The UAE has successfully launched its Mars probe, named Hope, making history as the Arab world’s first interplanetary mission.
...
Hope launched from the Japanese space center on Sunday, having been delayed from the previous week due to poor weather conditions. Within a few hours of liftoff, the ground segment at Dubai’s Mohammed bin Rashid Space Centre established two-way communication with the probe.
...
The Hope probe, a $200 million project called “Al Amal” in Arabic, is scheduled to reach Mars’ orbit in February 2021 and will spend one Mars year — equivalent to 687 days on Earth — studying and gathering data on the red planet’s atmosphere. The year 2021 is also significant: it will mark 50 years of the UAE’s existence.
“It is a weather satellite, and that’s one objective of the mission,” Sarah al-Amiri, the Mars mission’s lead scientist and UAE minister of state for advanced sciences told Spaceflight Now. “We also look at what role Mars’ weather plays in atmospheric loss. That’s the other part of the mission.”
Mars is hard
Moderators: Bakhtosh, EvilHomer3k
- Isgrimnur
- Posts: 82491
- Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:29 am
- Location: Chookity pok
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
CNBC
It's almost as if people are the problem.
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
- Holman
- Posts: 29093
- Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 8:00 pm
- Location: Between the Schuylkill and the Wissahickon
Re: Mars is hard
The launch window tomorrow (Thursday) opens at 7:50am Eastern and lasts about two hours. The plan is to reach Mars on February 18 2021.
Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
I read elsewhere that Perseverance will record its "seven minutes of terror" in HD video.
- Holman
- Posts: 29093
- Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 8:00 pm
- Location: Between the Schuylkill and the Wissahickon
- Enough
- Posts: 14688
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:05 pm
- Location: Serendipity
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
Beautiful morning and launch!
My blog (mostly photos): Fort Ephemera - My Flickr Photostream
“You only get one sunrise and one sunset a day, and you only get so many days on the planet. A good photographer does the math and doesn’t waste either.” ―Galen Rowell
“You only get one sunrise and one sunset a day, and you only get so many days on the planet. A good photographer does the math and doesn’t waste either.” ―Galen Rowell
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
Excellent simulation of Perseverance's seven minutes of terror, assuming it survives them (as Curiosity did).
- Daehawk
- Posts: 63979
- Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 1:11 am
Re: Mars is hard
Hope theres no strong wind when she decides to land.
--------------------------------------------
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
The air on Mars is so thin that high winds pack little power. It's one of the main things "The Martian" got wrong. That said, the seven minutes of terror would certainly be more terrifying in a dust storm. But it's not like NASA can abort the landing.
- Rumpy
- Posts: 12713
- Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 6:52 pm
- Location: Sudbury, Ontario, Canada
Re: Mars is hard
We had one of the lead engineers give a talk to our club about Perserverance via Zoom this month. It was quite fascinating. I never realized just how big those rovers are. I asked him if they were using VR to help them plan their route, and he said they weren't quite there yet in being able to do that with their tools even though it might seem like the natural thing to do, but it was something they were experimenting with.
PC:
Ryzen 5 3600
32GB RAM
2x1TB NVMe Drives
GTX 1660 Ti
Ryzen 5 3600
32GB RAM
2x1TB NVMe Drives
GTX 1660 Ti
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
The mole is dead.
Here's to all the plucky machines that have tangled with Mars and ultimately lost. Goodbye, Opportunity. Godspeed, Beagle 2. We hardly knew you, Schiaparelli. And now we must bid farewell to the "mole" part of NASA's InSight lander mission.
The lander itself is fine and healthy and still studying marsquakes, but the mole's efforts to dig into the red planet have been stymied every step of the way. On Thursday, NASA announced the end of the mole's journey.
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
Mars is about to get crowded with ambitious missions from China, the US, and the UAE. China's first Mars mission includes an orbiter, a lander, and a rover -- the same mission configuration as the Chang'E program, but much much farther away. The UAE's orbiter is significant because the UAE isn't notorious for its space program, and it will provide useful data regarding Mars' loss of atmosphere -- if they can just establish orbit with a healthy spacecraft, that's a win. And while the US Perseverance mission is superficially a replay of Curiosity, the obstacles and potential science payoff are dialed up to 11.
We're still 10 days away from Perseverance's seven minutes of terror, but the Arabs and Chinese are biting their nails now.
We're still 10 days away from Perseverance's seven minutes of terror, but the Arabs and Chinese are biting their nails now.
- raydude
- Posts: 3896
- Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 9:22 am
Re: Mars is hard
Hoping the best for all these missions but especially for Perseverance and Ingenuity. I'm super excited to see Ingenuity flying around on Mars. That would be really cool.Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Feb 09, 2021 12:43 am Mars is about to get crowded with ambitious missions from China, the US, and the UAE. China's first Mars mission includes an orbiter, a lander, and a rover -- the same mission configuration as the Chang'E program, but much much farther away. The UAE's orbiter is significant because the UAE isn't notorious for its space program, and it will provide useful data regarding Mars' loss of atmosphere -- if they can just establish orbit with a healthy spacecraft, that's a win. And while the US Perseverance mission is superficially a replay of Curiosity, the obstacles and potential science payoff are dialed up to 11.
We're still 10 days away from Perseverance's seven minutes of terror, but the Arabs and Chinese are biting their nails now.
- Daehawk
- Posts: 63979
- Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 1:11 am
Re: Mars is hard
Even with max precautions I gotta think Mars must be contaminated by now with microbes from Earth.
--------------------------------------------
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
- Carpet_pissr
- Posts: 20125
- Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 5:32 pm
- Location: Columbia, SC
Re: Mars is hard
I really hope this will be available to watch somehow? I mean obviously, it's going to be massively delayed, but I want to see both the entry, and if that succeeds, the helicopter flights. I can't remember if we were able to view the previous entries?
- AWS260
- Posts: 12705
- Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 12:51 pm
- Location: Brooklyn
Re: Mars is hard
It depends on what you mean by "watch." There will be a livestream, but I don't think they sent a camera crew ahead to set up in the landing zone.
I'm planning to watch this live webinar the night before: The Thrill and Terror of Landing a Spacecraft on Mars
I'm planning to watch this live webinar the night before: The Thrill and Terror of Landing a Spacecraft on Mars
- The Meal
- Posts: 27995
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:33 pm
- Location: 2005 Stanley Cup Champion
Re: Mars is hard
MHS and I play poker with a guy on the operations side of the UAE mission. We call him Abu Dhabi Dave. He was talking last week, that these three put about a dozen active orbiters around Mars. (We told him not to screw up the All-in and Mission Abort buttons on his computer, as his Operations Center has been based out of his home for the last year.)Kraken wrote: ↑Tue Feb 09, 2021 12:43 am Mars is about to get crowded with ambitious missions from China, the US, and the UAE. China's first Mars mission includes an orbiter, a lander, and a rover -- the same mission configuration as the Chang'E program, but much much farther away. The UAE's orbiter is significant because the UAE isn't notorious for its space program, and it will provide useful data regarding Mars' loss of atmosphere -- if they can just establish orbit with a healthy spacecraft, that's a win. And while the US Perseverance mission is superficially a replay of Curiosity, the obstacles and potential science payoff are dialed up to 11.
We're still 10 days away from Perseverance's seven minutes of terror, but the Arabs and Chinese are biting their nails now.
[edit:]And the Hope Mission has had a successful orbital injection.
"Better to talk to people than communicate via tweet." — Elontra
- Carpet_pissr
- Posts: 20125
- Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 5:32 pm
- Location: Columbia, SC
Re: Mars is hard
The hell?! I want my money back...in advance, if true.
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
- Daehawk
- Posts: 63979
- Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 1:11 am
Re: Mars is hard
Poor little guy. Just drop him off and leave. So many steps to go wrong.
--------------------------------------------
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
When Curiosity used the same method I thought the odds were against it. Now that it's succeeded once, I still think the odds are against it working twice. As you said, so many things have to go just right. I know I'll be holding my breath on the 18th.
- raydude
- Posts: 3896
- Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 9:22 am
Re: Mars is hard
Skycrane is the least crazy way to solve an engineering problem. Which is: how do you land something as big as Curiosity or Perseverance on Mars?
- Hrdina
- Posts: 2936
- Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 6:18 pm
- Location: Warren Cromartie Secondary School
Re: Mars is hard
While maybe not quite as pessimistic as Kraken, I was a bit concerned by both the novelty and the technical complexity involved in the Curiosity lander. Watching the Seven Minutes of Terror videos back then, followed by learning that Curiosity was wheels-down, and it had happened just like the video, was one of the coolest space things ever (right up there with watching the two Falcon Heavy boosters land side-by-side).raydude wrote: ↑Fri Feb 12, 2021 10:35 am Skycrane is the least crazy way to solve an engineering problem. Which is: how do you land something as big as Curiosity or Perseverance on Mars?
The fact that we don't learn the result until several minutes after it's happened has always weirdly added to the tension. The InSight landing was another example of that. I can't help getting a little emotional when I watch things like this.
Mars really is a nasty place to try to land something heavy. The atmosphere is enough to burn you up but not really enough to help you slow down from an interplanetary trip. I'm sure that the Rob Manning lecture that AWS260 linked will discuss that in detail. It drives you to find "crazy" solutions.
Conform or be cast out!
- Daehawk
- Posts: 63979
- Joined: Sat Jan 01, 2005 1:11 am
Re: Mars is hard
I still like the air bag landing. But Im still not sure how it rights itself if its not sitting right.
--------------------------------------------
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
I am Dyslexic of Borg, prepare to have your ass laminated.
I guess Ray Butts has ate his last pancake.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/daehawk
"Has high IQ. Refuses to apply it"
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
Oh yeah, I definitely did a chair dance when Curiosity landed. Or rather, 11 minutes after it did. I'll be following Perseverance in real time -11, too.Hrdina wrote: ↑Fri Feb 12, 2021 1:52 pmWhile maybe not quite as pessimistic as Kraken, I was a bit concerned by both the novelty and the technical complexity involved in the Curiosity lander. Watching the Seven Minutes of Terror videos back then, followed by learning that Curiosity was wheels-down, and it had happened just like the video, was one of the coolest space things ever (right up there with watching the two Falcon Heavy boosters land side-by-side).raydude wrote: ↑Fri Feb 12, 2021 10:35 am Skycrane is the least crazy way to solve an engineering problem. Which is: how do you land something as big as Curiosity or Perseverance on Mars?
The fact that we don't learn the result until several minutes after it's happened has always weirdly added to the tension. The InSight landing was another example of that. I can't help getting a little emotional when I watch things like this.
Gizmodo has a nice write-up of the main pain points.
Failure could take on many forms next week when NASA’s next-gen rover, Perseverance, reaches the surface of the Red Planet. Here’s what needs to go right—and how things could quickly go sideways—when Perseverance tries to make its much-anticipated landing.
For NASA, the entry, descent, and landing (EDL) of Perseverance on Thursday, February 18 presents numerous potential points of failure. NASA has said that “hundreds of things have to go just right” for the rover to survive the seven minutes of terror. We can’t take a safe landing for granted: As NASA points out, only “about 40 percent of the missions ever sent to Mars—by any space agency—have been successful.” Which, yikes.
In a nutshell, Perseverance will have to transition from speeds reaching 12,500 miles per hour (20,000 km/hr) to a walking pace over the course of several minutes. What’s more, it’ll have to perform this autonomously, as it takes nearly 11 minutes for radio signals to reach Earth. To complicate matters, NASA is debuting two new technologies for the mission, both relating to the EDL phase and both unproven.
All three phases—entry, descent, and landing—present their own unique challenges.
- raydude
- Posts: 3896
- Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 9:22 am
Re: Mars is hard
https://www.space.com/16889-mars-rover-curiosity-sky-crane-landing.html wrote: Again, however, Curiosity's heft nixed this idea. It weighs about five times as much as either Spirit or Opportunity.
"Unfortunately, we don't have fabric here on Earth strong enough to build airbags that would work for a rover the size of Curiosity," Steltzner said. "The bags would shred, not giving Curiosity any protection."
- Rumpy
- Posts: 12713
- Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 6:52 pm
- Location: Sudbury, Ontario, Canada
Re: Mars is hard
Also, one thing to keep in mind is that they don't want to disrupt the surface. The sky crane method is gentler on the environment and also saves weight. Hard to believe, but these rovers are actually quite huge. We're talking car size. Both Perserverance and Curiosity are roughly the size of a Tesla Model X, both higher and wider. It's also much heavier than Curiosity was, due to the equipment on board.
Some interesting information here https://everydayastronaut.com/persevera ... curiosity/
Some interesting information here https://everydayastronaut.com/persevera ... curiosity/
PC:
Ryzen 5 3600
32GB RAM
2x1TB NVMe Drives
GTX 1660 Ti
Ryzen 5 3600
32GB RAM
2x1TB NVMe Drives
GTX 1660 Ti
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
<squeal> Who's watching seven minutes of terror tomorrow afternoon, and where are you watching it?
- Rumpy
- Posts: 12713
- Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 6:52 pm
- Location: Sudbury, Ontario, Canada
Re: Mars is hard
Probably a clean feed on Youtube.
Which is available here. You can set a reminder:
Which is available here. You can set a reminder:
PC:
Ryzen 5 3600
32GB RAM
2x1TB NVMe Drives
GTX 1660 Ti
Ryzen 5 3600
32GB RAM
2x1TB NVMe Drives
GTX 1660 Ti
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
Re: Mars is hard
Thanks, that's what I was looking for. I'll let it play in the background on my desktop machine while I work on my laptop. Here's hoping for a victorious chair-dance.
-
- Posts: 876
- Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2005 2:29 pm
- Location: Somewhere
Re: Mars is hard
We will be watching this afternoon. My 14 yr old son is really looking forward to it.
- Rumpy
- Posts: 12713
- Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 6:52 pm
- Location: Sudbury, Ontario, Canada
Re: Mars is hard
The engineer who gave a talk to my local club was in charge of choosing the landing spot, and he says he'll be there today and be on the first shift, and from then on, the work schedule will be in Mars time.
PC:
Ryzen 5 3600
32GB RAM
2x1TB NVMe Drives
GTX 1660 Ti
Ryzen 5 3600
32GB RAM
2x1TB NVMe Drives
GTX 1660 Ti
- The Meal
- Posts: 27995
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:33 pm
- Location: 2005 Stanley Cup Champion
Re: Mars is hard
Cruise stage separation in less than 4 minutes.
"Better to talk to people than communicate via tweet." — Elontra
- The Meal
- Posts: 27995
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:33 pm
- Location: 2005 Stanley Cup Champion
Re: Mars is hard
Cruise stage separation complete. About 1 minute to landing software firing up. 9 minutes to entry interface commencement.
"Better to talk to people than communicate via tweet." — Elontra
-
- Posts: 24795
- Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:58 pm
Re: Mars is hard
It's really interesting how they are running this coverage. It is a bit more transparent than SpaceX but tracks since it is a public project.
- The Meal
- Posts: 27995
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:33 pm
- Location: 2005 Stanley Cup Champion
Re: Mars is hard
6 minutes to atmo entry.
"Better to talk to people than communicate via tweet." — Elontra
- Kraken
- Posts: 43892
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
- Location: The Hub of the Universe
- Contact:
- The Meal
- Posts: 27995
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:33 pm
- Location: 2005 Stanley Cup Champion
Re: Mars is hard
MRO receiving telemetry which will be shot to earth a few hours after the event.
"Better to talk to people than communicate via tweet." — Elontra
- The Meal
- Posts: 27995
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:33 pm
- Location: 2005 Stanley Cup Champion
Re: Mars is hard
I'm getting both the youtube channel linked above, as well as NASA TV feeds just fine. (NASA TV about :50 seconds behind the youtube feed.)
"Better to talk to people than communicate via tweet." — Elontra
- The Meal
- Posts: 27995
- Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:33 pm
- Location: 2005 Stanley Cup Champion
Re: Mars is hard
Perseverance has hit Mars atmosphere at 5300 m/s.
"Better to talk to people than communicate via tweet." — Elontra