The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

[Carpet_pissr]

Space force. Nobody knows who they are!

Because they’re androids.

[Unagi]

Two problems with 'leave' amount to 'where is better' and 'are they taking people?'

three I guess.... 'what is the financial hit?'

Four: Are you the kind of person that other places accept to begin with?

That should be baked into #2, because even in the best circumstances there are qualifiers.

So I will rephrase it as "are they taking people like me?'

[waitingtoconnect]

Isn't this argument obviously frivolous? How does Impeachment equate to criminal jeopardy? I mean the Impeachment clause literally says the Impeached person is still at risk of Indictment. I don't even see what the question is. Considering that you'd think there'd be an interest in fast tracking these inane blocking actions through the court system.

You need to be a black guy at a BLM rally for that to happen.

[Victoria Raverna]

Maybe Biden can order Seal Team Six to solve the problem?

As long as the senate doesn't convict him, he's golden.

He just need to also order Seal Team Six to solve that second problem.

[Victoria Raverna]

Maybe Biden can order Seal Team Six to solve the problem?

Seals can't keep their mouths shut. He'd be better off with Delta Force.

That doesn't matter. Biden can order Seal Team Six to solve the problem openly and he is still okay because of the immunity from prosecution as long as the senate couldn't impeach him.

[waitingtoconnect]

Trump tried to delay closing arguments in his fraud trial citing the death of his mother in law but was ok to be on the Fox News town hall…

[malchior]

Trump tried to delay closing arguments in his fraud trial citing the death of his mother in law but was ok to be on the Fox News town hall…

While no one believes he has normal human emotions, the argument might be about where actual events overlap. And that's pretty normal.

[malchior]

NY Times

Bomb threat against judge's home in civil trial this morning. This comes after Judge Chutkan (the judge overseeing the DC federal trial) was swatted recently. We've been so far lucky that MAGAts are mostly vile, cowards and let's hope it stays that way. Despite the question about delays news networks are reporting the hearing is continuing and Trump just arrived there personally.

Nassau County authorities on Thursday responded to a bomb threat at the house of the judge presiding over the civil fraud trial of Donald J. Trump.

A spokesman for the Nassau County Police Department confirmed that there was an investigation at the house of the judge, Arthur F. Engoron, who in several hours is expected to hear closing arguments in Mr. Trump’s case. Two people with knowledge of the matter said that the threat involved a bomb and that the bomb squad came to the house.

It was not clear whether the threat would delay the proceedings.

The threat came the morning after Mr. Trump again attacked Justice Engoron on Truth Social, his social media site, saying that the judge and the New York attorney general, who brought the fraud case, were trying to “screw me.” And it came just days after the police in Washington were called to the home of the federal judge overseeing Mr. Trump’s election interference case.

[LordMortis]

NY Times

Bomb threat against judge's home in civil trial this morning. This comes after Judge Chutkan (the judge overseeing the DC federal trial) was swatted recently. We've been so far lucky that MAGAts are mostly vile, cowards and let's hope it stays that way. Despite the question about delays news networks are reporting the hearing is continuing and Trump just arrived there personally.

Nassau County authorities on Thursday responded to a bomb threat at the house of the judge presiding over the civil fraud trial of Donald J. Trump.

A spokesman for the Nassau County Police Department confirmed that there was an investigation at the house of the judge, Arthur F. Engoron, who in several hours is expected to hear closing arguments in Mr. Trump’s case. Two people with knowledge of the matter said that the threat involved a bomb and that the bomb squad came to the house.

It was not clear whether the threat would delay the proceedings.

The threat came the morning after Mr. Trump again attacked Justice Engoron on Truth Social, his social media site, saying that the judge and the New York attorney general, who brought the fraud case, were trying to “screw me.” And it came just days after the police in Washington were called to the home of the federal judge overseeing Mr. Trump’s election interference case.

I'm sure they would consider themselves spiritual Tea Party successors. They'd be wrong but that's how they'd view themselves.

[malchior]

RollingStone

Nothing says "rule of law" nation more than a criminal defendant frontrunning Presidential candidate digging up blackmail material against the prosecutors.

Donald Trump, his close allies, and attorneys are exploring ways to weaponize recent, unverified claims that Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis has engaged in an “improper relationship” with a special prosecutor working for her.

Though the veracity of the allegations is unknown, Trumpland is already discussing different ideas for marshaling considerable resources to try and dig up even more dirt on, among other things, Willis’ “sex life and… her money” in an effort to shut down the criminal case against the former president and his associates, says an attorney close to Trump.

On Monday, a lawyer for one of Trump’s co-defendants, former campaign aide Michael Roman, dropped a bombshell in the Georgia election interference case — alleging that Willis has been romantically involved with her office’s special prosecutor, Nathan Wade, who has been paid $654,000 so far for his work on the case, according to the Atlanta Journal-Constitution. Citing “sources close to both the special prosecutor and the district attorney,” the former Trump aide’s lawyer argued in a motion that Willis has personally and illegally benefited from this arrangement, and that she and Wade should be disqualified from prosecuting the case.

...

As the Trump team weighs how to handle the allegations in court, some legal and political advisers to Trump are also discussing possibly assigning a team specifically devoted to further investigating Willis’ alleged “improper” relationship with her fellow top Trump prosecutor, as well as tracking down new leads on other possible conflicts or embarrassing secrets related to her office, the sources add. This week, opposition researchers connected to Trump’s inner orbit scoured social media to find, research, and potentially contact people who know the special prosecutor and the ex-spouse, to try to uncover additional damaging information.

Furthermore, House Republicans have been quietly discussing whether they should expand their investigation of Willis to include digging into her alleged “improper” relationship and other matters related to the special prosecutor assigned to the election interference case, according to a source familiar with the situation and another person briefed on it.

[Victoria Raverna]

Does Roger Stone have immunity for plotting to assassinate political rivals?

[Alefroth]

Only if Trump gives him immunity.

[malchior]

I think Roger Stone is a despicable piece of trash. With that out of the way I'd say that I'm pretty sure that talking privately about your assassination dreams - that probably never went a step further than flapping gums in a bar - is not even a crime that needs immunity.

[hepcat]

Roger Stone IS a despicable piece of trash. I don't think that's even up for debate, considering how he's proven it so often. He's a truly evil person. One of the few that I can say that about without pausing to wonder if perhaps they believe they're doing the right thing even when they 're not.

[stessier]

I think Roger Stone is a despicable piece of trash. With that out of the way I'd say that I'm pretty sure that talking privately about your assassination dreams - that probably never went a step further than flapping gums in a bar - is not even a crime that needs immunity.

There needs to be an overt act in furtherance of the scheme to make it a crime. It follows the logic that two people talking over drinks can say a lot of things that they never intend to actually do.

[Alefroth]

I think Roger Stone is a despicable piece of trash. With that out of the way I'd say that I'm pretty sure that talking privately about your assassination dreams - that probably never went a step further than flapping gums in a bar - is not even a crime that needs immunity.

There needs to be an overt act in furtherance of the scheme to make it a crime. It follows the logic that two people talking over drinks can say a lot of things that they never intend to actually do.

Isn't talking about it with someone else an overt act in furtherance of the scheme?

[malchior]

I think Roger Stone is a despicable piece of trash. With that out of the way I'd say that I'm pretty sure that talking privately about your assassination dreams - that probably never went a step further than flapping gums in a bar - is not even a crime that needs immunity.

There needs to be an overt act in furtherance of the scheme to make it a crime. It follows the logic that two people talking over drinks can say a lot of things that they never intend to actually do.

Isn't talking about it with someone else an overt act in furtherance of the scheme?

Not on its own.

Here is a randomly chosen link (but decent discussion) to a primer about what an overt act is.

[Alefroth]

I think Roger Stone is a despicable piece of trash. With that out of the way I'd say that I'm pretty sure that talking privately about your assassination dreams - that probably never went a step further than flapping gums in a bar - is not even a crime that needs immunity.

There needs to be an overt act in furtherance of the scheme to make it a crime. It follows the logic that two people talking over drinks can say a lot of things that they never intend to actually do.

Isn't talking about it with someone else an overt act in furtherance of the scheme?

Not on its own.

Here is a randomly chosen link (but decent discussion) to a primer about what an overt act is.

Those are the four elements necessary to make a conspiracy. It doesn't mean any of the four elements can't be overt acts on their own. They don't even have to be unlawful on their own. I have no idea what Stone's conversation was, but I'm guessing what's missing is agreement of the other party.

[malchior]

Yes - those are the 4 elements. One of which is an additional factor of taking an overt act. Talking about and even agreeing to commit a crime aren't themselves an overt act. I recommend reading the example about counterfeiting to get a sense of it.

[Victoria Raverna]

Here are what he actually said if you didn't watch the video and listen to his words:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... ie-mediate

“Let’s go find Swalwell. It’s time to do it. Then we’ll see how brave the rest of them are. It’s time to do it. It’s either Nadler or Swalwell has to die before the election. They need to get the message. Let’s go find Swalwell and get this over with. I’m just not putting up with this shit any more.”

[malchior]

Just saw this. If this opinion pans out it will not be surprising at all. She has been on the brakes on this trial the entire time, she set out dates that were on the long side, and now she isn't even holding anyone to those deadlines. Also, as I understand it this effectively delays the GA case.

[waitingtoconnect]

That’s future Supreme Court justice Cannon to you.

[TheMix]

That’s future Supreme Court justice Cannon to you.

If I were a betting man... that is not a bet I'd take.

[Alefroth]

When is the DOJ going to charge him with the parts of the documents case that they can charge in DC.

[malchior]

When is the DOJ going to charge him with the parts of the documents case that they can charge in DC.

Probably too late to do so. The functional courts in DC aren't going to entertain that sort of prosecutorial gamesmanship.

It was a gamble to file it there (there was a lot of debate over it) but in the end they got a bad draw on the case (~10% she would have gotten it). Maybe she'll go far enough to give them an avenue to appeal but it seems like the case is lost for now.

[Scraper]

You guys are way over reacting to that minor ruling. It does nothing to delay the case and in the grand scheme of things can be fixed by Cannon herself at any time. The prosecution will continue to pursue their case regardless of thia order.

[malchior]

You guys are way over reacting to that minor ruling. It does nothing to delay the case and in the grand scheme of things can be fixed by Cannon herself at any time.

I mean...I think I'm going to model my expectations based on the analysis of the nationally recognized national security lawyers who've commented on this, but you do you.

The prosecution will continue to pursue their case regardless of thia order.

Who suggested otherwise?

[Scraper]

You guys are way over reacting to that minor ruling. It does nothing to delay the case and in the grand scheme of things can be fixed by Cannon herself at any time.

I mean...I think I'm going to model my expectations based on the analysis of the nationally recognized national security lawyers who've commented on this, but you do you.

The prosecution will continue to pursue their case regardless of thia order.

Who suggested otherwise?

I'd rather not argue my qualifications to make a judgment on this issue, but I'll say this, I'm qualified and I stand by my thoughts regardless of what your expert says.

The second part was a comment that this order won't stop the prosecution from continuing their work. That's it.

[Alefroth]

You guys are way over reacting to that minor ruling. It does nothing to delay the case and in the grand scheme of things can be fixed by Cannon herself at any time. The prosecution will continue to pursue their case regardless of thia order.

Sure, and maybe Trump will become presidential.

[Punisher]

Here are what he actually said if you didn't watch the video and listen to his words:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... ie-mediate

“Let’s go find Swalwell. It’s time to do it. Then we’ll see how brave the rest of them are. It’s time to do it. It’s either Nadler or Swalwell has to die before the election. They need to get the message. Let’s go find Swalwell and get this over with. I’m just not putting up with this shit any more.”

First off, I dont know anything about this guy.
However, it seems like his request to see/hear the video/audio sounds reasonable.
I know if I were accused of saying something on tape that I didn't remember I'd like some proof.

[Victoria Raverna]

Here are what he actually said if you didn't watch the video and listen to his words:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... ie-mediate

“Let’s go find Swalwell. It’s time to do it. Then we’ll see how brave the rest of them are. It’s time to do it. It’s either Nadler or Swalwell has to die before the election. They need to get the message. Let’s go find Swalwell and get this over with. I’m just not putting up with this shit any more.”

First off, I dont know anything about this guy.
However, it seems like his request to see/hear the video/audio sounds reasonable.
I know if I were accused of saying something on tape that I didn't remember I'd like some proof.

They played the audio in the video that I linked.

[Punisher]

Ok.
Might have missed it wirh all the ads that filled the page.
On my phone so no ad blocker.

[Holman]

On the one hand, assassinating one or two enemy congressmen seems like it wouldn't really advance one's cause and would actually be counterproductive.

On the other hand, Stone is a hothead who is thought to do a lot of cocaine.

[Victoria Raverna]

On the one hand, assassinating one or two enemy congressmen seems like it wouldn't really advance one's cause and would actually be counterproductive.

On the other hand, Stone is a hothead who is thought to do a lot of cocaine.

I think it was personal for Stone to target those senators. It is not just to advance his or Trump's political cause.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/police-don-t ... 09371.html

Stone, a notorious conservative political operative, has long been a loyal Trump adviser and ally. When Stone was convicted in July 2019 in relation to special counsel Robert Mueller’s Russia probe, Trump indirectly intervened.

Stone was found guilty of lying to Congress, witness tampering, and obstruction of a proceeding. Prosecutors wanted Stone to be sentenced to nine years in prison, but Trump’s Justice Department reportedly stepped in to give him a shorter sentence. Then, just days before Stone was due to go to jail, Trump commuted his sentence entirely. Nadler announced the House Judiciary investigation into the commutation just a few days later.

Four of the prosecutors abruptly quit the case following the Justice Department’s intervention. At least one, Aaron Zelinsky, acknowledged he had left in protest. A separate audio recording revealed Stone wanted retribution against Zelinsky, as well.

Both Nadler and Swalwell was in the House Judiciary Committee that launched the investigation.

[Smoove_B]

Answering the question I've had all along - who is paying:

Donald Trump’s PACs spent a staggering $50 million on the former president’s legal defense in 2023, according to a report from The New York Times.

According to two sources who spoke to the Times, the former president’s massive legal bills were paid out through funds from the Save America PAC and the Make America Great Again PAC, his two primary political action committees. The full details of the PAC spending will be made available Wednesday, the deadline for Federal Election Commission year-end campaign filings.

It feels like maybe a PAC shouldn't be able to fund a criminal's legal proceedings, but I'm just a simple man.

According to the Times, 10 cents of every dollar donated to Trump’s campaign is being directed towards Save America, which in the last year has operated virtually exclusively as a legal slush fund for the former president.

Congrats MAGAts, you're paying lawyers. I suppose they probably don't care.

[Alefroth]

I wonder if they'll care when they start paying Carroll?

[YellowKing]

Money going to lawyers can't go to campaigning. I don't really care if the legal proceedings bankrupt him or not, I only care that it's a constant albatross around his neck.

[waitingtoconnect]

He’s in the media so much he doesn’t need money for campaigning. As for the legality I’m sure it’s borderline legal but it would be a scandal if anyone but the Tancurian candidate did it (eg Biden, Obama etc)

[YellowKing]

For a guy who doesn't need money, he still spent nearly 2 billion on his campaign in 2020. The money matters in the swing states when they make those last-minute media blitzes and get out the vote campaigns.

[LawBeefaroni]

Money going to lawyers can't go to campaigning. I don't really care if the legal proceedings bankrupt him or not, I only care that it's a constant albatross around his neck.

But every "persecution" he faces is a great fundraising opportunity. It's kind of a wash.