Immigration Policy

[hepcat]

No worries. I probably sounded like I was being snarky anyway.

[El Guapo]

BS. There's no way that she's spoken to African-Americans.

[hepcat]

What have I missed

the mark.

Considering his relationship with Putin, he should probably avoid using terms like "Red Wave".

[Enough]

BS. There's no way that she's spoken to African-Americans.

The "gosh" is a dead giveaway she is likely lying through her teeth. A true, "yeah, that's the ticket" moment.

[YellowKing]

The condition of the detention centers is a straw man. People were protesting the separation of kids from their parents. The conditions of the detention centers was just gravy on the side. They could put the kids up at the Four Seasons for all I care, it still doesn't make it right.

[geezer]

Better yet, why are all the conservatives who tried to impeach Clinton over a blowjob in full support of a guy who cheated and paid off multiple women including a porn star?

No Republican ever has the right to say anything about anything ever again.

I don't think it was so much having an affair as taking advantage of a teenage intern. Then of course there is the numerous sexual assault accusations.

Teenage?

Rip just makes crap up when he runs out of rebuttals. It’s a Trumpy’s thing.

Regardless of whether you was a teenager or not, Rip is right. If Clinton had been CEO of any Fortune 500 company in the US, he would have been fired. That's not to say Republicans haven't been hypocritical about supporting Trump while claiming to be the party of "family values", but that's not relevant to what happened here.

You think that, in 1995, if the CEO of a Fortune 500 company had a consensual relationship with a 24 year old female intern he would have been brought up before the board of directors and fired?

Certainly. I had sexual harassment training that far back and one of the things mentioned that was proscribed was having romantic involvement with someone that directly worked for you. It's an abuse of power because you can never be sure the relationship is consensual. I remember an exec at a major company that did something very similar in the same time frame and he was canned. i also remember that as being of the arguments at the time.

“The C.E.O. of a corporation wouldn’t have had time to pack up his briefcase before he was fired for this,” says Barbara Ledeen, executive director for policy at the Independent Women’s Forum, the Washington-based group that has achieved a certain cachet for its condemnations of traditional feminism.

Of course there was sexual harassment training then - I remember it as well, and I was nowhere near the C suite back in those days. Nevertheless, while my evidence is only as anecdotal as yours is, the buildup of frustration leading to the existence of #metoo and the stories I've heard, and know of firsthand, tell me that the number of men in corporate positions of authority that were regularly disciplined for nominally consensual relationships was likely minuscule, considering the lack of men who were disciplined for actual blatant harassment.

As for the quote from the Independent Women's Forum, if one was looking at their website, their examples of "modern feminists," or their condemnations of "traditional feminism" one might come to the conclusion that their opinions on how Bill Clinton should be viewed ought to be examined with an eye toward potential bias.

[GreenGoo]

The condition of the detention centers is a straw man. People were protesting the separation of kids from their parents. The conditions of the detention centers was just gravy on the side. They could put the kids up at the Four Seasons for all I care, it still doesn't make it right.

Thanks and quite true. They will literally try anything to derail and change the narrative. It's disgusting.

[Holman]

link

NEW: Trump autographed photos of deceased crime victims for today's White House 'Angel Families' event

There were 11 photos total being held up by family members who had lost loved ones, and all of the photos bore Trump's unmistakably scrawled signature in large-tipped black pen.

Autographing the photos was an unusual decision, in that it appeared to combine the celebrity element of an autograph with the solemn image of a dead loved one.

It was unclear whether the photos had been produced by the White House, when the president autographed them, or whether this was done at the families' request. The White House did not immediately respond to a request for comment on the photos.

From CNN:

"These are the American citizens permanently separated from their loved ones. The word permanently being the word that you have to think about. Permanently. They are not separated for a day or two days. Permanently separated," Trump said, seeking to cast a contrast between grieving families and the crisis on the border that has captured the nation's attention and prompted his administration to hastily craft an executive order.

All analyses I've ever seen states that undocumented immigrants commit crimes at a lower rate than citizens. This is scapegoating worthy of Goebbels.

"Angel families." Jesus.

They got autographs, though. That's great.

[em2nought]

What have I missed

the mark.

I've also missed that little thing called "notifications" at the top of this page until now. Much easier to keep track of where the hell I've been. lmao

[Isgrimnur]

"Angel families." Jesus.

"Gold star" was already taken.

[YellowKing]

Let's give Trump the benefit of the doubt and say that the families of the deceased asked him to autograph those photos (why the hell anyone would want that I don't know, but bear with me).

From a pure optics standpoint, doesn't an autograph give the impression that Trump is taking responsibility for their deaths? I mean, ordinarily an autograph on something besides a picture of yourself implies you created it, or it is some memento directly connected to you.

For someone who is supposedly a "media genius" he sure is terrible at it.

[LordMortis]

They got autographs, though. That's great.

What are they? Trump collector set?

[Holman]

This event gets more and more gross the more you look at it. Trump's people actually designed an event to highlight that some families (victims of immigrant crime) have suffered "permanent separation" as opposed to the merely temporary separation we're seeing at the border.

In other words, "Quit complaining about what I've done to immigrants because some immigrants have done worse!"

It's toddler logic, if even that. Most of all it's about whipping up hate, pure and simple.

[hepcat]

He’s a repugnant stain on humanity and always has been. They don’t make ‘em any sleazier.

[GreenGoo]

He’s a repugnant stain on humanity and always has been. They don’t make ‘em any sleazier.

Agreed.

Even stranger is that the children separated have every sign of being separated forever as well. They can't even find them, there is no plan to return them to their family, they are lost to the system.

[$iljanus]

He’s a repugnant stain on humanity and always has been. They don’t make ‘em any sleazier.

Agreed.

Even stranger is that the children separated have every sign of being separated forever as well. They can't even find them, there is no plan to return them to their family, they are lost to the system.

No backsies!

(and that's about the level of forethought in the people in power regarding this entire shameful clusterfuck)

[Sepiche]

...

By Wednesday morning, the president had become convinced that he needed a way to calm the criticism, according to people familiar with the discussions, and he felt confident that Republicans in Congress would push through immigration legislation ending the family separation practice — so he might as well get ahead of it. A vote on the measure was eventually postponed until next week, but it does not appear to have enough votes to pass.

In private conversations with aides, Trump said he wanted to sign a full immigration bill as part of an executive order, which one administration official described as “a pretty insane idea.” The president was told by government lawyers that he could not change immigration law by fiat, said a person familiar with the discussions.

Trump then demanded that an executive order be written that would end child detentions in cages, and said he wanted it on his desk for signing by that afternoon, according to people involved in the discussions.

Given hours to produce a complex legal document, government lawyers crafted one that met the moment’s political demands but only added to confusion within the agencies tasked with implementing it.

[Unagi]

Such a hectic schedule we fiscal conservatives have. Just got back from my Klan rally

I think you forgot what fiscal means, or you are just trying to take cover.

[Unagi]

Better yet, why are all the conservatives who tried to impeach Clinton over a blowjob in full support of a guy who cheated and paid off multiple women including a porn star?

No Republican ever has the right to say anything about anything ever again.

I don't think it was so much having an affair as taking advantage of a teenage intern. Then of course there is the numerous sexual assault accusations.

Teenage?

Rip just makes crap up when he runs out of rebuttals. It’s a Trumpy’s thing.

Regardless of whether you was a teenager or not, Rip is right. If Clinton had been CEO of any Fortune 500 company in the US, he would have been fired. That's not to say Republicans haven't been hypocritical about supporting Trump while claiming to be the party of "family values", but that's not relevant to what happened here.

Rip was trying to make it sound like Clinton took advantage of a child. And I think you know that.

Please check your reading comprehension, I'll quote myself for you and bold it:

Regardless of whether she was a teenager or not, Rip is right.

I wasn't condoning his analogy but I was supporting his conclusion, because the age of the person involved was irrelevant to a certain extent.

RIP isn't right.

RIP wrote that in a rebuttal to an argument and it failed in THAT SENSE. Your only comment was that RIP was right, and he wasn't. Hepcat was correct, in that RIP tried to say this was about a teenager, and YOU have already defended that more than RIP has. (EDIT: that reads harsher than I meant it, but even RIP hasn't come back to admit he over stated that)

anyhow - - RIP is not right :: Bill Clinton's impeachment IS NOT something people that have given Trump a pass can ever speak of again - and those 'people' have nothing if they are not shitting all over Trump right now, and they are NOT.

RIP was not right, in any sense, accept that Bill Clinton abused his position and probably landed a young woman he wouldn't have normally... but honestly - that's debatable, but I wouldn't debate it.

[$iljanus]

Beyond going to rallies and being in perpetual campaign mode the asshat in the Oval Office shows no interest in learning the nuances of governance, not even bothering to work with his own party as he throws up his hands like a child abruptly quitting a board game and knocking over the pieces saying don’t even bother working on an immigration bill until after the midterm elections.

In the meantime chaos reigns as various agencies try to interpret his intentions and his faithful will chalk it all up to government incompetence rather than the shortsightedness of a thin skinned man who really doesn’t seem to want to understand what the job is all about.

But it’s happening to brown folks so under a cold political calculus will it really matter in the end when good white Americans go to the polls and maintain the status quo?

[Unagi]

your tl;dr signature seemed to be part of the post.... IMO

[$iljanus]

your tl;dr signature seemed to be part of the post.... IMO

Oh, I guess I should give the advice about semen top billing then....

[Rip]

Ok, she was three years past being a teenager. Doesn't change big picture much. I would have felt much differently about it had she been 19 instead of 22.

[gbasden]

But it’s happening to brown folks so under a cold political calculus will it really matter in the end when good white Americans go to the polls and maintain the status quo?

It's become painfully clear that this administration and a large percentage of his followers hold brown people in contempt and couldn't care less what happens to them.

[em2nought]

But it’s happening to brown folks so under a cold political calculus will it really matter in the end when good white Americans go to the polls and maintain the status quo?

It's become painfully clear that this administration and a large percentage of his followers hold brown people in contempt and couldn't care less what happens to them.

The best thing about Trump is that he has exposed just how unhinged you folks have become. What's crystal clear is that your party wishes to keep brown people on the proverbial plantation, and is willing to use them like toilet paper to further your globalization agenda. Why do y'all seem to hate your parents so much? It's now evident to everyone on the other side that there can be no compromising with the left.

[Holman]

The best thing about Trump is that he has exposed just how unhinged

proverbial plantation

globalization agenda

there can be no compromising with the left

[$iljanus]

But it’s happening to brown folks so under a cold political calculus will it really matter in the end when good white Americans go to the polls and maintain the status quo?

It's become painfully clear that this administration and a large percentage of his followers hold brown people in contempt and couldn't care less what happens to them.

The best thing about Trump is that he has exposed just how unhinged you folks have become. What's crystal clear is that your party wishes to keep brown people on the proverbial plantation, and is willing to use them like toilet paper to further your globalization agenda. Why do y'all seem to hate your parents so much? It's now evident to everyone on the other side that there can be no compromising with the left.

Damn those crafty Democrats and their liberal lapdogs, putting kids in caged camps and separating families...My God! Just like the plantation days of yore! Mine eyes are truly opened!

[Alefroth]

But it’s happening to brown folks so under a cold political calculus will it really matter in the end when good white Americans go to the polls and maintain the status quo?

It's become painfully clear that this administration and a large percentage of his followers hold brown people in contempt and couldn't care less what happens to them.

The best thing about Trump is that he has exposed just how unhinged you folks have become. What's crystal clear is that your party wishes to keep brown people on the proverbial plantation, and is willing to use them like toilet paper to further your globalization agenda. Why do y'all seem to hate your parents so much? It's now evident to everyone on the other side that there can be no compromising with the left.

Womp womp.

[hepcat]

The best thing about Trump

Anyway, I do appreciate that Trump has shown us who his followers are. There’s a reason you refer to yourself as “red”. Now we know why, comrade.

[gbasden]

But it’s happening to brown folks so under a cold political calculus will it really matter in the end when good white Americans go to the polls and maintain the status quo?

It's become painfully clear that this administration and a large percentage of his followers hold brown people in contempt and couldn't care less what happens to them.

The best thing about Trump is that he has exposed just how unhinged you folks have become. What's crystal clear is that your party wishes to keep brown people on the proverbial plantation, and is willing to use them like toilet paper to further your globalization agenda. Why do y'all seem to hate your parents so much? It's now evident to everyone on the other side that there can be no compromising with the left.

I'd like to say that's funny, but holy hell is that just nuts. Talk about unhinged. Although I will agree that it shows that cooperation with Trumpists is most likely impossible.

[hepcat]

It’s easier just to troll him back.

Although I will admit I’m still scratching my head trying to figure out how one furthers globalization with toilet paper.

Analogies aren’t em’s strongpoint.

[$iljanus]

Although I will admit I’m still scratching my head trying to figure out how one furthers globalization with toilet paper.

Analogies aren’t em’s strongpoint.

It's just another move in the Illuminati's grand plan. Do you want to know more...?

[Isgrimnur]

The toilet paper industry is being held back by splinter protection laws.

[Defiant]

Sigh... Must be a day ending in y.

[Smoove_B]

I feel like we're about 6 months away from these thinly veiled dog-whistle Twitter rants turning into full-blown undeniable racists statements from the President.

[Kraken]

I feel like we're about 6 months away from these thinly veiled dog-whistle Twitter rants turning into full-blown undeniable racists statements from the President.

One can hope. 75% of Americans think immigration is a good thing.

“Americans’ strong belief that immigration is a good thing for the country and that immigration levels shouldn’t be decreased present the president and Congress with some tough decisions as the midterm elections loom,” Gallup said in a news release Thursday.

Despite the contentious political climate, 75 percent of Americans think immigration, in general, is good for the nation, according to Gallup, which surveyed more than 1,500 adults during the first two weeks of June.

Among Democrats and those who lean toward the party, 85 percent viewed immigration positively, compared with 65 percent of Republicans and those who lean Republican.

When asked their thoughts about “legal immigration” specifically, even more Americans, about 84 percent, said it was good for the country.

Support for reining in immigration is at its lowest level in more than half a century: Just 29 percent of Americans believe it should be decreased, the smallest share recorded by Gallup since at least 1965.

By all means, O Great Trumpkin, keep marketing to the other 25%.

[Moliere]

Behind the Criminal Immigration Law: Eugenics and White Supremacy

The president didn’t specify which law he was talking about. But the statute at the center of his administration’s policy is the work of Republicans — with origins dating back all the way to World War I — albeit with substantial Democratic support along the way. Known originally as the “Undesirable Aliens Act,” the statute would not exist without support from, respectively, a eugenicist and a white supremacist.

The law in question was the foundation of a memo Attorney General Jeff Sessions issued in early April that laid out the administration’s new, zero-tolerance policy. In the memo, Sessions instructed federal prosecutors in the southwestern United States to file criminal charges against any adults caught entering the country illegally. His order stripped officials of discretion over whether to place migrant families seeking asylum into civil proceedings, which allow families to stay together. (Court rulings limit how long the government can detain migrants in civil proceedings. There’s also no guarantee they’ll return for future hearing dates once they’re let out, a phenomenon that has prompted the president’s complaints about “catch and release.”)
...
In May 1918, after the U.S. had entered World War I, Congress passed a statute called the Passport Act that gave the president the power to restrict the comings and goings of foreign citizens during wartime. A few months later, however, the war ended — and with it, the restrictions on border crossings.

Federal officials saw potential in the criminal provisions of the Passport Act — a maximum 20-year sentence — as a tool for deterring immigration. So prosecutors ignored the expiration of the law and continued to indict migrants under the Passport Act for unlawful entry into the U.S.

Anti-immigration sentiment continued to climb and the rhetoric of the era has resonance today. One anti-immigration group at the time claimed that immigrants tended to be “vicious and criminal” — the “bootleggers, gangsters, and racketeers of large cities.” The war, Columbia University historian Mae Ngai has written, “raised nationalism and anti-foreign sentiment to a high pitch.”

[GreenGoo]

Does the word "respectively" work there? It seems to me that you use respectively when corresponding 2 pairs of things. As for the article, I'm bored about hearing how the administration is racist.

No.

Shit.

[Pyperkub]

Better yet, why are all the conservatives who tried to impeach Clinton over a blowjob in full support of a guy who cheated and paid off multiple women including a porn star?

No Republican ever has the right to say anything about anything ever again.

I don't think it was so much having an affair as taking advantage of a teenage intern. Then of course there is the numerous sexual assault accusations.

Teenage?

Rip just makes crap up when he runs out of rebuttals. It’s a Trumpy’s thing.

Regardless of whether you was a teenager or not, Rip is right. If Clinton had been CEO of any Fortune 500 company in the US, he would have been fired. That's not to say Republicans haven't been hypocritical about supporting Trump while claiming to be the party of "family values", but that's not relevant to what happened here.

You think that, in 1995, if the CEO of a Fortune 500 company had a consensual relationship with a 24 year old female intern he would have been brought up before the board of directors and fired?

The answer to this is 100% no.

1. This was only discovered because of the whitewater investigation and the power the special counsel had. It never would have come up.
2. Even if somehow it did, Name a single CEO who was fired for this kind of behavior in the 90's. It would be covered up and made to go away.
3. Look at Fox News this decade, dozens of confidential settlements, lots of cover ups, nobody fired until it became public, and only because of unwanted harassment, nothing consensual at all.

[Daehawk]

George Takei makes Trump reach for extra toilet paper

Co-founder of women for trump doesn;t know her facts