds (two {small-ish} adults and a middle schooler) on there with a mattress and had no concerns.
Cool. Should have checked here first I guess. Now we've sworn off the things (too stressful/too much pain putting them together) and going for a simpler solution (relatively, moving wife's desk and getting a new one is a lot of extra work). Kid's looking at a used bed frame on Facebook Marketplace, day bed. Hoping that will be fairly easy to put together.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Skinypupy »

Turns out, the "REPLACE EVERYTHING" and "if you start your furnace, your house will explode" sales pitch I got from the HVAC company was total bullshit.

Had another guy come check it yesterday, and he told me there was absolutely nothing wrong at all with the furnace. Needed some tuneup work, $200 max. Said he wouldn't even sell me a replacement because there was no way I actually needed one. The AC could probably use a replacement, simply because the EPA has discontinued the type of refrigerant it uses, so it will become harder and more expensive to get. But he said if it's working ok, I'm fine to just leave it another year...it'll just be a little less efficient.

I asked him what he'd charge to replace them both, if they were actually busted and needed it. He said $8K at the absolute max. The first company quoted me nearly $13K and claimed that was a huge discount. In talking with my mom last night, I found out that they had done the same "everything needs replaced, your house will burn down if you don't" tactics on her a couple years ago as well. One time is a sketchy sales guy, multiple times is just a shitty business.

I'm fortunate this happened at a time when it wasn't urgent (i.e. middle of summer or middle of winter) so I can be patient and get multiple bids. I'm sure their shtick works well on folks who need something done immediately.

Gods, I hate working with contractors.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zaxxon »

That sucks, but at least you have a reprieve!
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Isgrimnur »

"You need to do this immediately!" Is met with a response of "Get out of my house."
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by malchior »

Isgrimnur wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:21 pm "You need to do this immediately!" Is met with a response of "Get out of my house."
Yep. Anyone expressing any urgency is unkindly booted the heck out. Any hint of a high pressure sales tactics really ticks me off.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Octavious »

malchior wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:46 pm
Isgrimnur wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:21 pm "You need to do this immediately!" Is met with a response of "Get out of my house."
Yep. Anyone expressing any urgency is unkindly booted the heck out. Any hint of a high pressure sales tactics really ticks me off.
Once you realize that you always have the power in those kind of situations it makes life so much easier. Car dealerships are a great example. Last car I bought I literally just left as they wouldn't meet my price despite the you have to do it now nonsense. Days later they called me and gave me the exact price I wanted. (Would not work right now. ;))
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TheMix
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by TheMix »

malchior wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:46 pm
Isgrimnur wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:21 pm "You need to do this immediately!" Is met with a response of "Get out of my house."
Yep. Anyone expressing any urgency is unkindly booted the heck out. Any hint of a high pressure sales tactics really ticks me off.
:text-+1:

Though sometimes I will still try and maintain some semblance of politeness. But the pushier they get, the more rude I get.

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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by stimpy »

Octavious wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:53 pm
malchior wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:46 pm
Isgrimnur wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:21 pm "You need to do this immediately!" Is met with a response of "Get out of my house."
Yep. Anyone expressing any urgency is unkindly booted the heck out. Any hint of a high pressure sales tactics really ticks me off.
Once you realize that you always have the power in those kind of situations it makes life so much easier. Car dealerships are a great example. Last car I bought I literally just left as they wouldn't meet my price despite the you have to do it now nonsense. Days later they called me and gave me the exact price I wanted. (Would not work right now. ;))
You'd be surprised.
I think things are cooling off as far as new cars being so scarce.
The couple of places I went to certainly did call me in the following days after I walked out and were willing to adjust the deal.
Too bad once I leave, that's it.
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malchior
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by malchior »

TheMix wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 3:06 pm
malchior wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:46 pm
Isgrimnur wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 1:21 pm "You need to do this immediately!" Is met with a response of "Get out of my house."
Yep. Anyone expressing any urgency is unkindly booted the heck out. Any hint of a high pressure sales tactics really ticks me off.
:text-+1:

Though sometimes I will still try and maintain some semblance of politeness. But the pushier they get, the more rude I get.
I don't give a damn anymore. Especially when they get pushy/rude. I had a ridiculous experience a few weeks ago when I was shopping solar systems. I had provided all the vendors with the same info and I sent email when setting up the calls that what I want to really know are - what components they'll be using, estimated power production, cost, financing model, and time frame to complete project. Pretty clean ask IMO.

The first call involved a company with fairly good ratings. I told the woman up front that I was going to be getting multiple quotes, she was the first, and I wasn't making a decision on the call. She tried the stupid sales Jedi mind trick - 'I will change your mind'. I said she wouldn't and please don't try/don't play games/etc. She kept trying to pressure me to sign a contract on the call. I reminded her I told her at the beginning that it wasn't happening. In any case, she kept trying to push me down her script into financing pre-q and all that. I had seen the price and I had asked and she had answered what components they used. Like almost everyone I talked to they were pushing Enphase IQ8+ which is what I wanted anyway.

She kept pushing and eventually I just quit the Zoom call. She tried to call me on my phone, she emailed me, etc. I replied back saying I told her no games and stop communicating with me. I got the price and would get back to them if I wanted to pursue it. (Fat chance) Shortly thereafter her manager called and left me a message asking me to speak with him to 'work it out'. Flat out ignored. No spoiler needed but they were the highest system price by almost 30%. They were pitching a 20KW system to me for $85K. :o

The main metric for comparing builds is $/W. In their case, it was ~$4.21/W

The others quoted me a 20KW for $57995 ($2.87) and a 17KW for $52995 ($3.11). These were all Enphase systems. There was a SolarEdge system that came in around $3.25/W. They are well known to be slightly more expensive and usually have one contractor territories. They try to position themselves as a premium product but it's just a shitty for the customer exclusivity model. :Shrug:

I ended up going with the $2.87 bid since they had good ratings, and I knew someone who used them. When they did the physical survey they had to reduce it to 17KW and reduced the price in line with the $/W. Fuck the first group. They called me for like a week non-stop. I don't get it.

Edit: One more note on the oddness of the first project/push sales person that was part of my go-the-fuck-away attitude. She also was weirdly dismissive of my comments about the condition of my property. She brought up a aerial picture of my property and they had marked trees that would have to be removed (they'd do it as part of the project).

I said two of those trees are iffy (the ones I mentioned earlier in the thread). But the other ones didn't make sense because my property is sloped down in tiers from front to back. The trees they wanted to cut are nowhere near the house or the roofline or in any way in the path of the sun as relates to the roof. Zero chance.

"Our models are very accurate". My response, "One of those trees is 6 feet tall and because of the house slope is 6 feet below the 1st floor...so not very accurate". "Well we will determine that when we visit". In any case, I didn't figure it out at the time but I figure they factor that tree cutting into the price of the system even when it is completely unnecessary. Sort of like upselling through ... crafty mechanisms where they assume people don't know better.
Last edited by malchior on Fri May 20, 2022 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Skinypupy »

As a sales guy for the past 20+ years, I'm always fascinated (and horrified) by tactics like this. I mean, it must work on someone or they wouldn't keep doing it, right? I've never been pushy like that with my clients, perhaps to the detriment of my commission checks.

I've become increasingly frustrated as my company is starting to lean that way in their sales training. The big push this year was "ask for the sale" and "never, ever, ever accept no". They had all sorts of statistics that the best salespeople contact warm leads 9 times in the first week, or some nonsense like that. If I have to pester someone into buying my product, then I'm doing a shitty job in the first place. My job is to build a trusted relationship, demonstrate that my product has value and meets their needs, and ensure I'm connected to the right decision-maker. If those are in place, then closing the sale simply becomes a natural part of the dialog. And if we don't meet the need, I'm never going to try and force it. That has only ever led to disastrous projects, in my experience.

I probably have more tolerance than others for salespeople, as I know how difficult a job it can be. I do admit that I get a little nervous when it's something that I know literally nothing about (like a furnace), doubly so when it's time sensitive (like when we had to replace our water heater). Thankfully, neither was the case here and I could pretty easily tell the guy to take a hike. To their credit, they haven't called or followed up at all on the estimate. My guess is that he knew it was dead in the water.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by malchior »

Skinypupy wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 3:59 pm As a sales guy for the past 20+ years, I'm always fascinated (and horrified) by tactics like this. I mean, it must work on someone or they wouldn't keep doing it, right? I've never been pushy like that with my clients, perhaps to the detriment of my commission checks.
I knew a lot about solar going in. So I had a pretty good idea what I wanted to know. Plus I'm pretty low bullshit when I'm personally selling/delivering work and I demand the same.
I probably have more tolerance than others for salespeople, as I know how difficult a job it can be. I do admit that I get a little nervous when it's something that I know literally nothing about (like a furnace), doubly so when it's time sensitive (like when we had to replace our water heater). Thankfully, neither was the case here and I could pretty easily tell the guy to take a hike. To their credit, they haven't called or followed up at all on the estimate. My guess is that he knew it was dead in the water.
That one firm has what I'd only call a high pressure, slick presentation methodology. They pretty much from the jump walk you from introduction through to signing the contract and financing in their call. It probably works pretty well on most folks considering they do have high ratings. I'm guessing most folks aren't shopping around and I think a lot of folks don't understand the financing.

The financing in NJ is relatively complex - as it is in many states with incentive programs. It involves federal tax credits, SRECs (tradeable energy credits for every 1KW you generate using solar), and long-term financing. They make a lot of (reasonable) assumptions that are still purely SWAGs in the 25-year frames they are modeling. In other words, they can get away with a lot and make people feel like it is a no brainer deal. I just don't get why they'd keep chasing the guy who is clearly wise to the scheme. :)
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zaxxon »

Damn, 17 kW. Jealous.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by stimpy »

When I finally decided who I was going to buy my new a/c and furnace from, the deal included first year of their maintenance program for free ($299 value). It was quoted as twice a year that they'd come out. Didnt decide on it right away. Guy said I had time. After the install, I read the fine print (I know.....).
It basically says that in order for their warranty to be honored, you had to have them and only them do the yearly maintenance.
$299 to change the humidifier filter, clean dryer duct and both units twice a year. Seemed kinda steep.

I called them to schedule the first service call under the free first year.
She says "oh, that's only if you sign up for our annual maintenance program at the time of install, which you didnt do".
I said I was never informed of that and nowhere on the paper work does it say that.

She says 'we can sign you up now, so the first year will be free and then it's $299 per year after.
I said fine.
She sends the paper work.
It now says $299 ONCE a year, not twice.

I think $299 to do yearly service is crazy, but honestly I have no baseline to compare to except the random ads I see here and there for $89 maintenance service.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by malchior »

Zaxxon wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 4:15 pm Damn, 17 kW. Jealous.
48x360W all microinverters. The Iq8+ system is very slick. I can upgrade into batteries or pure partial backup with no batteries via self-balancing microgrid with only a slight modification. The only reason why I didn't go with batteries is that the Enphase batteries are insanely overpriced.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Formix »

Now you have me wondering what inverters I have. I know they're Enphase, since I liked them so much I bought their stock, but the system is ~2 years old.
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Re: What are your next major purchases?

Post by Zenn7 »

Zenn7 wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 8:53 am
coopasonic wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 8:42 am
Zenn7 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 11:08 pm
coopasonic wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 5:38 pm
Zenn7 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 12:26 am Told kid NO MORE LOFT BEDS! Now looking at twin beds with under storage or just a high enough twin bed we can put maybe 18 gallon storage totes under or something.
We bought this for my son maybe 18 months ago and it has been great. I've been using it as my work from home desk for those same 18 months.
Would you trust it to support you? Kid's full grown adult (22). Guess they're going with a day bed and buy bins for under bed storage. Taking wife's desk back (it was his before) and then buy some new desk for wife.
We've had close to 400 pounds (two {small-ish} adults and a middle schooler) on there with a mattress and had no concerns.
Cool. Should have checked here first I guess. Now we've sworn off the things (too stressful/too much pain putting them together) and going for a simpler solution (relatively, moving wife's desk and getting a new one is a lot of extra work). Kid's looking at a used bed frame on Facebook Marketplace, day bed. Hoping that will be fairly easy to put together.
Got the next email. In case this could somehow get tracked by any party involved, I won't go into detail, but they suggested an unexpected strategy for a refund that avoids having to return it.
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