Octopus Overlords

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Tue Feb 13, 2024 11:28 am A friend made an observation last night. Trump getting elected is probably the end of the republic but it will usher in several decades of empire. Crumbling empire mostly, but we'll probably be dead by the time it ultimately fails. I just have to figure out where my kids can live.

If Trump gets elected the next big test / failsafe is in 2028, when Trump would be term-limited out. Does Trump try for a third term notwithstanding the Constitution, or does he go the Putin route and get an obedient flunky (Don Jr.?) elected in 2028? Whichever he does, does he succeed?

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Tue Feb 13, 2024 11:28 am A friend made an observation last night. Trump getting elected is probably the end of the republic but it will usher in several decades of empire. Crumbling empire mostly, but we'll probably be dead by the time it ultimately fails. I just have to figure out where my kids can live.

It’s more likely trump is like Clodius who met a foul end while he dismantled the Roman republic. His make the MRRGA gangs then made elections impossible thereafter and he was followed by Caesar.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trump-ro ... _b_9659660

The risk isn’t trump based on historical precedent. It’s who follows him.

I don’t know, the risk from Trump himself shouldn’t be underestimated. I think this was mentioned upthread, but I’d bet that sending out of state national guard troops into cities and states where they’re not wanted goes badly. Miller has also mentioned targeting hamas supporters who are here on visas, and I can only imagine what standards will to evaluate that and how someone would challenge them. Brownstein has a whole article over at the Atlantic about this.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... ow/677385/


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The president has the right to federalise state national guard units under federal law.

So the New York national guard would have to disobey his orders which if lawful would expose commanders to court martial.

The Republican immigration policy is clearly like that of other anglophone “conservatives “ worldwide - the toughness is a facade behind which mass legal migration which people don’t want will continue. By being tough on illegal migration people will think the problem is solved just like in Australia after Tampa and just like the Uk after Brexit.

We should also be worried about a private red state army under the presidents command. Private armies run by political parties lead to tyranny or civil war.

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Tue Feb 13, 2024 11:28 am A friend made an observation last night. Trump getting elected is probably the end of the republic but it will usher in several decades of empire. Crumbling empire mostly, but we'll probably be dead by the time it ultimately fails. I just have to figure out where my kids can live.

It's happened before. The Roman republic had to die for the empire to be born. 'Course, the world has changed a little in the ensuing 2.000 years, so I wouldn't read too much into that.

Our republic is based on the Roman Republic. The founding fathers viewed populism, tyranny of the majority and men like Caesar as horrendous.

FWIW, the Founders were working with plenty of models besides ancient Rome. Not the least of these was England's two-decade attempt at rejecting monarchy and establishing a republic (with very mixed success) a little over a century earlier. For example, our core values of freedom of the press and freedom of religion derive from this era much more than from anything Roman.

And of course the models didn't end with the writing of the Constitution. The early Republic took a keen and wary interest in the French Revolution, after all.

From other thread:

Carpet_pissr wrote: ↑Sun Feb 18, 2024 11:25 am “Former President Donald Trump was met with loud boos as he promoted $399 sneakers at a convention a day after being ordered to pay $355 million in penalties in his New York civil fraud trial.

Trump briefly took the stage at "Sneaker Con" on Saturday—which bills itself as the "The Greatest Sneaker Show on Earth"—to launch custom, Trump-branded sneakers.”

Sneaker “con”?! LOL. Is this an Onion article?

Keepin' it classy.

Donald Trump was booed during a surprise appearance to unveil a new line of $399 trainers on Saturday – a day after he was fined $355 million for fraud.

The crowd at the Sneaker Con in Philadelphia jeered the former president as he launched his “Never Surrender high-tops”, using the platform as another campaign stop between court and primary elections.

The trainers, with an American flag detail on the back, are being sold for $399 on a new website that also sells other Trump-branded shoes and “Victory47” cologne and perfume for $99 a bottle.

A standard style trainer is also offered in either “T-Red” or “POTUS” white, both with a golden “45”, representing Mr Trump’s time as the 45th president, on the side. Theses shoes sell for $199.

Probably a good time to resurrect the vodka ad.

Those booers need reeducation at trump university in the class of 2025!

Either way it’s truth social ipo that’s going to potentially make trumps money issues go away. He could get four billion in stock from that which couls go up even further if it becomes a full meme stock like GameStop.

Man, I need to get me a pair of those sweet sneaks. I’d be the envy of everyone in my patriot convoy. Take that, Cletus and your full set of teeth!

This is not AI generated.

After all this time, no one has had the balls to tell him how to buy and wear a tie for appropriate for this century? Jesus.

I guess it's "proto-American" style, fittingly.

Same old trash.

Next up, gold (foil) plated twenty siders at comic-con, a known bastion of MAGA support.

You might want to sit down:

A Russian oligarch outbid other buyers at auction snagging a pair of autographed Donald Trump 'Never Surrender' sneakers for an astonishing $9,000 at Sneaker Con in Philadelphia.

Roman Sharf, the founder and CEO of luxury watch dealer, Luxury Bazaar, beamed as he held his prize at the Saturday event held at the Philadelphia Convention Center. There are 1,000 pairs - with only ten autographed by Trump.

Sharf held the pair of the shiny gold-colored high-tops that features an American flag with metallic stars on the back, and Trump's first initial embossed on the leather.

'We are going to have a winning celebration come this November, and I'll be wearing these one-of-one Donald Trump-signed sneakers,' Sharf said after his win, in a video that went viral on social media.

Trump Douche.

…not a product, just an observation.

Trump gives a comment on the Nalvany sudden death syndrome accident and makes it about him.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... alny-death

That pee tape is paying off for Putin.

Carpet_pissr wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 11:14 am After all this time, no one has had the balls to tell him how to buy and wear a tie for appropriate for this century? Jesus.

I guess it's "proto-American" style, fittingly.

It's very intentional. He believes and has told interviewers that a long tie makes him look thinner (although of course it doesn't).

You'll notice that Trump sycophants appearing on stage with him make sure to lengthen their ties as well. It's the kind of obvious imitation last seen at the court of Louis XIV.

Holman wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 9:57 pm

Carpet_pissr wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 11:14 am After all this time, no one has had the balls to tell him how to buy and wear a tie for appropriate for this century? Jesus.

I guess it's "proto-American" style, fittingly.

It's very intentional. He believes and has told interviewers that a long tie makes him look thinner (although of course it doesn't).

You'll notice that Trump sycophants appearing on stage with him make sure to lengthen their ties as well. It's the kind of obvious imitation last seen at the court of Louis XIV.

...or the Camelot of JFK, which inspired men to stop wearing hats.

Kraken wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 10:10 pm

Holman wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 9:57 pm

Carpet_pissr wrote: ↑Mon Feb 19, 2024 11:14 am After all this time, no one has had the balls to tell him how to buy and wear a tie for appropriate for this century? Jesus.

I guess it's "proto-American" style, fittingly.

It's very intentional. He believes and has told interviewers that a long tie makes him look thinner (although of course it doesn't).

You'll notice that Trump sycophants appearing on stage with him make sure to lengthen their ties as well. It's the kind of obvious imitation last seen at the court of Louis XIV.

...or the Camelot of JFK, which inspired men to stop wearing hats.

I remember my FIL telling me how much he welcomed the end of hats in late 1950s NYC. His complaint was that "you always had to find somewhere to put the damn thing."

But yes, JFK definitely accelerated the end of hat-wearing, presumably because his hair was too good.

I saw where Orange Florida Man is telling his followers not to vote by mail. Every MAGA non-vote is a boon.

Again, for anyone contemplating not voting, or voting for someone other than Biden, this is what you're risking:Trump allies seek to infuse Christian nationalism into next Trump administration. Combined with Project 2025, it's going to be a really rough time for "out groups" if Trump wins.

It really sounds like Wilhoit's law writ large: "There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect."

Dogstar wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2024 10:35 am Again, for anyone contemplating not voting, or voting for someone other than Biden, this is what you're risking:Trump allies seek to infuse Christian nationalism into next Trump administration. Combined with Project 2025, it's going to be a really rough time for "out groups" if Trump wins.

It really sounds like Wilhoit's law writ large: "There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect."

Biden can’t win the electoral college in my opinion. He’s too old. Cause trump colors his hair the masses believe he’s not as old when he is.

At my work in my swing state most people are independent. They voted against trump proudly in 2016 and 2020 but if given a choice between trump and Biden they are choosing trump. Like Putin and nato they believe Biden said he’d only have one term and they feel cheated.

As for Wilholts law people of particular minorities already live this. With our new white supremacy party this won’t change - and rollbacks at the state level are likely. Going to back to the pre 1970 days when you could be arrested for having a condom in your wallet are coming back.

And as for what laws we do have the Supreme Court has already thrown out some of those laws.

Besides which Trump is already effectively president. He controls our border policy, our foreign policy and our defence policy and the policy on reproductive rights. Just a taster of what’s to come.

waitingtoconnect wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2024 4:37 pm At my work in my swing state most people are independent. They voted against trump proudly in 2016 and 2020 but if given a choice between trump and Biden they are choosing trump. Like Putin and nato they believe Biden said he’d only have one term and they feel cheated.

This is sarcasm, right? Because otherwise, I really have a hard time of wrapping my head around the thought of people voting for someone with <checks notes> all of Trump's flaws and the possibility of infusing some version of Christian nationalism / fascism into our government and invoking the Insurrection Act because <checks previous paragraph> a candidate ran for a second term, which would still be in compliance with all our existing laws and Constitutional restrictions.

BBC just had an article with Drumpf as worst president of all time, with Biden being the 14th or 15th best. No idea where they got their data or who they are quoting specifically.

My point is only that you have a choice between worst of all time, and someone in the top 50%. It's not really a choice, and I think anyone who thinks it is, is part of the problem.

The GOP is sick and broken. Drumpf is like the manifestation of all the cancerous symptoms. Who should be your next sitting president has never been clearer. "I don't like Biden so maybe Mussolini is the right answer" is hard to reconcile as a serious discussion.

But hey, vote your conscience. Whatever you think is best for the country. (that is both facetious and sincere).

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2024 3:57 pm But hey, vote your conscience. Whatever you think is best for the country. (that is both facetious and sincere).

I think that's the Drazzil way of voting...

Dogstar wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2024 3:48 pm

waitingtoconnect wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2024 4:37 pm At my work in my swing state most people are independent. They voted against trump proudly in 2016 and 2020 but if given a choice between trump and Biden they are choosing trump. Like Putin and nato they believe Biden said he’d only have one term and they feel cheated.

This is sarcasm, right? Because otherwise, I really have a hard time of wrapping my head around the thought of people voting for someone with <checks notes> all of Trump's flaws and the possibility of infusing some version of Christian nationalism / fascism into our government and invoking the Insurrection Act because <checks previous paragraph> a candidate ran for a second term, which would still be in compliance with all our existing laws and Constitutional restrictions.

Tragically no.
It’s because of a few factors I thinks . First is cost of living has been insane for people. Second is the whataboutism in the media including by even moderates like CNN, Bill Mayer and Jon Stewart. Third is not pressuring out allies to look after themselves more. In a cost of living crisis sending 100 billion to other countries upsets people. Fourth like Drazzil they see the system as broken as it is so trump will either fix it or break it so a new system emerges (that didn’t work in Brexit of course). Finally no one looks at truth social and the media has stopped covering trumps speeches so no one can see how insane he is. For a few of the very young ones it’s Israel’s invasion of Gaza.

Scaramucci puts it well even though I don’t like him. Even the unlikeables hate Trump. His theory is the citizens united case changed campaign financing and now both parties are now run for the billionaires. And people see that.



People are voting with their conscience. They are voting against the system not for trump. Even knowing what he will do in office even knowing it’s against their interests to vote in a man who petitioned the Supreme Court to give him absolute power which is more than the British kings we overthrew had (British monarchs in the 1770s had to answer to parliament).

Fine. Should turn out great. This is the perfect time to upset the apple cart, with consequences at an all time low.

I think the apples carts been upset enough!! We have had trump. He should have been in the rear view mirror by now… and we should have imprisoned him on one of his golf courses to make sure before speeding off.

Anyone who isn’t mega wealthy like Elon musk is going to be sorry if he wins.

I didn’t think anyone would be stupid enough to vote for Brexit but they did and when they did the extremists implemented their version of Brexit and people got no say in what relationship they wanted with Europe. Now they regret it.

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2024 3:57 pm BBC just had an article with Drumpf as worst president of all time, with Biden being the 14th or 15th best. No idea where they got their data or who they are quoting specifically.

154 presidential specialists who are current and recent members of the American Political Science Association.

It's quite obvious why trump belongs at or near the bottom, but I'm surprised to see Obama rocket up to 7th place. Other than passing the American Care Act -- certainly a very big deal -- he was largely a status quo manager, not the transformative figure that I expected when I voted for him. Biden, OTOH, has effectively reversed 40 years of supply side economics and delivered a solid, healthy economy. I expected Biden to be a caretaker and he turned out to be transformative. Surprise!

I'm sure any historian will tell you that it's hard to rate the incumbent; history requires perspective, and at the very least a completed presidency. I expect Biden to crack the top 10 in future surveys, especially if Democrats can retain sufficient power to prevent their gains from being overturned.

Carter, one of the MAGA candidates for worst president ever sits comfortably at 22.

I think it’s time we revealed ourselves. We go in cute without revealing our true policies then once elected we run things with iron tentacles but only for a day. Obviously the first executive order needs to be to rescind the constitutional right to Tako Sunomono to end the two tier culinary system that favours humans.

gilraen wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2024 4:06 pm

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2024 3:57 pm But hey, vote your conscience. Whatever you think is best for the country. (that is both facetious and sincere).

I think that's the Drazzil way of voting...

Carpet_pissr wrote: ↑Thu Feb 22, 2024 9:30 am

gilraen wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2024 4:06 pm

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2024 3:57 pm But hey, vote your conscience. Whatever you think is best for the country. (that is both facetious and sincere).

I think that's the Drazzil way of voting...

Where the hell is Drazill these days.

He got frazziled and left.

Or, more to the point, we kept calling him on his bullshit until he realized that it wasn't working anymore.

waitingtoconnect wrote:

Dogstar wrote: ↑Wed Feb 21, 2024 3:48 pm

waitingtoconnect wrote: ↑Tue Feb 20, 2024 4:37 pm At my work in my swing state most people are independent. They voted against trump proudly in 2016 and 2020 but if given a choice between trump and Biden they are choosing trump. Like Putin and nato they believe Biden said he’d only have one term and they feel cheated.

This is sarcasm, right? Because otherwise, I really have a hard time of wrapping my head around the thought of people voting for someone with <checks notes> all of Trump's flaws and the possibility of infusing some version of Christian nationalism / fascism into our government and invoking the Insurrection Act because <checks previous paragraph> a candidate ran for a second term, which would still be in compliance with all our existing laws and Constitutional restrictions.

Tragically no.
It’s because of a few factors I thinks . First is cost of living has been insane for people. Second is the whataboutism in the media including by even moderates like CNN, Bill Mayer and Jon Stewart. Third is not pressuring out allies to look after themselves more. In a cost of living crisis sending 100 billion to other countries upsets people. Fourth like Drazzil they see the system as broken as it is so trump will either fix it or break it so a new system emerges (that didn’t work in Brexit of course). Finally no one looks at truth social and the media has stopped covering trumps speeches so no one can see how insane he is. For a few of the very young ones it’s Israel’s invasion of Gaza.

Scaramucci puts it well even though I don’t like him. Even the unlikeables hate Trump. His theory is the citizens united case changed campaign financing and now both parties are now run for the billionaires. And people see that.



People are voting with their conscience. They are voting against the system not for trump. Even knowing what he will do in office even knowing it’s against their interests to vote in a man who petitioned the Supreme Court to give him absolute power which is more than the British kings we overthrew had (British monarchs in the 1770s had to answer to parliament).

Funny thing is that ALL 4 items are mostly a direct result of GOP policy, tho since Clinton, the Dems have leaned into some as well, and Biden has been doing some work to kill the worst effects (e. g. he's probably done more to address the growth monopoly power than any president in 50 years, even if that's just a beginning, and not a lot yet - ditto trying to fund and modernize the IRS).

For me also it’s about the rise of individuality over communities. Which is what Reagan preached. Ultimately the collapse of true conservatism embodied by men like Eisenhower started with Nixon in the 1960s and was replaced with Christofacism over time.

The collapse of true conservatism is not just a US issue, it’s the same in the Uk, France, Europe and Australia. The Christofacist movement is multinational.

Take the UK the Tory party got power in 2010 or thereabouts and has gone from a normal party to a Maga style party in about 15 years. The results have been disastrous for the economy, for the countries prestige and for the quality of day to day life.

Or India. Where the BJP party actively seeks to game the system in their favour . The judicial system has been weaponised and tv stations and opposition parties are often tax audited and taken over destroying Indias formally multiparty democracy like Putin destroyed russias.

Thats what a trump second term would do to us. It’s their actual policies they are taking to the election!

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Sun Feb 11, 2024 5:13 pm "signed and was responsible for"
What does that mean? All he did was not veto the bill. He wasn't responsible for it.

Here's about 100% of the work he put in on this bill: sat his dumb ass down for a photo op with Kid "Confederate Flag" Rock before having lunch with Kanye "Antisemite" West.


Non-stop bullshit from this guy.

You just don't understand.
If something good happened it's because Trump made it happen.
If something bad happened Biden or Obama made it happen.
Examples.
The wheel. Trump
The Model T. Obama or Biden.

Mavity. Trump.
Dropping apples on peoples heads. O or B

It's rrally very si.ple to under.

So, serbians have been swatting Biden admin officials?

https://www.rawstory.com/swatting/

I had no idea where to put this, so I submitted it here