Octopus Overlords

hepcat wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 4:42 pm Ah, got it. My LM translator must be broken as I didn't even make that connection.

Unfortunately your LM Translator warranty expires after 60,000 posts.

LordMortis wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 3:34 pm
I also wonder what POtuS thinks of Elaine Chao, who makes the wiki page but isn't a congressperson.

She’s one of those “good” immigrants. She’s also being used by various White House propagandists as the face of White House diversity and proof that Trump couldn’t possibly be racist.

Being Mitch McConnell’s wife is also useful to Trump so she’s probably on par with a Norwegian immigrant!

Just got off the plane and am catching up on today’s insanity.

He’s going to get a congresswoman killed.

I think the phrase I've heard most lately is 'shocking but not surprising'. Followed closely by the sound of silence from the GOP. Yeah, I'm down with the 'never vote for that party the rest of my life' sentiment; we've always known these people wanted nothing more than to be re-elected but to see it on display so blatantly really is demoralizing.

Tao wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 4:51 pm “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” ― Edmund Burke.

"...Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me." -Martin Niemoller.

While I do not necessarily believe it would occur in modern day America, thoughts of the Khmer Rouge and Pol Pot keep coming to mind these past few weeks as I read the news.

They both had an unarmed citizenry.

Being a nation of gun nuts should buy us a year or two.

• Whose side are the gun nuts on, primarily?

• If the gun nuts oppose the government, can they out-gun the government?

Jolor wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 10:22 pm

• Whose side are the gun nuts on, primarily?

• If the gun nuts oppose the government, can they out-gun the government?

1. Gun nuts follow anyone with the attitude GUNS! Fuck yeah!
2. They like to think they can. It's why so many are delusional.

GungHo wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 7:16 pm I think the phrase I've heard most lately is 'shocking but not surprising'. Followed closely by the sound of silence from the GOP. Yeah, I'm down with the 'never vote for that party the rest of my life' sentiment; we've always known these people wanted nothing more than to be re-elected but to see it on display so blatantly really is demoralizing.

And yet NPR interviews people in the districts these congresswomen are from, and the old white men (age 50+) still say "I don't think he's a racist, he's just bringing relevant issues to the surface and keeping people focused on immigration" and "I don't read his tweets. All I care about is the economy, and that's going great" and they continue to stand behind him.

It's weird, where I live all of the people who used to fly Confederate flags are now flying TRUMP 2020 flags instead. No joke and there are many. I'm not even in the south. I saw a particularly proud 20 something mouth breather flying two of them off the back of his rusty Dodge yesterday. He looked extremely proud. The support among Trump's base is stronger than ever.

It's because Trump has given their views legitimacy. Feelings they had that they generally kept buried for fear of backlash they now feel safe expressing since the president says it's OK. Trump has literally erased decades of progress in keeping these shitheads buried under their rocks.

There is a lot of dry tinder out there and he keeps throwing out matches. If this continues it is only a matter of time before it gets out of hand. I cant help but feel that next year is going to be a complete shit show on a level we have never seen. If he is way behind I expect it to be extremely bad.

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 4:12 pm

malchior wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 2:20 pm It is sort of indicative how bad it was because some GOP members reluctantly spoke out but so, so many have remained silent. Very disgusted but not surprised. Ive said it before but I'll never vote for anyone associated with the GOP ever again.

For example, please see what Mitt Romney has to to say about all this: <snap>

I just saw that Mitt has a black grandchild. He is such a weak willed piece of shit. He is doing this to HIS OWN GRANDCHILD. You cant even make this stuff up.

Scraper wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:30 am It's weird, where I live all of the people who used to fly Confederate flags are now flying TRUMP 2020 flags instead. No joke and there are many. I'm not even in the south. I saw a particularly proud 20 something mouth breather flying two of them off the back of his rusty Dodge yesterday. He looked extremely proud. The support among Trump's base is stronger than ever.

That doesn't seem weird at all to me. The basic message of both is pretty similar.

Out of curiosity whereabouts do you live?

El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:29 am

Scraper wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:30 am It's weird, where I live all of the people who used to fly Confederate flags are now flying TRUMP 2020 flags instead. No joke and there are many. I'm not even in the south. I saw a particularly proud 20 something mouth breather flying two of them off the back of his rusty Dodge yesterday. He looked extremely proud. The support among Trump's base is stronger than ever.

That doesn't seem weird at all to me. The basic message of both is pretty similar.

Out of curiosity whereabouts do you live?

I was being sarcastic with the weird comment. I live in Ohio.

Scraper wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:34 am

El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:29 am

Scraper wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:30 am It's weird, where I live all of the people who used to fly Confederate flags are now flying TRUMP 2020 flags instead. No joke and there are many. I'm not even in the south. I saw a particularly proud 20 something mouth breather flying two of them off the back of his rusty Dodge yesterday. He looked extremely proud. The support among Trump's base is stronger than ever.

That doesn't seem weird at all to me. The basic message of both is pretty similar.

Out of curiosity whereabouts do you live?

I was being sarcastic with the weird comment. I live in Ohio.

Yeah, I was wondering about that after I posted.

Is Ohio crazier than normal these days? It seems like it is, but I don't know it super well.

I grew up in Ohio. What does that tell you?

I left Ohio for Alabama. What does THAT tell you?

Alabama has lost again?

El Guapo wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:47 am
Yeah, I was wondering about that after I posted.

Is Ohio crazier than normal these days? It seems like it is, but I don't know it super well.

I would say that we have a very vocal minority that votes. Our state level political offices are controlled overwhelmingly by Republicans and our districts have been Gerrymandered to ensure their continued election. If Ohio swings to whoever the D Presidential candidate is it will be because the moderates show up to vote. Smaller cities like Canton, Akron, Youngstown and Dayton will have to have big turnouts in order to overcome the rural vote.

malchior wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:27 am

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 4:12 pm

malchior wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 2:20 pm It is sort of indicative how bad it was because some GOP members reluctantly spoke out but so, so many have remained silent. Very disgusted but not surprised. Ive said it before but I'll never vote for anyone associated with the GOP ever again.

For example, please see what Mitt Romney has to to say about all this: <snap>

I just saw that Mitt has a black grandchild. He is such a weak willed piece of shit. He is doing this to HIS OWN GRANDCHILD. You cant even make this stuff up.

Mitt is old-school GOP. He thinks money matters more than race.

CNN

The House of Representatives will vote on Tuesday on a resolution denouncing the President for "racist comments" targeting four Democratic congresswomen of color.

The resolution states that "President Donald Trump's racist comments have legitimized fear and hatred of new Americans and people of color" and "strongly condemns" the President's remarks, including "that our fellow Americans who are immigrants, and those who may look to the President like immigrants, should 'go back' to other countries."
...
The President has continued to defend his remarks amid backlash, claiming on Tuesday that the "tweets were NOT Racist," and urging Republicans to vote against the resolution. "The so-called vote to be taken is a Democrat con game. Republicans should not show 'weakness' and fall into their trap," the President tweeted on Tuesday.

The first sign of some cajones?

Jaymann wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:21 pm The first sign of some cajones?

A non-binding tsk tsk isn't even a speedbump for this runaway administration. What a freaking joke.

Optics matter.

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:29 pm

Jaymann wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:21 pm The first sign of some cajones?

A non-binding tsk tsk isn't even a speedbump for this runaway administration. What a freaking joke.

The oversight of Pelosi and the House Leadership has been pathetic. They learned the wrong lessons from the Republican impeachment of Clinton, and now they are too afraid to do anything.

I'm not a big fan of the policies put forth by AOC and "the squad", but at least they are willing to go out there and fight for what they believe in.

msteelers wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 4:14 pm The oversight of Pelosi and the House Leadership has been pathetic. They learned the wrong lessons from the Republican impeachment of Clinton, and now they are too afraid to do anything.

I'm not a big fan of the policies put forth by AOC and "the squad", but at least they are willing to go out there and fight for what they believe in.

I agree. The Democrats ran on a platform of healthcare and holding the Trump administration accountable. The first was not achievable and the fifth circuit is going to blow a hole in that anyway. The second has been weak and pathetic. They somehow can't capture airtime versus the worst President in American history unless it is their idiotic in-fighting. So they are pretty fucking useless but also sadly our only hope.

Jaymann wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:21 pm The first sign of some cajones?

If it means anything AND the Republicans vote for it. Neither of which are accurate.

malchior wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 5:09 pmSo they are pretty fucking useless but also sadly our only hope.

Correction: They are useful in the sense that they aren't a GOP majority...otherwise fucking useless.

For those wondering (I wasn't), Liz Cheney - POS:

YellowKing wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:07 am It's because Trump has given their views legitimacy. Feelings they had that they generally kept buried for fear of backlash they now feel safe expressing since the president says it's OK. Trump has literally erased decades of progress in keeping these shitheads buried under their rocks.

It's disheartening to me to see just how many people share his views. I thought we were better than that, I thought we one of the countries helping lead the world into the future. It's feeling more and more like we are leading the world backwards.

It feels like walking into a dark room and flicking on the light. Then you see a bunch of cockroaches scurrying for cover, or at least that's how it used to work. Now there's one cockroach standing in the middle of the room, proudly ignoring the light that is shining on him, while the other cockroaches slowly follow his lead and step out into the light. All you can do in that situation is hope the pest control people get here ASAP.

The good news is that they're still some good people out there. The bad news is that they have to shout over Trump's moronic cult of racist, corrupt, hypocritical assholes.

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:14 pm For those wondering (I wasn't), Liz Cheney - POS:

They're wrong when they want to take the power from the people and give it to the government.

...

The U.S. does not torture; in fact, what holds up the release from Guantanamo is getting a guarantee from their governments that they won't be tortured. Guantanamo and prisons in Afghanistan are completely consistent with international obligations. Just because the Geneva Convention might not technically apply does not mean that America does not treat people with the spirit of the convention. . . . While we are doing things militarily in the war on terror, we are also spreading hope and opportunity so that the young people do not become recruits for the terrorists.

It is incredible, but not surprising, that the Democrats would try to remove God from committee proceedings in one of their first acts in the majority. They really have become the party of Karl Marx,” she added.

I love Mary very much. I love her family very much. This is just an issue on which we disagree

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/ ... ing-haspel

Government over the people See You Next Tuesday.

When I want to oppose a religion I'll do it with torture outside the law and anyone who objects is a terrorist sympathizer.

gameoverman wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:16 pm

YellowKing wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:07 am It's because Trump has given their views legitimacy. Feelings they had that they generally kept buried for fear of backlash they now feel safe expressing since the president says it's OK. Trump has literally erased decades of progress in keeping these shitheads buried under their rocks.

It's disheartening to me to see just how many people share his views. I thought we were better than that, I thought we one of the countries helping lead the world into the future. It's feeling more and more like we are leading the world backwards.

It feels like walking into a dark room and flicking on the light. Then you see a bunch of cockroaches scurrying for cover, or at least that's how it used to work. Now there's one cockroach standing in the middle of the room, proudly ignoring the light that is shining on him, while the other cockroaches slowly follow his lead and step out into the light. All you can do in that situation is hope the pest control people get here ASAP.

The coming election is shaping up to be the one we should have had in 2016: Unless the Dems are foolish enough to put up another Establishment centrist, Americans will be presented with two starkly different futures. Will it be Trump's xenophobic, nationalistic, white supremacist vision of hatred and oppression? or a uniquely American take on inclusionist European-style social democracy? The middle road is closed for repairs; you must choose the high road or the low road. After four years of Trump, our eyes are wide open to the low road. The GOP isn't even pretending otherwise anymore. If we choose to stay on it anyway, we deserve where we're going to end up.

Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:34 pm If we choose to stay on it anyway, we deserve where we're going to end up.

Hell is 51% determining where 49% end up.

Holman wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:45 pm

Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:34 pm If we choose to stay on it anyway, we deserve where we're going to end up.

Hell is 51% determining where 49% end up.

If Trump's platform will center around racism and xenophobia, he is capped at 45%...but with voter suppression, general cheating, and Russian help, that might be enough (again).

Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:03 pm

Holman wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:45 pm

Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:34 pm If we choose to stay on it anyway, we deserve where we're going to end up.

Hell is 51% determining where 49% end up.

If Trump's platform will center around racism and xenophobia, he is capped at 45%...but with voter suppression, general cheating, and Russian help, that might be enough (again).

51% of 60%* of 50%**. Something like that. Or around 15% of everyone.

Seems that if you say F the other 85% and get that 15% then you can win.

* Voter turnout
**Eligible voters as percent to total population.

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:06 pm

Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:03 pm

Holman wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:45 pm

Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:34 pm If we choose to stay on it anyway, we deserve where we're going to end up.

Hell is 51% determining where 49% end up.

If Trump's platform will center around racism and xenophobia, he is capped at 45%...but with voter suppression, general cheating, and Russian help, that might be enough (again).

51% of 60%* of 50%**. Something like that. Or around 15% of everyone.

Seems that if you say F the other 85% and get that 15% then you can win.

* Voter turnout
**Eligible voters as percent to total population.

Indisputably. Trump only "won" by 87,000 votes smeared across four states; he's even less legitimate than Bush II. One hopes that will be easy to reverse, but one knows that systems are meant to be gamed, and recognizes which party is the better gamer.

hepcat wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:21 pm The good news is that they're still some good people out there. The bad news is that they have to shout over Trump's moronic cult of racist, corrupt, hypocritical assholes.

I've come to the gradual realization that roughly a third of humanity are terrible, terrible people. Probably always have been, probably always will be. When you figure that about 5% of the people are sociopaths, 1% are psychopaths, 1% NPD, etc. it's pretty easy to see where we can get to a third pretty fast.

malchior wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 5:41 pm

malchior wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 5:09 pmSo they are pretty fucking useless but also sadly our only hope.

Correction: They are useful in the sense that they aren't a GOP majority...otherwise fucking useless.

I'm not sure what you expected. They have held "accountability" hearings but Trump is not allowing his people to testify at all. So then you have to go to court to force them to testify and that takes time. There's really not much more you can do. The infighting is not helpful (but every party has this at times), and Ilan Omar needs to stop saying stupid things that Trump and the Republicans can use, but what else can they do (other than impeachment in the House which would be worthless).

Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:34 pm
The coming election is shaping up to be the one we should have had in 2016: Unless the Dems are foolish enough to put up another Establishment centrist, Americans will be presented with two starkly different futures. Will it be Trump's xenophobic, nationalistic, white supremacist vision of hatred and oppression? or a uniquely American take on inclusionist European-style social democracy? The middle road is closed for repairs; you must choose the high road or the low road. After four years of Trump, our eyes are wide open to the low road. The GOP isn't even pretending otherwise anymore. If we choose to stay on it anyway, we deserve where we're going to end up.

It may be a mistake. An establishment centrist, without the baggage of Hillary would beat Trump. I'm not certain that the country is ready for or really wants a European style social democracy. I am interested in certain aspects but I'm not sure I want all that the left wing of the Democratic Party is selling, nor do I believe most Americans do either. To me this is a risky game the Democrats are playing.

Trump is going to get 45% of the vote, no matter what. The Democrats are going to get 45% of the vote, no matter what. So the question is now do you maximize your share of the last 10%. Trump has a head start there - the economy is going pretty good for most people and Trump can credibly run on that. What are the Democrats going to do to appeal to that same 10%. I'm not sure that European style social democracy all at once is going to get it. This country moves incrementally when it moves. I'm afraid the Dems will turn off the voters they need.