The Politics of Covid 19, mask wearing and the vaccination process

[Blackhawk]

"Not one person in my family will ever touch the COVID-19 vaccine."

That's ok. It'll cut down on global warming if you're dead.

[malchior]

[Smoove_B]

I have no words for what's happening in TN and yeah, it's like the virus has tapped into lobbyist funding. Here's the latest:

Dr. Fiscus says TN's Department of Health has been instructed to stop promoting vaccines "of any kind" for children.

"That's infant, HPV... flu vaccine outreach in schools is being cancelled for the fall," she says."

Tennesseans have been "sold out for politics."

[malchior]

I just watched that clip. It's appalling how bad our country (or perhaps more accurately parts of it) has gotten. A lawyer drafted a memo about the law and it leads to her getting fired. It's shocking how bad things got so fast.

[Smoove_B]

This is the culmination of 20+ years of the "Health Freedom" movement. They're taking advantage of the pandemic and development of the vaccines to push what they've been fighting over for decades. And apparently politicians in some states are on board.

It's looking more and more to me like certain states are going to completely dismantle public health elements - the laws and polices that have been enshrined for 50+ years in most places. Firing a vaccine commissioner? I am speechless.

[malchior]

Firing a vaccine commissioner? I am speechless.

Sounds like they don't need one. In any case, cross Tennessee off the places to retire. Got it.

[Smoove_B]

Well, it's a good thing there's no such thing as people that are asymptomatic but infectious, I guess.

Montana has a new law that prohibits public health departments from quarantining people who have come in contact with infectious disease if they are not symptomatic.

Policies can accelerate pandemics or end them.

I don't know how my public health peers are working in TN and MT, honestly.

[malchior]

At this point I can't see activity like this as much less than very late stage fascism. This is the radicalization of government and the point is show they have power to do harm in the face of the truth. That's not the only lens to evaluate this madness but it probably is the most instructive. They are using this crisis to radicalize people against vaccines and the monsters who lead the GOP don't care what happens to anyone as long as it means power for them.

[Holman]

[Edit: I started this post and then paused for dinner, thus missing that malchior was essentially saying the same thing just above.]

I'm sure this has come up already in this long thread, but I'll ask anyway: as the Right turns against vaccination and embraces COVID risk, what's in it for them?

I guess the obvious short-term strategy is that it helps deny Biden a win. If you're a Fox News etc personality (and you're almost certainly vaccinated yourself), killing or sickening a portion of your audience is worth it to undercut Democratic campaign messaging in 2022/24.

You would think that rejecting public-health measures would carry some political risk. But this is where I think the real strategy comes in. Rhetorically, the COVID-denying messaging that attacks Fauci and the CDC becomes just a part of the larger discourse that attacks climate science and any other analysts/experts whose claims don't fit the conservative narrative.

Even more, it's part of the war against truth itself, which has always been a part of the Authoritarian playbook. If you can convince people that *all* evidentiary claims are politically motivated, you can sell them a cynical skepticism that points ultimately and only to the Strong Man who will champion their particular (ethnic, social, religious) interests against all opposing claims.

In other words, it all feeds into the essential question of authority. Who are you going to trust: the media/academic/scientific elites who hate you and believe that your values are false, or the no-nonsense Tough Guy who has your back? Once a society gets to that point, reality is subject to authority, not vice-versa.

[Kraken]

Firing a vaccine commissioner? I am speechless.

Sounds like they don't need one. In any case, cross Tennessee off the places to retire. Got it.

Tonight Wife casually suggested that we should go to Nashville someday. So I told her about this. She readily agreed that we'll never go anyplace that's pro-covid.

[Kurth]

At this point I can't see activity like this as much less than very late stage fascism. This is the radicalization of government and the point is show they have power to do harm in the face of the truth. That's not the only lens to evaluate this madness but it probably is the most instructive. They are using this crisis to radicalize people against vaccines and the monsters who lead the GOP don't care what happens to anyone as long as it means power for them.

I'm guessing this has been posted somewhere else, but, David Frum says "There's a word for what Trumpism is becoming."

[malchior]

I hadn't seen that yet but a good read. He points out the key element that the particulars aren't going to look the same in our version of fascism. However, the macro elements have been the same. They are identifying enemies -- first loosely the libs, but now specific enemies like Fauci, or hated groups like Trans and minorities -- and they are pushing victimhood by positioning vaccines and masking as oppression or libs teaching their kids to hate themselves with CRT. It's all the puzzle pieces of fascism. And time is running out quickly.

[El Guapo]

A lot of this is the byproduct of the demonization that is necessary to make Trump to be a unique hero. Like, you can't sell Trump as a unique savior if his enemies are just well-meaning people who have a slightly different view of the world. So liberals have to become race / class enemies who are not merely wrong but who are also evil. And once you have a world view where Biden / Pelosi / Schumer are not just misguided but are actively malicious, then by definition everything they do is evil, or at least intensely suspect. So if Biden is saying that everyone should be vaccinated, and Biden is also supporting or protecting a child molesting cabal, then Biden's obviously not pushing vaccination for good reasons.

[Smoove_B]

New cases in Florida are up 257% over the last 14 days. Also Florida:

[malchior]

A lot of this is the byproduct of the demonization that is necessary to make Trump to be a unique hero. Like, you can't sell Trump as a unique savior if his enemies are just well-meaning people who have a slightly different view of the world. So liberals have to become race / class enemies who are not merely wrong but who are also evil. And once you have a world view where Biden / Pelosi / Schumer are not just misguided but are actively malicious, then by definition everything they do is evil, or at least intensely suspect.

I think Trump exploited the ground conditions that exist versus it being a byproduct. This has been happening since Clinton in progressing levels of demonization. The GOP has been a rising authoritarian party for a lot longer than many accept. This is what people (including myself) saw even 10-15 years ago in the rhetoric of right-wing radio. It was a hate fest with fascist undertones. That someone decided they cared little enough about democracy or our norms to finally weaponize it was just a matter of time probably.

Edit: That t-shirt above is exactly what I'm talking about. "Here is the enemy, embrace your anger, you are the victims, they tried to talk away your jobs and freedom." It's bad, bad stuff.

[El Guapo]

A lot of this is the byproduct of the demonization that is necessary to make Trump to be a unique hero. Like, you can't sell Trump as a unique savior if his enemies are just well-meaning people who have a slightly different view of the world. So liberals have to become race / class enemies who are not merely wrong but who are also evil. And once you have a world view where Biden / Pelosi / Schumer are not just misguided but are actively malicious, then by definition everything they do is evil, or at least intensely suspect.

I think Trump exploited the ground conditions that exist versus it being a byproduct. This has been happening since Clinton in progressing levels of demonization. The GOP has been a rising authoritarian party for a lot longer than many accept. This is what people (including myself) saw even 10-15 years ago in the rhetoric of right-wing radio. It was a hate fest with fascist undertones. That someone decided they cared little enough about democracy or our norms to finally weaponize it was just a matter of time probably.

Edit: That t-shirt above is exactly what I'm talking about. "Here is the enemy, embrace your anger, you are the victims, they tried to talk away your jobs and freedom." It's bad, bad stuff.

Oh yeah - this stuff goes back decades in the conservative movement. Hence birtherism (the president is a secret foreigner!) and Clinton's secret trip to Moscow (the president is a secret communist!). Hell, the key Goldwater tract was None Dare Call It Treason. Our political opponents aren't just misguided, they are actively working to harm you intentionally. And in the 2016 GOP primary debates, while Rubio got mocked and destroyed by Christie for repeating the same line repeatedly, it shouldn't get lost that that line was "Let's dispense with the fiction that Barack Obama doesn't know what he's doing. He knows exactly what he's doing." So this was one of the institutional GOP candidates saying that Obama was intentionally hurting the country.

So yeah, probably someone like Trump, who is in a sense the Murdochverse made flesh, was going to enter the scene sooner or later. Plus the GOP chopping away at open and free voting, plus the undemocratic structure of the Senate, has reduced the limiting effect of having to appeal to a broad mass of voters.

[malchior]

Hell, the key Goldwater tract was None Dare Call It Treason.

Stuart Steven's - It Was All a Lie posits that Goldwater was the beginning of the present crisis. He essentially said that the GOP lost the black vote with his candidacy and never got it back. They tried a few times to readjust, eventually they realized they permanently lost them, and heaps of GOP policy was aimed to marginalize them to protect GOP political power. That it aligned with racists was a bonus feature. He talks about all the dog whistling he participated in and he pretty much owns how shitty it was and his own responsibility. It is a very honest deep dive into GOP consulting world. I found it worth skimming at least and it's another facet to understand the mess we are in.

[Kurth]

A lot of this is the byproduct of the demonization that is necessary to make Trump to be a unique hero. Like, you can't sell Trump as a unique savior if his enemies are just well-meaning people who have a slightly different view of the world. So liberals have to become race / class enemies who are not merely wrong but who are also evil. And once you have a world view where Biden / Pelosi / Schumer are not just misguided but are actively malicious, then by definition everything they do is evil, or at least intensely suspect.

I think Trump exploited the ground conditions that exist versus it being a byproduct. This has been happening since Clinton in progressing levels of demonization. The GOP has been a rising authoritarian party for a lot longer than many accept. This is what people (including myself) saw even 10-15 years ago in the rhetoric of right-wing radio. It was a hate fest with fascist undertones. That someone decided they cared little enough about democracy or our norms to finally weaponize it was just a matter of time probably.

Edit: That t-shirt above is exactly what I'm talking about. "Here is the enemy, embrace your anger, you are the victims, they tried to talk away your jobs and freedom." It's bad, bad stuff.

Yep. Remember how the Clintons had Vince Foster murdered to cover up their Whitewater misdeeds?

The GOP’s political foes weren’t just wrong about policy or politics: They were murderers.

This shit goes way back.

[LordMortis]

Never heard of the treason book but I found and read None Dare Call it Conspiracy in college at the end of the 80s. It was pretty underwhelming. I got more out of the Illumintus Trilogy and ultimately the Principia Discordia, which I eventually took on and rejected, though I did still regularly secretly partake of a hotdog with bun on Fridays, even after rejecting Discordianism.

[Smoove_B]

Yolo County, CA is now recommending that everyone start masking indoors:

On Wednesday, the Yolo County Health Officer recommended that fully vaccinated people wear masks indoors as a precautionary measure against the coronavirus. This recommendation comes as the Delta variant has become the dominant strain of COVID-19 being found in the county.

The recommendation comes after California loosened its guidelines, allowing people who are fully vaccinated to go without masks in most situations.

Need to see more of this, quite frankly and it needs to shift from recommend to require rather quickly in some areas, imho.

[LordMortis]

Ironic for a geography called YOLO... Or perhaps YOLO is an ironic expression for people living dangerously to use... Hmmmm...

Now I need to go back and re-read Unbearable Lightness of Being again. Einmal ist keinmal.

[Smoove_B]

Exactly. When YOLO county is telling you to be cautious, maybe the nation should listen.

[El Guapo]

This made me check Massachusetts COVID rates. Looks like our current 7 day average is 145/day. Up from a low of 55 a couple weeks ago. Up, though hard to say yet whether it's a trend, and better than other places, at least.

[malchior]

Cruz as usual doing his walking talking dumpster fire bit.

[Smoove_B]

Stealing your stimulus and giving you COVID. What a complete and total sack of crap he is.

[LordMortis]

I suppose illegal aliens are the direct cause of increased AC usage and indoor activity.

[Kraken]

This made me check Massachusetts COVID rates. Looks like our current 7 day average is 145/day. Up from a low of 55 a couple weeks ago. Up, though hard to say yet whether it's a trend, and better than other places, at least.

I didn't see today's numbers, but for the past several days we've recorded 0 deaths. That's a trailing indicator, but the most important to watch -- if the increasing cases are mostly mild, then so is the argument for renewed restrictions.

I do think I'm going to start masking at the grocery store again tomorrow. It's such a minor inconvenience that it seems prudent.

[El Guapo]

This made me check Massachusetts COVID rates. Looks like our current 7 day average is 145/day. Up from a low of 55 a couple weeks ago. Up, though hard to say yet whether it's a trend, and better than other places, at least.

I didn't see today's numbers, but for the past several days we've recorded 0 deaths. That's a trailing indicator, but the most important to watch -- if the increasing cases are mostly mild, then so is the argument for renewed restrictions.

I do think I'm going to start masking at the grocery store again tomorrow. It's such a minor inconvenience that it seems prudent.

There was one COVID death yesterday. The "deaths" graph doesn't give daily numbers, but looks to be flat around zero still.

I've been sticking with masks for indoors at public places.

[malchior]

"It's an attack!" - Hans Zarkov



(he's been right all these years)

[Daehawk]

Documents show TN health officials instructed not to hold immunization events for children at schools

[Zarathud]

They are willing to let poor people die for their ideology.

[Isgrimnur]

Same as it ever was.

[Alefroth]

New cases in Florida are up 257% over the last 14 days. Also Florida:

I don't even get the pun.

[Alefroth]

Cruz as usual doing his walking talking dumpster fire bit.

There's a very short list of people whose deaths I'd celebrate. It may have just grown by one.

He is being absolutely despicable.

[malchior]

They are willing to let poor people die for their ideology personal enrichment and power.

It's too wildly inconsistent to be an ideology.

[YellowKing]

In a perfect world I'd force every one of these bastards to spend a full day in an ICU watching people die on ventilators.

[El Guapo]

Cruz as usual doing his walking talking dumpster fire bit.

There's a very short list of people whose deaths I'd celebrate. It may have just grown by one.

He is being absolutely despicable.

Truer words were never spoken.

[Ralph-Wiggum]

New cases in Florida are up 257% over the last 14 days. Also Florida:

I don't even get the pun.

It requires you not knowing how Fauci's name is pronounced. Which is probably the case for most people buying this shirt.

[Kurth]

They are willing to let poor people die for their ideology personal enrichment and power.

It's too wildly inconsistent to be an ideology.

But even that leaves me scratching my head. Assuming they don’t actually believe that COVID is a big Democrat hoax, how can a group of people that question/actively discourage vaccination in their base hope to retain or gain power? Unless I am misunderstanding, the people that are being hospitalized and dying from COVID now are almost entirely unvaccinated (greater than 99%). No matter how diabolical you are, I don’t see how you grow your power by espousing ideology that kills off your base.

If things keep going the way they are and the unvaccinated continue to play death lottery, aren’t these deaths going to start eating into the Trumpaloo base while largely leaving the Democratic base untouched (or, even growing if rational thought prevails and some start to see the death cult that the GOP has turned into)?

[El Guapo]

They are willing to let poor people die for their ideology personal enrichment and power.

It's too wildly inconsistent to be an ideology.

But even that leaves me scratching my head. Assuming they don’t actually believe that COVID is a big Democrat hoax, how can a group of people that question/actively discourage vaccination in their base hope to retain or gain power? Unless I am misunderstanding, the people that are being hospitalized and dying from COVID now are almost entirely unvaccinated (greater than 99%). No matter how diabolical you are, I don’t see how you grow your power by espousing ideology that kills off your base.

If things keep going the way they are and the unvaccinated continue to play death lottery, aren’t these deaths going to start eating into the Trumpaloo base while largely leaving the Democratic base untouched (or, even growing if rational thought prevails and some start to see the death cult that the GOP has turned into)?

The GOP is setting things up so that they won't need to win the most votes to gain and retain power. Having a committed base that sees political conflict as life and death may be more important.