Holman wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 4:59 pm
Perhaps a stupid question: would it do any good to apply three or four thick coats of paint to every wall and floor in the apartment? Paint it very thick as a sealant from the space below? Or is there perhaps a sealant (better than paint) actually designed for this purpose?
Or is mold too smart for that?
Our townhouse is in a very humid area, and we used a mold resistant primer for the base coat of all our walls. We also had an in-wall shower leak which eventually led us to remodelling the downstairs (3 bedrooms, 2 baths, walk in closet plus other closets). We replaced the 25 year old carpet with engineered hardwood which really helped with regards to the carpets picking up anything and everything. We also had Servpro come out and both establish the baseline mold/mildew/etc readings. the readings went way down, but on the good news side, even the initial Servpro report didn't indicate any toxic mold, just standard, allergenic stuff.
part of the problem (besides the shower wall leak which required tile demo and new setup) was also that the shower humidity vents for the fans were just terminated in the crawlspace under the unit, and making everything more humid. Had to get those rerouted to outside the unit/a better ventilated crawlspace area with 10x the volume.
None of that is stuff Blackhawk can do, but the landlord at some point may need to.
Black Lives definitely Matter Lorini!
Also: There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
There was no plan save for 'get budget fixed before it happens.' What little I did have in mind got derailed when first, Michelle moved back in, and second, when my oldest ended up being unable to move out on his own.
Blackhawk wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 6:28 pm
We genuinely couldn't downsize much, (we have zero free space), and even studios here cost more than our current rent.
You aren't in a habitable living space. Don't use your current rent as a baseline. I get that it's your max budget but the current situation isn't livable.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General "No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton MYT
Blackhawk wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 7:26 pm
... and second, when my oldest ended up being unable to move out on his own.
Will your youngest be able to move out on his own? Could your oldest live in a group home type setting? Near here there are several independence based living facilities that are charity based. Some offer work experience as well.
Blackhawk wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 7:26 pm
... and second, when my oldest ended up being unable to move out on his own.
Will your youngest be able to move out on his own? Could your oldest live in a group home type setting? Near here there are several independence based living facilities that are charity based. Some offer work experience as well.
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 8:14 pm
You aren't in a habitable living space. Don't use your current rent as a baseline. I get that it's your max budget but the current situation isn't livable.
Isn't that a catch-22? "I know you can't spend more, but spend more."
Paint has to stick to something. Mold is not an acceptable primer.
"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein "I don't stand by anything." - Trump “Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing.” - John Stuart Mill, Inaugural Address Delivered to the University of St Andrews, 2/1/1867 “It is the impractical things in this tumultuous hell-scape of a world that matter most. A book, a name, chicken soup. They help us remember that, even in our darkest hour, life is still to be savored.” - Poe, Altered Carbon
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 8:14 pm
You aren't in a habitable living space. Don't use your current rent as a baseline. I get that it's your max budget but the current situation isn't livable.
Isn't that a catch-22? "I know you can't spend more, but spend more."
Not really. It's more "your current rent is artificially low, probably due to a landlord that spends zero on maintenance and upkeep. You have to get a smaller space to stay in budget." Or spend a lot of time looking and get very lucky.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General "No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton MYT
It looks like several Indiana county Section 8 HUD waiting lists come open in August. Get on a list, you can always choose not to move.
Try your local Habitat for Humanity. There are inexpensive homes in your area that would cost about $500/month. Even if the place isn't in good condition, it's not filled with mold. The hurdle is financing and down payment, so you would need an organization to help you rent to own or secure a loan. But those programs exist.
"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein "I don't stand by anything." - Trump “Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing.” - John Stuart Mill, Inaugural Address Delivered to the University of St Andrews, 2/1/1867 “It is the impractical things in this tumultuous hell-scape of a world that matter most. A book, a name, chicken soup. They help us remember that, even in our darkest hour, life is still to be savored.” - Poe, Altered Carbon
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 12:29 am
It's more "your current rent is artificially low, probably due to a landlord that spends zero on maintenance and upkeep. You have to get a smaller space to stay in budget."
funnily enough.. i happen to know two people in almost this exact same situation. suuuuper low rent, but there was mold _everywhere_ and one of them was having a lot of health problems. nothing could ever be done, because the property owner did nothing to ever fix anything in the property (just the stairs to the upper portion of the house by itself was a horrific accident in waiting). that place was recently sold off and they were kicked out. they were in terrible fear they wouldn't be able to find anything priced like it again, but somehow managed to find a reasonably decent place _within Seattle city limits_!
I'm so sorry, Blackhawk. This is a terrible, rotten situation, and one that's ultimately going to enforce extreme change on your family. Sadly, it sounds like everyone of those changes is going to be a life downgrade for you and your family, be it economic, familial, or health. (Or all three.) You don't deserve to be going through this, but when has "deserve" been part of life's calculus.
Assuming the issue is as has been presented to you, of course.
When leaning towards trade-offs, I tend towards focusing on health above the others, but I'm in a privileged position where I get those levels of options. It's difficult, if not impossible, for me to mentally put myself truly in your shoes. I hate to give advice as none of it is what you'll want to hear because in reality, everything is a downgrade. Right now you're living the slowly-killing-everyone-in-your-house (and the slowly part is actually "hopefully slowly"). From my I-can't-be-in-your-shoes perspective that would mean major life upheaval ASAP. Likely that's the perspective of many responses above as well.
So let me just provide sympathy and non-judgement for how you deal with your situation. I wish you and your family all the best. Sadly, it's clear the direction things will be going for your current lifestyle.
"Better to talk to people than communicate via tweet." — Elontra
The Meal wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 7:35 am
I'm so sorry, Blackhawk. This is a terrible, rotten situation, and one that's ultimately going to enforce extreme change on your family. Sadly, it sounds like everyone of those changes is going to be a life downgrade for you and your family, be it economic, familial, or health. (Or all three.) You don't deserve to be going through this, but when has "deserve" been part of life's calculus.
Assuming the issue is as has been presented to you, of course.
When leaning towards trade-offs, I tend towards focusing on health above the others, but I'm in a privileged position where I get those levels of options. It's difficult, if not impossible, for me to mentally put myself truly in your shoes. I hate to give advice as none of it is what you'll want to hear because in reality, everything is a downgrade. Right now you're living the slowly-killing-everyone-in-your-house (and the slowly part is actually "hopefully slowly"). From my I-can't-be-in-your-shoes perspective that would mean major life upheaval ASAP. Likely that's the perspective of many responses above as well.
So let me just provide sympathy and non-judgement for how you deal with your situation. I wish you and your family all the best. Sadly, it's clear the direction things will be going for your current lifestyle.
Exceptionally well said.
FWIW, I certainly sympathize but I tend to switch to problem solving mode to the exclusion of all else. Probably survival instincts after 25+ years of solving peoples' healthcare financial/coverage crises. Know that somewhere in the depths my black heart aches for this bullshit you're going through.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General "No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton MYT
BH I think we' need to host a BH/DH telethon on PBS Every 5th donor gets a free chunk of our lovely homes.
--------------------------------------------
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake. http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
This is a general response, not pointed at any particular person:
I was asking more for advice in regards to my options within my limitations. I'm not someone who is so set in their ways that they're unwilling to look at alternatives or possibilities. I'm not someone who is unwilling to change my lifestyle to solve a serious problem. I have been trying to find a way out of this house for *15 years*. I was desperate to move before I found out about this. I have searched, looked at options, and talked to people. This house is awful, and I want out.
~Due to (as I mentioned earlier) a couple of periods of severely reduced income, we had to pay living expenses on my credit card a few years ago. The fees for the resulting balance are considerable, and have kept us from really making much progress on it until recently, leaving us with about $12,000 unpaid. This is a single card, not multiples. Prior to that time I'd maintained a zero balance for years, paying off every penny I put on it every month. But it was an emergency, and there wasn't any other option.
~We do not qualify for HUD/Section 8. I have absolutely had it in the past. In fact, when I moved into this apartment in 2003 (before my disability was approved), it was with a voucher. Our combined income are too much to qualify for benefits. It's the same story with other support/benefit options. This isn't being negative, this is stuff we've checked.
~Our debt is the biggest factor - they don't account for it in benefit calculations, just total income, but our debt reduces our effective income to the point that we can't afford other options.
~We can't leave the immediate area (not that there are any areas that are cheaper) due to an elderly relative that relies on us for daily support (and yes, we've checked into alternative for that, too.)
~We have no other friends and family nearby that we can move in with. Zero. Most of my immediate family is either on the opposite side of the country, or is dead, and her family is much smaller than mine ever was.
~And I'm not exactly accusing anyone of richsplaining, but "just spend more" isn't how it works. I'm already spending the most I can spend. If I have a $100 bill and $100 in expenses, there is no possibility of increasing spending to $150, no matter how badly I want to.
~It isn't a matter of downgrading lifestyle. Even if I moved all four of us into a studio (if I could even find a studio that would allow four adults to rent it - most won't - most one-bedroom apartments won't, either), the rent would be considerably more than what I'm paying. I have checked. Repeatedly. On top of that, we'd have to pay rent for a storage unit for most of our stuff, and this is after a full-house purge that involved dozens of bags of trash, trips to the dump, and more trips to Goodwill than I can remember. To be absolutely clear: our two bedroom costs less that a studio. Moving to a studio is trying to pay $150 with a $100 bill.
~We have already reduced our expenses over the past few years. We've cut every bill we can to the minimums, negotiated to reduce monthly payments (we just cut our internet bill by a third last month), cut extraneous expenses (subscription services, etc.) I keep a budget, and am aware of every dime spent. We've even cut food costs to $50 per week per person, which isn't easy while inflation is doing it's dance. We could probably reduce things a bit more if we cut out every luxury and reduced the family to reading books from the library, but we've already stopped so many expenses that even that wouldn't be a fraction of the extra rent.
~I don't live in the 1960s - I'm not the Family Patriarch, the All Powerful Master of my home. Choices that I might make for myself can't just be forced on the rest of the family. They have to be convinced, and - just being honest here - I will not convince them of the level of downgrade that would be required. We'd be talking four people sleeping on the floor of a single room eating rice and peanut butter with no paid luxuries for at least a year or two. Like I said, I might make that choice for myself (and I spent plenty of time living like that growing up), but there is no mechanism that will convince the rest of the family I'm not just being an alarmist. Hell, I can't even convince one member to wear a mask in crowded public buildings despite the data.
Realistic solutions toward the goal of moving:
~Keep things cut to the bone. If we dump every dime beyond expenses into our debt, we'll be clear in three or four years.
~Stop making the remaining bad financial decisions that we still make - the occasional impulse buy "_____ is having a really bad week, I'll do something nice for them", "I really need a _____, and it isn't really that much..." and put that onto the debt as well. If we can do that, we really will be living at near minimums.
~Get the debt paid off, increasing our effective income enough to afford to move.
~Increase income. This is one thing that we're actively pursuing, but best case there would just shave a year off of the time it would take us to repay the card. We're still pushing this one, but it's not a sure thing.
~There is one 'nuclear' option I can think of that would get us out of this house sooner - file for bankruptcy. But there is absolutely a way out of my current debt without that within the next few years (and a sizeable chunk of my total debt is student loans that aren't a current expense at all.) I'm months from 50, and it would tank my credit so far that I'd be elderly before it recovered. It would close so many doors and eliminate most of the few hopes I have for the near future that I don't want to go that extreme. And hell, it would be even harder to find a place to rent after doing so.
The main issue is that there is a potential, imminent health threat. Any mitigation will cost you money (or force you to move out). Inaction can have a dearer cost. Unstoppable force vs. immovable object. You absolutely have to get clearer picture of the mold situation, preferably much sooner than a month. This is probably priority #1.
Blackhawk wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 9:59 am
~Stop making the remaining bad financial decisions that we still make - the occasional impulse buy "_____ is having a really bad week, I'll do something nice for them", "I really need a _____, and it isn't really that much..." and put that onto the debt as well. If we can do that, we really will be living at near minimums.
Lock your credit card. A lock on the card is temporary and can be turned off and back on in case of necessary/emergency purchases. It is an extra step to guard against the impulse buys. It shouldn't affect any recurring charges/subscriptions.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General "No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton MYT
I speak from experience on this. We had an inspector come out and they found significant mold throughout the house. Some contractors removed it and I was lucky to contract with another crew to renovate the places torn up. When we called another contractor to get another bid they said it would be a five month wait!
So I'm living in a construction zone atm and my wallet is $40k lighter. But the kitchen and bathroom needed work done anyway, and I got such a steal on the house I am still WAY below market cost.
At the risk of being a broken record, you could also look at tenants' rights organizations and get their advice. You might end up in the same place you are today with the same options that are being suggested in this thread, but dollars to donuts they've dealt with similar situations in the past and would at least have relevant experience from which to give you advice.
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 10:38 am
The main issue is that there is a potential, imminent health threat. Any mitigation will cost you money (or force you to move out). Inaction can have a dearer cost. Unstoppable force vs. immovable object. You absolutely have to get clearer picture of the mold situation, preferably much sooner than a month. This is probably priority #1.
Blackhawk wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 9:59 am
~Stop making the remaining bad financial decisions that we still make - the occasional impulse buy "_____ is having a really bad week, I'll do something nice for them", "I really need a _____, and it isn't really that much..." and put that onto the debt as well. If we can do that, we really will be living at near minimums.
Lock your credit card. A lock on the card is temporary and can be turned off and back on in case of necessary/emergency purchases. It is an extra step to guard against the impulse buys. It shouldn't affect any recurring charges/subscriptions.
Alternatively, get a new card with a 0% charge on balance transfer interest for X months if they still have those (with interest rates doing their thing right now, those may be tough to find) and see if that allows you to get the principal down. Perhaps lather/rinse/repeat if it does.
Oh, and lock if necessary too
Black Lives definitely Matter Lorini!
Also: There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
From what you’ve outlined your options are pretty shitty. Your landlord can probably be forced by some government agency to clean things up but I bet that when your lease is up it will either be jacked up to market prices or not renewed. Living on the street with dependents who are also autistic if I have the diagnosis correct is not a great idea either. I think you’re either forced to get quotes on mold remediation services and hope the landlord will go in on the cost or end up doing the work yourself which is more risky but may buy you some time. Both will require money. I think you’re going to have to do what I think you really don’t want to do and set up a Gofundme. I understand your hesitation about this but I think you’d find people who would want to help you out and it buys your family some time to pursue longer term solutions.
Just a thought and I wish I lived closer to you. We would have been happy to pitch in however we could.
Black lives matter!
Wise words of warning from Smoove B: Oh, how you all laughed when I warned you about the semen. Well, who's laughing now?
No lease. To be honest, I've never lived anywhere with a lease in my life. In fact, the original landlord sold the building to the current landlady... 18? 19? years ago. I'm not even sure if there is still a rental agreement in existence.
Can you look in the windows of the other apartment to get a sense of how bad it may be?
Or....since you know they wont be around for a month.....maybe the door somehow gets knocked off its hinges.......
stimpy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 3:38 pm
Can you look in the windows of the other apartment to get a sense of how bad it may be?
Or....since you know they wont be around for a month.....maybe the door somehow gets knocked off its hinges.......
I tried the prior, but the blinds are all closed tight. I'm not doing the latter.
Blackhawk wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 3:25 pm
No lease. To be honest, I've never lived anywhere with a lease in my life. In fact, the original landlord sold the building to the current landlady... 18? 19? years ago. I'm not even sure if there is still a rental agreement in existence.
Blackhawk wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 3:25 pm
No lease. To be honest, I've never lived anywhere with a lease in my life. In fact, the original landlord sold the building to the current landlady... 18? 19? years ago. I'm not even sure if there is still a rental agreement in existence.
I'd already dug into all of that. The simple fact is that there are a multitude of ways that I can force this issue with the landlady, from friendly to unfriendly. I can absolutely get the mold problem addressed, no doubt. I just can't kick any of them off until such a time as I'm ready to move out. I will, however, be putting certain pieces in place, just in case - getting in, photographing it, notifying her in writing that there is a problem. When it comes right down to it, short of finding thousands of dollars to repair someone else's house that we've been working toward leaving anyway, I can't do anything until I have an alternative living option. And that isn't a matter of a lump sum, it's a matter of regular payments.
So my path forward is really to focus everything on both increasing the "Income" column while decreasing the "Expenses" column. I've already done everything in the second category that is immediate (canceling/reducing/etc), and now just need to do the one that takes time (paying off debt.)
Zarathud wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 10:04 pm
Paint has to stick to something. Mold is not an acceptable primer.
Just to clarify, my understanding (I might be wrong) is that the the problem isn't mold inside BH's apartment but mold in the downstairs apartment producing breathable spores that drift in with air through the cracks. I was wondering if BH painting his side of every mutual surface might form a decent seal.
Zarathud wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 10:04 pm
Paint has to stick to something. Mold is not an acceptable primer.
Just to clarify, my understanding (I might be wrong) is that the the problem isn't mold inside BH's apartment but mold in the downstairs apartment producing breathable spores that drift in with air through the cracks. I was wondering if BH painting his side of every mutual surface might form a decent seal.
or finding every single possible crack/gap/vent from the downstairs unit to the upstairs and sealing those off? would take a _lot_ of painstaking work, but maybe it's doable eventually? if so, then just take mold remediation measures on the upstairs afterwards and continually monitor.
Just my 2 cents, but you asked for options.
People here give you options. You shoot every one of them down by either not being able/willing to do them or saying you have already done them.
Just curious what kind of other options were you looking for?
stimpy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 5:06 pm
Just my 2 cents, but you asked for options.
People here give you options. You shoot every one of them down by either not being able/willing to do them or saying you have already done them.
Just curious what kind of other options were you looking for?
WTF?
It's a money crisis. He's not "shooting them down" from laziness or arrogance but because money makes them impossible.
stimpy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 5:06 pm
Just my 2 cents, but you asked for options.
People here give you options. You shoot every one of them down by either not being able/willing to do them or saying you have already done them.
Just curious what kind of other options were you looking for?
WTF?
It's a money crisis. He's not "shooting them down" from laziness or arrogance but because money makes them impossible.
Didnt say he was.
But him knowing his own situation, wondering exactly what kind of other practical options he was looking for.
Almost everyone is and did say the same thing.....GTFO as soon as possible.
He knew that wasnt possible, so maybe saying that upfront would have helped.
stimpy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 5:19 pm
Didnt say he was.
But him knowing his own situation, wondering exactly what kind of other practical options he was looking for.
Originally? How severe of an issue it really was (there are people here whom I trust better than the 'one size fits everyone' official statements and blog posts from mold removal companies/lawyers you find if you google the topic), if there were any ways to reduce the issues aside from those beyond my means (the suggestion of a filtration is one that I'm looking at), other possibilities I hadn't thought of.
Zarathud wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 10:04 pm
Paint has to stick to something. Mold is not an acceptable primer.
Just to clarify, my understanding (I might be wrong) is that the the problem isn't mold inside BH's apartment but mold in the downstairs apartment producing breathable spores that drift in with air through the cracks. I was wondering if BH painting his side of every mutual surface might form a decent seal.
or finding every single possible crack/gap/vent from the downstairs unit to the upstairs and sealing those off? would take a _lot_ of painstaking work, but maybe it's doable eventually? if so, then just take mold remediation measures on the upstairs afterwards and continually monitor.
In addition to the walls, every possible gap includes the entirety of the floor under the carpets. As I mentioned, they leak hot air in the summer and (presumably) cold air in the winter. They're wood floors, and probably haven't had anything done to them since they were installed in the late 19th century. The creaking and noticeably saggy bits strongly suggest that the boards are no longer tight against each other.
Blackhawk wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 6:58 pm
(the suggestion of a filtration is one that I'm looking at), other possibilities I hadn't thought of.
That's a good, and probably somewhat inexpensive idea for the short term.
I bought this one on Prime Day and it's currently on sale for the same price with the 40% off coupon, about $40.
So far it's worked great
Zarathud wrote: ↑Tue Jul 19, 2022 10:04 pm
Paint has to stick to something. Mold is not an acceptable primer.
Just to clarify, my understanding (I might be wrong) is that the the problem isn't mold inside BH's apartment but mold in the downstairs apartment producing breathable spores that drift in with air through the cracks. I was wondering if BH painting his side of every mutual surface might form a decent seal.
or finding every single possible crack/gap/vent from the downstairs unit to the upstairs and sealing those off? would take a _lot_ of painstaking work, but maybe it's doable eventually? if so, then just take mold remediation measures on the upstairs afterwards and continually monitor.
In addition to the walls, every possible gap includes the entirety of the floor under the carpets. As I mentioned, they leak hot air in the summer and (presumably) cold air in the winter. They're wood floors, and probably haven't had anything done to them since they were installed in the late 19th century. The creaking and noticeably saggy bits strongly suggest that the boards are no longer tight against each other.
There are also potential structural issues of the apartment (the moldy one, #2 IIRC)is as bad as it sounds. Mold likes damp, structures don't.
Is it possible to check under the carpet to see if you have mold in your unit?
(FWiW, I'm imagining the mold apartment as something from the Upsidedown. It's probably not that bad but I'm basing my urgency on that image)
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General "No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton MYT
stimpy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 5:19 pm
Didnt say he was.
But him knowing his own situation, wondering exactly what kind of other practical options he was looking for.
Originally? How severe of an issue it really was (there are people here whom I trust better than the 'one size fits everyone' official statements and blog posts from mold removal companies/lawyers you find if you google the topic), if there were any ways to reduce the issues aside from those beyond my means (the suggestion of a filtration is one that I'm looking at), other possibilities I hadn't thought of.
If filtration is a viable option do some good research (as I’m sure you’re probably doing as I type ) and pick a good one vs just an inexpensive one. Granted we’re not talking about clean room level stuff but perhaps we can help out with getting a decent one that will tide you over for a bit.
Black lives matter!
Wise words of warning from Smoove B: Oh, how you all laughed when I warned you about the semen. Well, who's laughing now?
Every 5th donor gets a free chunk of our lovely homes.
