Too early to think about 2022?

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hepcat
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by hepcat »

We have a broken healthcare system when it comes to cost. I think a majority of our country believes that to be the case. And any move towards resolving the exorbitant cost is a good one. It won't be fixed in one move though.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Drazzil »

hepcat wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 10:17 am We have a broken healthcare system when it comes to cost. I think a majority of our country believes that to be the case. And any move towards resolving the exorbitant cost is a good one. It won't be fixed in one move though.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Zarathud »

There are a lot of poor sick people who never pay their health care bills and use the most expensive treatment. They don’t bear the cost — the rest of us do.

Doctors and hospitals must be paid for. That markup looks exorbitant but it’s sunk costs of our crappy current patchwork system.

Mandating and providing universal health coverage makes the most economic sense as we’re all paying. Obama took us forward in a big step against tremendous opposition. Now if we could mandate it.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by malchior »

ACA increased access but costs are still out of control and outcomes are terrible.

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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Holman »

Dr. Oz keeps stepping in shit.



(For those who don't know Philadelphia: Pat's and Geno's are rival cheesesteak places that really are just famous tourist traps. Locals know better.)
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by coopasonic »

malchior wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 5:31 pm ACA increased access but costs are still out of control and outcomes are terrible.

It's called capitalism.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Holman »

coopasonic wrote: Fri Jul 15, 2022 5:20 pm
malchior wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 5:31 pm ACA increased access but costs are still out of control and outcomes are terrible.

[...]
It's called capitalism.
And capitalism is always about "terrible for whom"?
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by malchior »

Holman wrote: Fri Jul 15, 2022 4:10 pm Dr. Oz keeps stepping in shit.



(For those who don't know Philadelphia: Pat's and Geno's are rival cheesesteak places that really are just famous tourist traps. Locals know better.)
He probably was advising Geno's it was time to put the 'Speak English' sign back up. :roll:
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by malchior »

Sounds like something that is totally inevitable.

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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Holman »

malchior wrote: Fri Jul 15, 2022 8:38 pm Sounds like something that is totally inevitable.

What's perfect here is that a Fetterman-Bernie alliance would be really popular in PA.

Oz thinks he's running for Fox pundits' approval, not Pennsylvania's.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by LordMortis »

Fact? So he has evidence to prove this to be true? Isn't that more of a Friday Speculation on future events? I suppose what a fact is doesn't matter when you are Dr Oz or those that would vote for him. If it were indeed a fact known right now, then Dr Oz would know for a fact that Fetterman will win the senate seat, wouldn't he?
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Kraken »

Holman wrote: Fri Jul 15, 2022 5:55 pm
coopasonic wrote: Fri Jul 15, 2022 5:20 pm
malchior wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 5:31 pm ACA increased access but costs are still out of control and outcomes are terrible.

[...]
It's called capitalism.
And capitalism is always about "terrible for whom"?
What a coincidence that the US line wanders off track during the Reagan years.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by hepcat »

:lol:



Fetterman paid for a cameo video from Snooki of Jersey Shores to Dr. Oz wishing him luck in his move to Pennsylvania.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Zarathud »

Now that is funny.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Holman »

Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Carpet_pissr »

Is that the Sham Wow guy?
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Holman »

Carpet_pissr wrote: Tue Jul 19, 2022 11:29 pm Is that the Sham Wow guy?
It's Oz faceswapped onto the famous Steve Buscemi meme.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Holman »



He makes it look so easy.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Holman »

Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by El Guapo »

I feel like we're heading for a scenario where Oz wins by like 6 points and then everyone's like "how did that happen - Fetterman was *destroying* him on Twitter!"
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by hepcat »

Silly man, no one loses elections anymore. Mathematical impossibility is the go to term if you’re told you’ve lost.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Holman »

El Guapo wrote: Wed Jul 20, 2022 8:38 pm I feel like we're heading for a scenario where Oz wins by like 6 points and then everyone's like "how did that happen - Fetterman was *destroying* him on Twitter!"
I feel confident. I think Fetterman authentically has the "real dude unafraid of the establishment" quality that Trump and his imitators have spent millions pretending to have. Mehmet Oz, meanwhile, is the Republican version of a Hollywood celebrity parachuting in to pretend to represent everyday voters in a state where he's a tourist.

I think a lot of PA Trump Republicans will vote for Fetterman on style and affect alone. My fear is that they'll split-ticket and give the governorship to the QAnon Christian-Nationalist Fascist Doug Mastriano, which would be an *absolute* nightmare and almost certainly upend the 2024 electoral count.

Polling still favors Shapiro over Mastriano, but it's not the easy lead Fetterman seems to have.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Pyperkub »

hepcat wrote: Wed Jul 20, 2022 8:41 pm Silly man, no one loses elections anymore. Mathematical impossibility is the go to term if you’re told you’ve lost.
And then continue to fundraise for the grift, while not *actually* paying for a recount?
Colorado's secretary of state's office on Wednesday said it has told two candidates who lost their Republican primary races last month that it will not conduct a recount of those races because they failed to pay the required amount by the deadline.

The office informed Mesa County Clerk Tina Peters, who lost her race for the GOP nomination for secretary of state, and state Rep. Ron Hanks, who fell short in his bid for the party's U.S. Senate nomination, that it was moving forward finalizing the results of the primary. Neither candidate paid the $236,000 that was due by July 15 for the recount.
Note that I'm speculating based upon previous behaviors regarding the fundraising. Media still fails far too much at the first rule of Watergate - follow the money.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Holman »

Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Smoove_B »

He's definitely killing it on the social media front.

Maybe next year, maybe no go
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by LordMortis »

I'd be careful with the confidence. Granholm only moved to Michigan for her political career, rose to Governor in about ten years time and then promptly moved back to California. And she was a rotten governor. And then there was a Clinton in New York...
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by malchior »

Smoove_B wrote: Wed Jul 27, 2022 10:12 pmHe's definitely killing it on the social media front.
He has dusted off the old defense against a carpetbagger playbook but it sure helps when you have footage like that. What's unclear is whether it'll work when people seem to only care about what war camp you belong to.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Smoove_B »

Oh, that's a given. It's beyond gross that Oz will get an insane number of votes simply because he has a (R) next to his name. Hopefully Fetterman's campaign motivates enough people to vote for him instead. He's at least doing *something* and actively engaging various communities (and trending younger with these types of ads) than what we typically see.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by malchior »

Smoove_B wrote: Thu Jul 28, 2022 10:05 am Oh, that's a given. It's beyond gross that Oz will get an insane number of votes simply because he has a (R) next to his name. Hopefully Fetterman's campaign motivates enough people to vote for him instead. He's at least doing *something* and actively engaging various communities (and trending younger with these types of ads) than what we typically see.
Indeed - what I expect and hope is that Fetterman will run the Stacey Abrams playbook as phase 2 in fall. That'll revolve around motivating those younger people he has cultivated to come out and vote.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by El Guapo »

FWIW there are signs that the political environment might be improving for Democrats. In particular the prospects for holding the Senate are improving - up from ~ 47% chance when 538 launched their 2022 model on June 30th to ~ 56% today. And that's factoring in largely negative political forecasts - if you just go by current polls it's closer to ~ 60%.

Still boned in the House, and still not high enough, but nice to have one thing trending in the right direction at least.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Octavious »

Trump promoting idiots instead of electable people is part of what is closing the gap. Of course some of those idiots will get elected so ya... PA Gov is the big one to me. If they put a dude in that will throw out the election that will be ugly...
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by pr0ner »

Lol.

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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Kurth »

I’ve said it before, but the Dems actively supporting MAGA Trump candidates in primaries hoping those candidates will be easier to beat in the general are fucking morons.

Michigan congressman slams Democrats for meddling in his primary:
In the final days of Rep. Peter Meijer's close fight for his party's nomination, the Michigan Republican and his allies are slamming Democrats for meddling in Tuesday's GOP primary.

An outside group supporting Meijer -- one of the 10 House Republicans who voted to impeach former President Donald Trump -- launched a new ad over the weekend criticizing the Democratic establishment for helping the freshman congressman's Trump-backed opponent.

"The Democrats are justifying this political jiu-jitsu by making the argument that politics is a tough business. I don't disagree. But that toughness is bound by certain moral limits: Those who participated in the attack on the Capitol, for example, clearly fall outside those limits," Meijer writes. "But over the course of the midterms, Democrats seem to have forgotten just where those limits lie."

Among the House Democrats Meijer calls out by name are Reps. Jamie Raskin and Elaine Luria, both of whom sit on the select committee. Both members, Meijer writes, have "rationalized" the DCCC's investment.

Overall, nearly $3 million has been spent on ads in the House primary, with Meijer and Gibbs locked in a close race for the nomination in the Western Michigan seat.

Gibbs, a former Trump appointee at the Department of Housing and Urban Development, has embraced Trump's false claims that the 2020 election was stolen. The former President endorsed Gibbs but has done relatively little to support his preferred candidate financially.

The DCCC, on the other hand, has spent more than $300,000 on ads that lightly criticize Gibbs and highlight his endorsement from Trump. The signal boost for Gibbs is an attempt by Democrats to give the party a more favorable general election matchup.

And it's just the latest in a string of primaries where Democratic groups have spent millions boosting far-right candidates in competitive GOP primaries.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Alefroth »

Too bad they can't get out the vote like this for their own candidates.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by Smoove_B »

Yeah, I can see why they think it would be a great idea to signal boost a garbage candidate, but bigger picture optics...it's gross.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by El Guapo »

So in general I think that people are too dismissive of "boost the crank candidate in the opposing party's primary" as a tactic. Not that it's always a great idea, but Claire McCaskill got like an extra 12 years as a Democratic senator from Missouri precisely because she played in the GOP primary field.

That said, I think messing with Meijer's race is a bad idea, precisely because we're going to be asking Republicans in the years to come to do the right thing in the face of authoritarianism rising in the GOP, and messing with one of only 10 Republicans to vote for impeachment is only going to make that pitch harder.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by hepcat »

El Guapo wrote: Tue Aug 02, 2022 3:07 pm I think messing with Meijer's race is a bad idea, precisely because we're going to be asking Republicans in the years to come to do the right thing in the face of authoritarianism rising in the GOP, and messing with one of only 10 Republicans to vote for impeachment is only going to make that pitch harder.
+1
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by ImLawBoy »

As an example of when D meddling in an R primary is good, take Illinois. D governor JB Pritzker reportedly funneled millions into a campaign to get Darren Bailey on the R ticket instead of Richard Irvin. Pretty much the only way for an R to win a statewide election in Illinois is by being socially moderate, and Richard Irvin is a Black R mayor who is socially moderate but styles himself as tough on crime. I think he might have made a credible challenger to Pritzker, particularly on economic and crime issues. Instead, Pritzker gets to run campaign ads with Bailey literally thanking God for overturning Roe and for giving us Trump. That's a fine message for Southern Illinois where he's from, but it's not going to play well in the heavily populated areas where a moderate R could have gained some real traction.

(I reserve the right to delete this post and claim I never said any of this if Bailey somehow ends up winning the governor's office.)
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by gbasden »

hepcat wrote: Tue Aug 02, 2022 3:10 pm
El Guapo wrote: Tue Aug 02, 2022 3:07 pm I think messing with Meijer's race is a bad idea, precisely because we're going to be asking Republicans in the years to come to do the right thing in the face of authoritarianism rising in the GOP, and messing with one of only 10 Republicans to vote for impeachment is only going to make that pitch harder.
+1
This is exactly why this is infinitely stupid. We should be encouraging every sane Republican, not punishing them for doing the right thing.
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Re: Too early to think about 2022?

Post by LordMortis »

Kurth wrote: Tue Aug 02, 2022 12:41 pm
Long quote on Peter Meijer.

I was surprised at how OK Meijer has been. I don't know where I feel about the dirty politic though. He was part of the cadre that ran out for not being Prince/DeVos (and therefore Trump and the corrupt Michigan GOP legislature) friendly enough. Given my conflicting views on the man, I don't know how come out either for or against. :oops:

Being a GOP elected or appointed anything in Michigan has been a dirty game for quite some time now.
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