The Former Trump Presidency Thread

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 6:57 am

Heard Trump is to lay a wreath at Andrew Jackson's tomb.

That should be enough dead cat for a week or two.

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 8:50 am

Rip wrote:So that whole "Trump is hiding that he didn't pay any taxes" scandal just fizzled right the hell out.

You know that's not the only reason why people want Trump to release his full tax returns, right?

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 8:54 am

pr0ner wrote:
Rip wrote:So that whole "Trump is hiding that he didn't pay any taxes" scandal just fizzled right the hell out.
You know that's not the only reason why people want Trump to release his full tax returns, right?

Oh, I know.

They are all just praying for one more straw to grasp at.

You know, before Trump starts throwing people into ovens and such....

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:23 am

Another day another crazy, bizarre action - all of a sudden the State Department only has space on their plane for "one reporter" due to "space and budget" constraints. Breaking with tradition that has been the case since Henry Kissinger. And that one reporter happens to be from a a conservative outfit that no one has ever heard from. We are becoming a banana republic in front of our eyes. This administration is mendacious. They want to operate in the dark. Be concerned.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:29 am

Rip wrote:
You know, before Trump starts throwing people into ovens and such....

Come on, you know better than that.

He would only do that if the Trump family entered the oven business.

malchior wrote:Another day another crazy, bizarre action - all of a sudden the State Department only has space on their plane for "one reporter" due to "space and budget" constraints. Breaking with tradition that has been the case since Henry Kissinger. And that one reporter happens to be from a a conservative outfit that no one has ever heard from.

Control the message. Are we sure it's not Kim Jong Donald?

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:39 am

I don't see how that controls the message. Is it really that much of a hurdle for them to pay their own damn way and fly commercial? Crappy news media companies make a fortune anyway, silly that the government should be shuttling them around.

Freedom of the press doesn't mean they should get everything for free.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:46 am

Rip wrote:I don't see how that controls the message. Is it really that much of a hurdle for them to pay their own damn way and fly commercial? Crappy news media companies make a fortune anyway, silly that the government should be shuttling them around.

Freedom of the press doesn't mean they should get everything for free.

Please. This is about access to the Secretary not the travel arrangements. But I suspect you know that.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:48 am

Rip wrote:I don't see how that controls the message.

Of course you don't.

Rip wrote:
Freedom of the press doesn't mean they should get everything for free.

You got nothin' to say in defense of Kim Jong Trump's actions other than to imply this is about journalists trying to mooch off the president?

Even for you, that's stretching.

News: Trump just forbid CNN, MSNBC and CBS from entering the White House!

Rip: Hey, he never promised those journalists shelter from the elements!

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:52 am

Every time they say "budget" all I can hear is Mar a Lago.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:53 am

LordMortis wrote:Every time they say "budget" all I can hear is Mar a Lago.

Don't worry, it will simply be called the White House soon enough.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:55 am

Kim Jong-un
Kim Jong-Trump
Kim Don Trump
King Don Trump

Only I don't think of North Korea as a puppet, so this doesn't hold.

gilraen · Post by **gilraen** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:56 am

Rip wrote:I don't see how that controls the message. Is it really that much of a hurdle for them to pay their own damn way and fly commercial? Crappy news media companies make a fortune anyway, silly that the government should be shuttling them around.

Freedom of the press doesn't mean they should get everything for free.

You know that news outlets reimburse the government if their reporters fly with the U.S. officials, right?

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:56 am

hepcat wrote:
LordMortis wrote:Every time they say "budget" all I can hear is Mar a Lago.
Don't worry, it will simply be called the White House soon enough.

I don't doubt it will be called White House South soon enough.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:02 am

gilraen wrote:
Rip wrote:I don't see how that controls the message. Is it really that much of a hurdle for them to pay their own damn way and fly commercial? Crappy news media companies make a fortune anyway, silly that the government should be shuttling them around.

Freedom of the press doesn't mean they should get everything for free.
You know that news outlets reimburse the government if their reporters fly with the U.S. officials, right?

Rip: Well...uh...they get free airline snacks! That we pay for with our taxes!

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:02 am

LordMortis wrote:
hepcat wrote:
LordMortis wrote:Every time they say "budget" all I can hear is Mar a Lago.
Don't worry, it will simply be called the White House soon enough.
I don't doubt it will be called White House South soon enough.

"The Florida Dacha" will do fine.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:16 am

Holman wrote:
LordMortis wrote:
hepcat wrote:
LordMortis wrote:Every time they say "budget" all I can hear is Mar a Lago.
Don't worry, it will simply be called the White House soon enough.
I don't doubt it will be called White House South soon enough.
"The Florida Dacha" will do fine.

Floridacha

gilraen · Post by **gilraen** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:29 am

Kraken wrote:
Alefroth wrote:Wouldn't surprise me if the Trump team sent the returns, knowing the media would eat it up and they could be portrayed as the enemy he needs them to be.
I'd guess that 2005 paints Trump in a particularly favorable light ("see? He actually paid taxes!"), and they hope that "leaking" that will deflate the clamor for more scandalous material.

News outlets - in this case, CNN - are definitely on board with that possibility.

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:30 am

There's a lot to be said for being right next to government officials on a flight as a press member. You've got a captive audience in a relatively relaxed environment and can get some interesting info out of it. Imagine, too, that if the shit hit the fan and the best we've got on the plane with an administration official is "Fake Conspiracy Newsletter" out of Iowa representing press and asking the 'hard questions'...

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:41 am

gilraen wrote:
Rip wrote:Freedom of the press doesn't mean they should get everything for free.
You know that news outlets reimburse the government if their reporters fly with the U.S. officials, right?

Ignorance has NEVER stopped Rip from posting.

Now if only Rip's newfound fiscal conservatism would stick around, but Rip cares nothing about consistency either.

Rip has been programmed to care only about imaginary problems where someone is getting something he isn't. Sad.

TheMix · Post by **TheMix** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:09 am

Zarathud wrote: Willful/intentional ignorance has NEVER stopped Rip from posting.

Updated that for you. You probably assumed it was understood, but I wanted to make sure it was noted explicitly.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:17 am

malchior wrote:
Rip wrote:I don't see how that controls the message. Is it really that much of a hurdle for them to pay their own damn way and fly commercial? Crappy news media companies make a fortune anyway, silly that the government should be shuttling them around.

Freedom of the press doesn't mean they should get everything for free.
Please. This is about access to the Secretary not the travel arrangements. But I suspect you know that.

No one is stopping them from accessing him.

Tillerson’s aides emphasized that they have made arrangements to permit American reporters, who travel on their own or are based abroad, to cover his stops in each capital. And they said he will participate in his first news conference during a joint appearance with Japanese Foreign Minister Fumio Kishida in Tokyo on Thursday.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... story.html

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:40 am

Rip wrote:
No one is stopping them from accessing him.

White House Bars CNN, NYT, LAT, Politico From Briefing

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 1:04 pm

hepcat wrote:
Rip wrote:
No one is stopping them from accessing him.
White House Bars CNN, NYT, LAT, Politico From Briefing

The irony is that he finds an article that literally speaks against his argument but somehow cherry picks a part to suit his bullshit argument. He masterfully blurs the line where you can't distinguish the trolling from the lack of reading comprehension and sound judgement.

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 1:58 pm

I just heard that Trump is in town today. Would have been tempted to take the day to go see the crowd. Try and talk to some of them and see why the hell they care about this dude and not about what he is doing to them.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:07 pm

You can get an idea of what that would be like by simply turning your chair to face the wall and addressing that with those same questions.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:08 pm

hepcat wrote:You can get an idea of what that would be like by simply turning your chair to face the wall and beating your head against it.

FTFY

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:08 pm

gilraen wrote:
Kraken wrote:
Alefroth wrote:Wouldn't surprise me if the Trump team sent the returns, knowing the media would eat it up and they could be portrayed as the enemy he needs them to be.
I'd guess that 2005 paints Trump in a particularly favorable light ("see? He actually paid taxes!"), and they hope that "leaking" that will deflate the clamor for more scandalous material.
News outlets - in this case, CNN - are definitely on board with that possibility.

Yeah, the Washington Post has an article pondering that as well. Evidently the person that Maddow had on the show also noted that possibility. The fact that the return at issue is stamped "CLIENT COPY" indicates at a minimum that the leak didn't come from the IRS. So it's plausible, though there's clear evidence beyond that. Well, there's also Trump's people being prepared and releasing stuff on this before the show aired, I suppose.

Kind of funny how much shit Maddow seems to be taking about it today. Two hours in advance she tweeted out what she had (Trump's 1040 from 2005), so it's not like she dramatically overhyped this really. People seem to be mad at her because this makes Trump look (relatively) good, and because there's no bombshell in there like everyone wanted there to be. But this is still definitely newsworthy - was she supposed to not report on this?

Enough · Post by **Enough** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:09 pm

malchior wrote:
hepcat wrote:
Rip wrote:
No one is stopping them from accessing him.
White House Bars CNN, NYT, LAT, Politico From Briefing

The irony is that he finds an article that literally speaks against his argument but somehow cherry picks a part to suit his bullshit argument. He masterfully blurs the line where you can't distinguish the trolling from the lack of reading comprehension and sound judgement.

I felt like Rip at least contemplated a turn towards reality-based thinking when he said he could do without the sideshow prior to the election. Unfortunately, it seems that pivot was aborted and Rip is now ALL ABOUT the sideshow. One of my dearest friends is a hardcore conservative across the board but seems to have no difficulty in parsing Trump as completely antithetical to his beliefs (though he isn't complaining about another SC justice lol). Given the great kindness and thoughtfulness Rip has shown on these forums over the years (especially outside of RP heh) I really had thought he too would come around to realize this is some "bad hombre" stuff but I guess it's more about the team sports model of political allegiances. I will say I view my friend as far more of a true conservative than all the folks running around praising Trump to the heavens.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:25 pm

El Guapo wrote: Yeah, the Washington Post has an article pondering that as well. Evidently the person that Maddow had on the show also noted that possibility.

Two hours in advance she tweeted out what she had (Trump's 1040 from 2005), so it's not like she dramatically overhyped this really.

The guy on the show was the guy who received the tax info. His interview on NPR today made him sounds as if he suspects the forms came from Trump.

As for Maddow, the Tweet I saw just said something like "We have Trump's tax returns. Airing at 9 EST", without any details of what year or how much they had. That seemed intentionally ambiguous to get people hyped. I don't think nearly as many people would have tuned in if that tweet said "We have two pages of Trump's 2005 tax returns"....

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:26 pm

Enough wrote:
I felt like Rip at least contemplated a turn towards reality-based thinking when he said he could do without the sideshow prior to the election.

I'm just surprised he hasn't shut OO down. Obviously it's a site full of them damn liberals!

coopasonic · Post by **coopasonic** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:27 pm

we provide him endless entertainment

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:30 pm

El Guapo wrote: Kind of funny how much shit Maddow seems to be taking about it today. Two hours in advance she tweeted out what she had (Trump's 1040 from 2005), so it's not like she dramatically overhyped this really.

She tweeted these:

The first was ambiguous and clearly meant to drive views. It set off a frenzy on Twitter. The second tweet was 30 minutes before the show and they had a countdown going like there was some big reveal. Then she spent twenty minutes speculating before cutting to commercial for the big nothing reveal. It was cynical overhyping to drive ratings and IMO she deserves some but not all of scorn. I think it hurt her reputation quite a bit in her peer's eyes.

People seem to be mad at her because this makes Trump look (relatively) good, and because there's no bombshell in there like everyone wanted there to be. But this is still definitely newsworthy - was she supposed to not report on this?

Fair. It is newsworthy but not in the way she delivered it which gave Trump media bias air cover.

Post by **ImLawBoy** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:30 pm

El Guapo wrote:Kind of funny how much shit Maddow seems to be taking about it today. Two hours in advance she tweeted out what she had (Trump's 1040 from 2005), so it's not like she dramatically overhyped this really. People seem to be mad at her because this makes Trump look (relatively) good, and because there's no bombshell in there like everyone wanted there to be. But this is still definitely newsworthy - was she supposed to not report on this?

A lot of the shit I'm seeing is more focused on the actual show itself than on the promotion. She apparently had a very lengthy intro then a commercial break before providing any details about 20 minutes into the show. By that time, others had already leaked the info and determined that there really wasn't much there.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:40 pm

ImLawBoy wrote:
El Guapo wrote:Kind of funny how much shit Maddow seems to be taking about it today. Two hours in advance she tweeted out what she had (Trump's 1040 from 2005), so it's not like she dramatically overhyped this really. People seem to be mad at her because this makes Trump look (relatively) good, and because there's no bombshell in there like everyone wanted there to be. But this is still definitely newsworthy - was she supposed to not report on this?
A lot of the shit I'm seeing is more focused on the actual show itself than on the promotion. She apparently had a very lengthy intro then a commercial break before providing any details about 20 minutes into the show. By that time, others had already leaked the info and determined that there really wasn't much there.

From what I've seen (the occasional episode), I think that's normal for her show. I think they shouldn't have hyped it at all if they realized that there was nothing substantial in it.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 2:51 pm

Giving a WAG with no basis in reality...

Maddow was fed Trump's best possible return ultimately a Trump source fed through the system. She bit and now her credibility takes a hit because her obvious intelligence is matched by her obvious need to hype her superiority in the partisan divide. She got bested, which mind you, isn't easy to do and this will be armament for Trump for a long time to come.

He gets to trivialize her existence with "Rachel who did what and who cares?"
And every time she exposes a Russian link, for instance, his camp feeds "Ohhhhh, soooo damning, just like her exposing of the tax returns."

Again just a WAG, with nothing to back it.

Enough · Post by **Enough** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 3:57 pm

Rip wrote:
malchior wrote:
Rip wrote:I don't see how that controls the message. Is it really that much of a hurdle for them to pay their own damn way and fly commercial? Crappy news media companies make a fortune anyway, silly that the government should be shuttling them around.

Freedom of the press doesn't mean they should get everything for free.
Please. This is about access to the Secretary not the travel arrangements. But I suspect you know that.
No one is stopping them from accessing him.

Tillerson’s aides emphasized that they have made arrangements to permit American reporters, who travel on their own or are based abroad, to cover his stops in each capital. And they said he will participate in his first news conference during a joint appearance with Japanese Foreign Minister Fumio Kishida in Tokyo on Thursday.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... story.html

Wow, they are going to permit our free press to cover their events? How fing charitable of them lol. This should send a strong message of open democratic values to China, I am sure their citizens will look to this as a great example to follow for freedom. China's anti-democratic regime must be shaking in their boots, heh. Oh and covering his stops does not equal access as you well know lol.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:00 pm

ImLawBoy wrote:
El Guapo wrote:Kind of funny how much shit Maddow seems to be taking about it today. Two hours in advance she tweeted out what she had (Trump's 1040 from 2005), so it's not like she dramatically overhyped this really. People seem to be mad at her because this makes Trump look (relatively) good, and because there's no bombshell in there like everyone wanted there to be. But this is still definitely newsworthy - was she supposed to not report on this?
A lot of the shit I'm seeing is more focused on the actual show itself than on the promotion. She apparently had a very lengthy intro then a commercial break before providing any details about 20 minutes into the show. By that time, others had already leaked the info and determined that there really wasn't much there.

I get being annoyed by that, but a lot of the anger seems disproportionate (though admittedly, I didn't watch the show itself). Makes me think that a lot of the underlying anger is just that there isn't more there.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:34 pm

El Guapo wrote:I get being annoyed by that, but a lot of the anger seems disproportionate (though admittedly, I didn't watch the show itself). Makes me think that a lot of the underlying anger is just that there isn't more there.

There definitely is that. People want Trump gone...now. And I get that and his taxes are an unfortunate holy grail. Unfortunate because I doubt anything there is going to bring him down. However Maddow knows that and I think she relied on that angle plus the trust of her viewers. And didn't deliver anything really. Except sympathy points to Trump. That is probably the big part of why it was not well received. In context it was a terrible move.

I watched it. My wife who isn't very politically active muttered at about 10 minutes - this is terrible - guess she doesn't have anything. By that point she was already out paced by the White House itself and the Daily Beast. Still yet another 10 minutes of innuendo and then the dramatic pause...cut to commercial. I lasted through another 10 more minutes of the after speculation and flipped it off in disgust. It was awful. Having sat through it I remembered why I hate cable news. If she lead off the show with it and they spent time discussing the AMT angle and got into some of the context - it probably would have been acceptable. Boring but acceptable. However she instead went with boring and unacceptable. It is like being on a diet. You eat and never feel full because the meal never has any fucking calories.

raydude · Post by **raydude** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:56 pm

Rip wrote:
malchior wrote:
Rip wrote:I don't see how that controls the message. Is it really that much of a hurdle for them to pay their own damn way and fly commercial? Crappy news media companies make a fortune anyway, silly that the government should be shuttling them around.

Freedom of the press doesn't mean they should get everything for free.
Please. This is about access to the Secretary not the travel arrangements. But I suspect you know that.
No one is stopping them from accessing him.

Tillerson’s aides emphasized that they have made arrangements to permit American reporters, who travel on their own or are based abroad, to cover his stops in each capital. And they said he will participate in his first news conference during a joint appearance with Japanese Foreign Minister Fumio Kishida in Tokyo on Thursday.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... story.html

How magnanimous of him.

Pyperkub · Post by **Pyperkub** » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:59 pm

This is disturbing and not the way to run a Free Country:

Aides are going to great lengths to protect themselves. They’re turning off work-issued smartphones and putting them in drawers when they arrive home from work out of fear that they could be used to eavesdrop. They’re staying mum in meetings out of concern that their comments could be leaked to the press by foes.

Many are using encrypted apps that automatically delete messages once they’ve been read, or are leaving their personal cellphones at home in case their bosses initiate phone checks of the sort that press secretary Sean Spicer deployed last month to try to identify leakers on his team.

It’s an environment of fear that has hamstrung the routine functioning of the executive branch. Senior advisers are spending much of their time trying to protect turf, key positions have remained vacant due to a reluctance to hire people deemed insufficiently loyal, and Trump’s ambitious agenda has been eclipsed by headlines surrounding his unproven claim that former President Barack Obama tapped his phone lines at Trump Tower during the 2016 campaign...

...Trump has a history of overseeing pressure-cooker organizations rife with suspicion, setting up sophisticated surveillance in part to monitor employees at his properties, including at his campaign headquarters, where some campaign aides suspected their offices were bugged...

...One senior aide said staffers have become almost obsessed by daily news accounts of palace intrigue and spend hours in the office dissecting them in hopes of deciphering who is dishing — and who is trying to hurt whom.

Another Republican who is close to the White House said junior-level staffers are simply “mimicking what they’re seeing at the top … Everyone at the top is so suspicious that it trickles down the org chart, so everyone has become paranoid and suspicious.”

The distrust, some contend, isn’t unfounded.

“I wouldn't call it paranoia under the circumstances,” said a Republican who communicates with many administration aides through encrypted apps. “It’s not paranoia if people really are out to get you, and everybody actually is out to get everyone else.”

It's no wonder they subscribe to the worst of the conspiracy theories.

PS and the apps appear to be a violation of federal law with regards to gov't records...