NCAA Football 2022

[Carpet_pissr]

Is the answer: a bear on all fours that appears to be wearing a t shirt?

[Pyperkub]

In the other Power 2 top 10 undefeated matchup, WTF were the Penn St. Coaches doing?

Watching that game, they routinely had 6 or fewer guys in the box and the safeties playing a deep shell.

WTF was that game plan? Well, whatever it was, it worked to give Michigan over 400 yards rushing…

The thing about Penn St this year is that they are absolutely loaded with talent, but dear lord do their schemes rely on having a physical advantage everywhere and winning every single one on one matchup on every single play.

Especially in the Running game. It’s why Clifford has to play hero ball so much, and why he gets injured every year (and why they could run the ball effectively against a lot of teams, but not Michigan).

They may still beat Ohio St at home, their DB’s are really, really talented and can win those one on one battles if Ohio State doesn’t just run the ball down their throat too.

[ImLawBoy]

In the other Power 2 top 10 undefeated matchup, WTF were the Penn St. Coaches doing?

Watching that game, they routinely had 6 or fewer guys in the box and the safeties playing a deep shell.

WTF was that game plan? Well, whatever it was, it worked to give Michigan over 400 yards rushing…

My favorite part was when they put 5 in the box on a Michigan 3rd and long, which meant that all the Michigan line had to do was hold one-on-one blocks long enough for Corum to get by the line and he was off for a big gain and a first down. I had been reading some online PSU chatter ahead of the game about how they figured Manny Diaz would have a brilliant game plan to confuse first-year starter JJ McCarthy and create turnovers. They did get one INT on a batted ball that then doinked off a helmet and into a defender's hands, but Diaz was overall outmatched. It probably didn't help that while McCarthy is a nominal first-year starter, he was in his 7th game (6th as starter) and had gotten playing time in every game the prior year (including significant run in the playoff game against Georgia, albeit mostly after the game was largely decided).

The thing about Penn St this year is that they are absolutely loaded with talent, but dear lord do their schemes rely on having a physical advantage everywhere and winning every single one on one matchup on every single play.

Especially in the Running game. It’s why Clifford has to play hero ball so much, and why he gets injured every year (and why they could run the ball effectively against a lot of teams, but not Michigan).

I hate to "Well, actually . . . " you, but Well, actually . . . they have talent at the skill positions, but as is typical for PSU under Franklin their offensive line is terrible. Clifford gets battered weekly (reminds me a bit of Devin Gardner getting killed by those terrible Michigan O-lines under Hoke) and most of their running success is typically in spite of their line. They tend to have great backs that can make something out of nothing (the best of them was Saquon Barkley), and they rarely get past the line of scrimmage without contact. (Basically I agree with your second paragraph, but I think the talent is lacking on the line.) If PSU ever prioritizes recruiting and developing line play, they could be a juggernaut.

They may still beat Ohio St at home, their DB’s are really, really talented and can win those one on one battles if Ohio State doesn’t just run the ball down their throat too.

I think OSU is still just too damn good for PSU, but you're right that their strength on defense is their DBs. Michigan and Jim Harbaugh have no issues with taking short to medium passes and handing the ball off and forgetting about the deep ball (worked this week, and was even more impressive last year against Washington). OSU's offense wants more long passes to the WRs, which is what PSU wants. Unfortunately for PSU, the OSU WRs are probably at least as good as the PSU DBs and the rest of the OSU offense is still nothing to be trifled with.

This concludes today's edition of ILB talking out his ass about PSU's troubles based on watching them one game a year (against Michigan).

[Pyperkub]

IMHO, they have a very talented OL (and DL/LB corps), but their schemes and lack of a running attack that isn't dependent on OL 1v1 blocking and rarely generates a manpower advantage at the point of attack is a HUGE part of why Clifford has to play hero ball so much, and gets injured so much (it is also why play action is *really* effective against teams they have a physical advantage on, and worthless against the big boys). It also has the impact of making them very reliant on a home crowd to get better 1v1 performance.

But, that home field will help them v tOSU in getting maximum effort and winning more of those 1v1 matchups on both offense and defense, I think, and they do have some fantastic DBs who might be able to lock up OSU's WRs, esp with the home crowd fueling better effort on the DL in generating pressure. Clifford (if healthy) will probably still have to play some hero ball while also avoiding turnovers to have a chance tho, but I think that chance is far better than the chance they gave themselves at Michigan.

[ImLawBoy]

I admittedly get most of my info from Michigan based sources, but when I consistently see analysis like this

The OL has been PSU's Achilles heel on offense for years now. They return just two starters from last year, RT Caedan Wallace and Juice Scruggs, who has slid from G to C. Wallace is still the turnstile he was last year, while Scruggs has done pretty decently moving to a new position. All new starters Landon Tengwall and Sal Wormley at guard have held up alright thus far, but a quality of competition adjustment is likely needed. The same can be said for new LT Olumuyiwa Fashanu, who appears to be better than the black hole that was Rasheed Walker, but Michigan will be a different beast than what PSU has seen so far. The backup OT is Bryce Effner, sometimes coming on as a 6th OL in beef packages, but he is a trouble spot. Hunter Nourzad, Cornell transfer, is the backup IOL.

it makes me think that the talent just isn't there. Sure, it's good enough to play against bad defenses and the skill positions can bail them out against mediocre defenses, but they're just bad against decent or better defenses. I'm sure that has something to do with scheme and coaching, but they just don't seem to have the talent to play with the big boys.

[Pyperkub]

I admittedly get most of my info from Michigan based sources, but when I consistently see analysis like this

The OL has been PSU's Achilles heel on offense for years now. They return just two starters from last year, RT Caedan Wallace and Juice Scruggs, who has slid from G to C. Wallace is still the turnstile he was last year, while Scruggs has done pretty decently moving to a new position. All new starters Landon Tengwall and Sal Wormley at guard have held up alright thus far, but a quality of competition adjustment is likely needed. The same can be said for new LT Olumuyiwa Fashanu, who appears to be better than the black hole that was Rasheed Walker, but Michigan will be a different beast than what PSU has seen so far. The backup OT is Bryce Effner, sometimes coming on as a 6th OL in beef packages, but he is a trouble spot. Hunter Nourzad, Cornell transfer, is the backup IOL.

it makes me think that the talent just isn't there. Sure, it's good enough to play against bad defenses and the skill positions can bail them out against mediocre defenses, but they're just bad against decent or better defenses. I'm sure that has something to do with scheme and coaching, but they just don't seem to have the talent to play with the big boys.

Maybe, but when I've watched them, what I see is individual talent which isn't coached/schemed well and does really well with a physical advantange, and poorly w/o. And that if UCLA had those guys, they would be better than what we've cobbled together (transfers and DL switches to OL just about every year, and lost both tackle starters last year). Funny thing is that those DL switches (if they don't transfer) usually excel.

Not too much info on OL specific recruiting, but I did see this:

There's no denying, though, that Trautwein is crushing it with regards to recruiting. And as long as Penn State is getting good recruits, there will always be hope that things can improve dramatically on the O-line in the coming years.

[Pyperkub]

Horrible News out of Starkville today:

"The Mississippi State Athletics Family is heartbroken by the sudden death of Sam Westmoreland," Bulldogs coach Mike Leach said in a statement. "Sam was a beloved son, brother and teammate, and a tremendous young man with a limitless future. He will always be remembered and deeply missed by everyone who knew and loved him. The entire MSU Family mourns as our thoughts and prayers go out to the Westmoreland family. Our highest priority is the support of the Westmoreland family and our student-athletes during this troubling time."

Mississippi State said that the Oktibbeha County Sheriff's Office and the office of the county medical examiner and coroner are gathering information on Westmoreland's death.

[ImLawBoy]

Not too much info on OL specific recruiting, but I did see this:

There's no denying, though, that Trautwein is crushing it with regards to recruiting. And as long as Penn State is getting good recruits, there will always be hope that things can improve dramatically on the O-line in the coming years.

Well, they don't have room to move down. That article seems to confirm that the O-Line has been a problem spot for years. I don't know the details, but when your big get is a transfer from an Ivy League school, that doesn't fill me with confidence that the recruiting issues are going to be solved.

[Pyperkub]

Bruins didn't have a good game in Autzen, but I didn't really expect one. Under Kelly, we always seem to take a step backwards after a bye, and Oregon is really good (now). I think we may see that match again in the Vegas championship. The defense needs to get better tho, there were a lot of busted coverages and the dl did not do their job at holding the edge and keeping blockers off of our lbs.

[Hyena]

Hardly ever see my Horned Frogs mentioned on here, but having beaten 4 "ranked" teams in a row (can we really consider OU worthy of that status?) I'd like to think we are a legit contender for the Big XII title. This year more than ever the conference seems to have as much parity as any I've seen. Heck, even KU started 5-0 for the first time in over a decade and more. No divisions has always been our Achilles' heel, however, because all we do is beat up on each other in basically a round robin tournament and knock each other out of the rankings. In a perfect world it's cool, but in reality it only allows one or two teams to come out relatively unscathed (meaning 3 or less losses) while the SEC and B1G can beat up on the fodder of their divisions.

In either case, I'm excited to play WV next week before we move on to some of the more grudge matches in the conference.

[Skinypupy]

Hardly ever see my Horned Frogs mentioned on here,

I refuse to acknowledge TCU’s existence, mostly because I still hate them for kicking our ass so many times back in the Mountain West days.

(Snark aside, I like seeing them doing well again.)

[Pyperkub]

Hardly ever see my Horned Frogs mentioned on here, but having beaten 4 "ranked" teams in a row (can we really consider OU worthy of that status?) I'd like to think we are a legit contender for the Big XII title. This year more than ever the conference seems to have as much parity as any I've seen. Heck, even KU started 5-0 for the first time in over a decade and more. No divisions has always been our Achilles' heel, however, because all we do is beat up on each other in basically a round robin tournament and knock each other out of the rankings. In a perfect world it's cool, but in reality it only allows one or two teams to come out relatively unscathed (meaning 3 or less losses) while the SEC and B1G can beat up on the fodder of their divisions.

In either case, I'm excited to play WV next week before we move on to some of the more grudge matches in the conference.

My one concern with TCU is that they have played all their really tough games at home (considering Kansas is backsliding). @WVU @TX @ Baylor all loom large there... but, as with UCLA, it has been a darned good season thus far!

[Hyena]

Hardly ever see my Horned Frogs mentioned on here,

I refuse to acknowledge TCU’s existence, mostly because I still hate them for kicking our ass so many times back in the Mountain West days.

(Snark aside, I like seeing them doing well again.)

HAHAHAHA Yeah, that was definitely the case with us being a "big fish in a little pond" syndrome. We thought we were big and bad until we went to the Big XII and got brutalized for a few years. Quite the humbling experience, that's for sure.

I tell you what, though...that 2009 Utah game in Fort Worth (even though it was a tough game for you guys) was one of the most electric games I've ever been at. I don't think I've ever heard a roar like that before or since in the Carter.

I still wish we'd have picked up you guys instead of Cinci as add-ons to the XII. As well as just about anyone else instead of Houston and BYU...

[Hyena]

Hardly ever see my Horned Frogs mentioned on here, but having beaten 4 "ranked" teams in a row (can we really consider OU worthy of that status?) I'd like to think we are a legit contender for the Big XII title. This year more than ever the conference seems to have as much parity as any I've seen. Heck, even KU started 5-0 for the first time in over a decade and more. No divisions has always been our Achilles' heel, however, because all we do is beat up on each other in basically a round robin tournament and knock each other out of the rankings. In a perfect world it's cool, but in reality it only allows one or two teams to come out relatively unscathed (meaning 3 or less losses) while the SEC and B1G can beat up on the fodder of their divisions.

In either case, I'm excited to play WV next week before we move on to some of the more grudge matches in the conference.

My one concern with TCU is that they have played all their really tough games at home (considering Kansas is backsliding). @WVU @TX @ Baylor all loom large there... but, as with UCLA, it has been a darned good season thus far!

Absolutely true. And the fact that our former head coach of 21 years is now a defensive analyst for UT, I *know* they've had that game circled on the calendar. Knowing him, he's been burning the candle at both ends trying to figure out how he's going to break us. As for Baylor, most of the animosity is gone since Briles left, but that is still a rivalry that looms LARGE in our heads.

I don't think we'll be looking past WVU, but it certainly has all the hallmarks of a trap game for sure.

[Skinypupy]

Hardly ever see my Horned Frogs mentioned on here,

I refuse to acknowledge TCU’s existence, mostly because I still hate them for kicking our ass so many times back in the Mountain West days.

(Snark aside, I like seeing them doing well again.)

HAHAHAHA Yeah, that was definitely the case with us being a "big fish in a little pond" syndrome. We thought we were big and bad until we went to the Big XII and got brutalized for a few years. Quite the humbling experience, that's for sure.

I tell you what, though...that 2009 Utah game in Fort Worth (even though it was a tough game for you guys) was one of the most electric games I've ever been at. I don't think I've ever heard a roar like that before or since in the Carter.

I still wish we'd have picked up you guys instead of Cinci as add-ons to the XII. As well as just about anyone else instead of Houston and BYU...

The 2008 night game in Salt Lake was - up until last weekend’s game against USC - the loudest sporting event I’d like ver been to. That game was absolute madness.

The most painful TCU memory was the 2010 game. GameDay came that morning and Rice Eccles was absolutely insane…for about the first 10 minutes. After that, the beat down was on. I think we lost something like 42-10 to the Frogs that day. It was awful.

The year-in, year-out TCU/BYU/Utah battles for the top of the MWC were always fun. I kinda miss those days.

[Pyperkub]

Hardly ever see my Horned Frogs mentioned on here, but having beaten 4 "ranked" teams in a row (can we really consider OU worthy of that status?) I'd like to think we are a legit contender for the Big XII title. This year more than ever the conference seems to have as much parity as any I've seen. Heck, even KU started 5-0 for the first time in over a decade and more. No divisions has always been our Achilles' heel, however, because all we do is beat up on each other in basically a round robin tournament and knock each other out of the rankings. In a perfect world it's cool, but in reality it only allows one or two teams to come out relatively unscathed (meaning 3 or less losses) while the SEC and B1G can beat up on the fodder of their divisions.

In either case, I'm excited to play WV next week before we move on to some of the more grudge matches in the conference.

My one concern with TCU is that they have played all their really tough games at home (considering Kansas is backsliding). @WVU @TX @ Baylor all loom large there... but, as with UCLA, it has been a darned good season thus far!

Absolutely true. And the fact that our former head coach of 21 years is now a defensive analyst for UT, I *know* they've had that game circled on the calendar. Knowing him, he's been burning the candle at both ends trying to figure out how he's going to break us. As for Baylor, most of the animosity is gone since Briles left, but that is still a rivalry that looms LARGE in our heads.

I don't think we'll be looking past WVU, but it certainly has all the hallmarks of a trap game for sure.

Side note, I wouldn't trust Sonny Dykes in two ways.

1) He doesn't really care about defense - what will happen when the current (inherited) defensive players move on?
2) He had a *serious* wandering eye while at Cal. Not sure about while at SMU. If he does well, I fully expect him to try to leap to another school.

[Hyena]

Hardly ever see my Horned Frogs mentioned on here, but having beaten 4 "ranked" teams in a row (can we really consider OU worthy of that status?) I'd like to think we are a legit contender for the Big XII title. This year more than ever the conference seems to have as much parity as any I've seen. Heck, even KU started 5-0 for the first time in over a decade and more. No divisions has always been our Achilles' heel, however, because all we do is beat up on each other in basically a round robin tournament and knock each other out of the rankings. In a perfect world it's cool, but in reality it only allows one or two teams to come out relatively unscathed (meaning 3 or less losses) while the SEC and B1G can beat up on the fodder of their divisions.

In either case, I'm excited to play WV next week before we move on to some of the more grudge matches in the conference.

My one concern with TCU is that they have played all their really tough games at home (considering Kansas is backsliding). @WVU @TX @ Baylor all loom large there... but, as with UCLA, it has been a darned good season thus far!

Absolutely true. And the fact that our former head coach of 21 years is now a defensive analyst for UT, I *know* they've had that game circled on the calendar. Knowing him, he's been burning the candle at both ends trying to figure out how he's going to break us. As for Baylor, most of the animosity is gone since Briles left, but that is still a rivalry that looms LARGE in our heads.

I don't think we'll be looking past WVU, but it certainly has all the hallmarks of a trap game for sure.

Side note, I wouldn't trust Sonny Dykes in two ways.

1) He doesn't really care about defense - what will happen when the current (inherited) defensive players move on?
2) He had a *serious* wandering eye while at Cal. Not sure about while at SMU. If he does well, I fully expect him to try to leap to another school.

1) I can see the struggles with defense, but he very specifically went out and brought in the DC from Tulsa because "it was such a pain to play against." We also haven't fully recruited for the 3-3-5, and we are still operating with the 4-2-5 personnel from last year, so some of the puzzle pieces have been smashed into place where they don't really fit. But having dealt with Patterson and his defense-first mindset for 20 years, it's pretty amazing to be putting up the offensive numbers we are with 90% of the same kids from last year. To me that speaks volumes about how he didn't really care to develop the offensive kids. In fact, there were several times in recent years where it was painfully obvious that he was making game decisions based on trying to limit the number of snaps for his defense so their numbers would look better. The man hated it when the offensive numbers outshone his defenses...

2) I think there certainly was the wandering eye thing at Cal. He is a Texas boy, and he desperately wanted to get back here. At SMU, there are SO many issues that he had to deal with, namely the boosters and donors that think they know better than the coach. Very similar issues to what goes on over at UT. At TCU, where he was actually an offensive analyst for a year back in 2017, he enjoyed it but felt a bit underutilized (see above regarding Patterson). Now that he has the reigns, I think he's happy where he is. Am I saying that he's going to be here for the next 15 years? No, he doesn't have that much gas left in the tank I don't think. But if he stays even for half that time and build this program, I feel that whomever we hire next will continue to build (or at least maintain) it.

All that being said, I know we are an anomaly and most likely won't sustain this level of play. We are a small, barely 10k student body private university competing against juggernauts. But for now I'm happy.

[JCC]

The Big 12 is by far the most fun conference this year, because they are almost all pretty good and none of them are elite. I have no doubt that TCU (or whoever we think the big 12 champ will ultimately be) would almost certainly lose on a neutral field to the top 5 or so teams in CFB. But, the big 12 has a bunch of OK to very good teams, which makes almost all their games fun to watch. And if TCU runs the table, (I doubt they will) they'll get the chance to prove me wrong.

After a whirlwind of weeks with marquee matchups, this weekend is a little less appetizing with only 3 top 25 matchups (one each for noon, mid afternoon, and evening time slots). I highly doubt the noon game will be competitive but prove me wrong PSU and I will be delighted! Hopefully this will be a weekend filled with teams with a number next to their name losing to a team without one. Those are fun as hell. Sad we are already halfway done. Fall Saturdays always fly by.

[Hyena]

The Big 12 is by far the most fun conference this year, because they are almost all pretty good and none of them are elite. I have no doubt that TCU (or whoever we think the big 12 champ will ultimately be) would almost certainly lose on a neutral field to the top 5 or so teams in CFB. But, the big 12 has a bunch of OK to very good teams, which makes almost all their games fun to watch. And if TCU runs the table, (I doubt they will) they'll get the chance to prove me wrong.

After a whirlwind of weeks with marquee matchups, this weekend is a little less appetizing with only 3 top 25 matchups (one each for noon, mid afternoon, and evening time slots). I highly doubt the noon game will be competitive but prove me wrong PSU and I will be delighted! Hopefully this will be a weekend filled with teams with a number next to their name losing to a team without one. Those are fun as hell. Sad we are already halfway done. Fall Saturdays always fly by.

Let's hope they do!

(Prove you wrong, that is...)

[JCC]

Let's hope they do!

(Prove you wrong, that is...)

If they do, I will probably enjoy it nearly as much as their fans will. haha

[Pyperkub]

Skiny, I just turned the game on, what happened to Rising?

[Pyperkub]

Not much real news but

https://www.johncanzano.com/p/canzano-p ... ain-on-cam

[Jaymann]

Looks like Penn State plus 15.5 was a good bet. Just barely though.

[Pyperkub]

Looks like Penn State plus 15.5 was a good bet. Just barely though.

They blew that game. Down 30-24, Ohio state 3rd and 10, and Penn state played soft, free first down defense instead of tight coverage with safeties over the top.

Ohio state gets the first down and game over

[Hyena]

8-0...now comes the hard part. Tech, UT, Baylor, and ISU will be a challenging finish for us. Not TOO concerned about Tech, but UT and Baylor always play us hard because of the animosity (especially the aforementioned Patterson now working for UT). I also think some of the shine has worn off Campbell over at ISU, but they are also pretty tough on defense.

Not looking forward to re-matching back up to either OSU or KSU in the championship, if that's where it goes, however...

[LordMortis]

In local big rivalry news...

Tucker is speaking time about MSU players jumping UofM player(s) in the tunnel...

Tucker reporting suspended players will be kept from the program...


https://www.elevenwarriors.com/college- ... ium-tunnel

https://www.cbsnews.com/detroit/news/mi ... nel-fight/


The Big House really needs separate tunnels.

To the moment four players suspended


UofM consider it an police matter, not a university matter and one of the assaulted players is being reported as going to press charges.

[ImLawBoy]

So, the Michigan-Michigan State game wasn't all that eventful - until it was over.

As expected, Michigan won rather handily 29-7. It could have been a lot worse, but MSU's defense is good at one thing - goal line stands. Michigan settled for some field goals when it would have been nice to punch it in. Michigan is showing that they're all in on the power running game, and having a mobile QB is really helping that. I'd like to see us show more downfield passing, and I still kind of hope that we're just sitting on that waiting to bust it out when needed, but so far the philosophy of grinding the ball down the field, wearing out the opponent D, and finishing strong in the second half seems to be working. I'm nervous about what might happen against a high powered offense that puts up a couple of quick scores, though.

After the game, wow. Some MSU players attacked a couple of Michigan players in the tunnel, and I don't care what the provocation is - that was completely unconscionable. One incident appeared to be about 10-1 MSU players beating down a Michigan player and another incident showed an MSU player swinging a helmet as a weapon against a Michigan player. MSU has already suspended 4 players, and I wouldn't be surprised if more suspensions are coming as they further ID those involved. There are also reports that criminal charges might be forthcoming, but I don't know how much of that is legitimate vs. internet bluster.

One thing that this incident has really highlighted for me is just how toxic online sports fandom is. There are some real fun sports Twitter accounts to follow, but even good natured rivalry banter gets drowned out by vitriol. I live in the city that is a magnet for Big 10 graduates, but I've never had any issues in real-world encounters with fans or alumni from OSU or MSU or any other Big 10 school. We joke a little bit about someone wearing the wrong colors, but it's friendly. I've been to Michigan football games at Illinois and Iowa and never had any issues with opposing fanbases. I've seen the Cubs play in a number of venues, and outside of St. Louis I've never had any issues (and even there is was just one time). If I tweeted a Go Blue, though, I'd probably be beset by trolls wishing harm on me and my family.

Right now, Online Sparty has too many people victim blaming, and Online Michigan has people wanting MSU locked up and taken off the schedule. Sports are supposed to be fun, people! Have fun with it!

[ImLawBoy]

The Big House really needs separate tunnels.

There's been one tunnel for almost 100 years without issue. Now Penn State players threw their PB&J sandwiches at Michigan players and a few Spartans went rogue. It's not the tunnel - it's 2 incidents in close proximity to each other. What they need to do (and what I suspect they'll do) is do a better job of enforcing separate entry and exit times.

[LordMortis]

The Big House really needs separate tunnels.

There's been one tunnel for almost 100 years without issue. Now Penn State players threw their PB&J sandwiches at Michigan players and a few Spartans went rogue. It's not the tunnel - it's 2 incidents in close proximity to each other. What they need to do (and what I suspect they'll do) is do a better job of enforcing separate entry and exit times.

Three...

[ImLawBoy]

That wasn't an incident. That was players chirping at each other with nothing thrown (neither sandwiches nor punches). Again, it's nothing that enforcing the buffer between the teams couldn't resolve without requiring a new construction project.

[Pyperkub]

Harsin fired at Auburn:

Auburn fires Bryan Harsin: Tigers end awkward, unsuccessful tenure of second-year coach

[Daehawk]

As awful as TN Vols have been over the last couple decades they are now back to ranking #1 again. Haven't seen that since 1998.

LINK

1. Tennessee
2. Ohio State
3. Georgia
4. Clemson
5. Michigan
6. Alabama
7. TCU
8. Oregon
9. USC
10. LSU
11. Ole Miss
12. UCLA
13. Kansas State
14. Utah
15. Penn State
16. Illinois
17. North Carolina
18. Oklahoma State
19. Tulane
20. Syracuse
21. Wake Forest
22. NC State
23. Oregon State
24. Texas
25. UCF

[ImLawBoy]

Four more Spartans suspended, included Windmon, who is probably their best defensive player. I suspect that will be it for the suspensions, so it's really just a matter of whether any criminal charges are brought. One of the injured players (Gemon Green) has hired a big shot attorney (last seen in Michigan circles fighting the NCAA to get Shea Patterson immediate eligibility when he transferred) so I imagine there will be some sort of civil action as well. Green is supposedly "pressing" charges, but it's still up to the prosecutors to make any charging decisions.

As for the first poll, I'm not too shocked to see Michigan at 5. While I suspect we're better than Clemson (and most of the fancy stats would agree), this is probably a punishment for having one of the worst non-conference schedules for a Power 5 team that I can recall seeing.

[JCC]

There is almost nothing in CFB less relevant than these weekly playoff polls. It is nothing more than a bad TV commercial for CFB. Completely meaningless.

[Hyena]

There is almost nothing in CFB less relevant than these weekly playoff polls. It is nothing more than a bad TV commercial for CFB. Completely meaningless.

It is nothing more than a big pot to stir up "controversy and discussion" over who was snubbed and who snuck in. Unless you're one of the 6 teams in the top, then of course it's absolutely justified and unimpeachable...

[ImLawBoy]

The poll releases do what they're supposed to do - generate additional discussion about college football. They have a little bit of value in letting the teams ranked 10-20 know what they need to do in order to get in (although that value is also pretty silly since the answer is "win out and hope for the best"). Mostly, though, it's to generate headlines, coverage, and discussion.

[Pyperkub]

The poll releases do what they're supposed to do - generate additional discussion about college football. They have a little bit of value in letting the teams ranked 10-20 know what they need to do in order to get in (although that value is also pretty silly since the answer is "win out and hope for the best"). Mostly, though, it's to generate headlines, coverage, and discussion.

The other thing is that they do serve as a reset for the AP Poll, which has a disturbing bias towards those it had ranked early in the season, and ends up with most voters NOT following the AP poll guidelines:

Base your vote on performance, not reputation or preseason speculation.

Avoid regional bias, for or against. Your local team does not deserve any special handling when it comes to your ballot.

Pay attention to head-to-head results and don’t hesitate to make significant changes in your ballot from week to week. There’s no rule against jumping the 16th-ranked team over the eighth-ranked team, if No. 16 is coming off a big victory and No. 8 just lost 52-6 to a so-so team.

So, in the reset, Tenn and Georgia swapped places as well as Clemson and Michigan.

I'd probably have TCU ahead of Michigan too, at least while TCU is unbeaten and until Michigan plays at tOSU (Michigan has played a weak schedule with only 2 road games - at Iowa/Indiana). I do think LSU is a bit high, but I'm ok with UCLA around where we're at - we don't have a quality road win, and even if we run the table, we still are unlikely to have one, BUT, we get USC at home, and if we win that (and the other games we should win), we get a (probable) rematch with Oregon, but at a neutral site and not at Autzen. Oregon would have to lose two games to fall out of the pac-12, and I only see them having trouble in 1 (at Oregon St - they should be able to handle Utah and UW at home).

[ImLawBoy]

I'd probably have TCU ahead of Michigan too, at least while TCU is unbeaten and until Michigan plays at tOSU (Michigan has played a weak schedule with only 2 road games - at Iowa/Indiana).

Is it based on performance or not? I acknowledge that Michigan hasn't played a strong schedule, but if you look at all the fancy stats (most of which account for strength of opponent), Michigan is clearly in the top tier with OSU, UGA, and Tenn. Now, I'm not concerned about them being ranked 5 at this point (and I wouldn't even be concerned about being ranked behind TCU in reality) because if Michigan wins out we're in. If we don't, we're not (I'm not buying 2 Big Ten teams given the overall weakness of the conference this year; although it could be interesting if Michigan beat OSU but lost to Illinois in either the regular season or the Big Ten championship game). I guess my point is, if you're ranking on deserve (which could include strength of schedule) I could see you putting Clemson and TCU ahead of Michigan. If you're ranking on who is better, most objective sources (and this highly biased one) would put Michigan ahead. The playoff committee is supposed to take deserve into account to some extent. I think the AP is supposed to just consider who is better.

(See folks, this is the kind of discussion the poll reveals are supposed to encourage. They're working!)

[Pyperkub]

I'd probably have TCU ahead of Michigan too, at least while TCU is unbeaten and until Michigan plays at tOSU (Michigan has played a weak schedule with only 2 road games - at Iowa/Indiana).

Is it based on performance or not? I acknowledge that Michigan hasn't played a strong schedule, but if you look at all the fancy stats (most of which account for strength of opponent), Michigan is clearly in the top tier with OSU, UGA, and Tenn. Now, I'm not concerned about them being ranked 5 at this point (and I wouldn't even be concerned about being ranked behind TCU in reality) because if Michigan wins out we're in. If we don't, we're not (I'm not buying 2 Big Ten teams given the overall weakness of the conference this year; although it could be interesting if Michigan beat OSU but lost to Illinois in either the regular season or the Big Ten championship game). I guess my point is, if you're ranking on deserve (which could include strength of schedule) I could see you putting Clemson and TCU ahead of Michigan. If you're ranking on who is better, most objective sources (and this highly biased one) would put Michigan ahead. The playoff committee is supposed to take deserve into account to some extent. I think the AP is supposed to just consider who is better.

(See folks, this is the kind of discussion the poll reveals are supposed to encourage. They're working!)

Performance? Yeah, but I do think that beating Okie St and Kansas St at home is better than Penn St at home. TCU also has 4 road wins vs 2 for Michigan (and as you well know, that's a huge factor in my "performance" book )

That said, if either or both TCU/Michigan are undefeated at the end of the season, they jump an undefeated Clemson easy (and yeah, I do think Michigan has a better chance of being undefeated at the end than TCU).

And, as indicated, it's why I don't have a problem with UCLA being 12th for now. We'll get our chance, and if we do as well as I expect, we should be one of the top 1-loss teams by the end (given that we'll have beaten USC and avenged our only loss of the season... if we can - and I think we have a good shot).

[Hyena]

I'd probably have TCU ahead of Michigan too, at least while TCU is unbeaten and until Michigan plays at tOSU (Michigan has played a weak schedule with only 2 road games - at Iowa/Indiana).

Is it based on performance or not? I acknowledge that Michigan hasn't played a strong schedule, but if you look at all the fancy stats (most of which account for strength of opponent), Michigan is clearly in the top tier with OSU, UGA, and Tenn. Now, I'm not concerned about them being ranked 5 at this point (and I wouldn't even be concerned about being ranked behind TCU in reality) because if Michigan wins out we're in. If we don't, we're not (I'm not buying 2 Big Ten teams given the overall weakness of the conference this year; although it could be interesting if Michigan beat OSU but lost to Illinois in either the regular season or the Big Ten championship game). I guess my point is, if you're ranking on deserve (which could include strength of schedule) I could see you putting Clemson and TCU ahead of Michigan. If you're ranking on who is better, most objective sources (and this highly biased one) would put Michigan ahead. The playoff committee is supposed to take deserve into account to some extent. I think the AP is supposed to just consider who is better.

(See folks, this is the kind of discussion the poll reveals are supposed to encourage. They're working!)

I would LOVE to see a TCU v. Michigan game, myself. I'm not sure we could beat y'all, but I think it would be one helluva matchup between the #4 offense in the country vs. the #3 defense. I think your #22 offense would be able to put up points on us willy-nilly (until the second half, at least, when our DC wakes up from his nap), but I think we'd get our fair share of points in, too. It would be a fun watch, that's for certain.